Desire S "Grip of Death"

[JonathonDesmond]

I've got a brand new Desire S and I love it. Fast, smooth, responsive. Battery life (OK, over my total 2 days of ownership only!) has been brilliant - 9% drop overnight for example.

I'm about to return it.

Why? Because of one thing that makes it almost unusable.

I am, of course, referring to the "Grip of Death" - as per the iPhone 4.

There are a few oblique references to this on the net, but I can't find any detailed posts.

Some mention has been made about this only being a WiFi issue, and it is true that WiFi is badly affected. However I also see 3G signal drops when I hold the phone in portrait mode with my hand wrapping around the base (as most people would in normal "phone" use) - which is, of course, where the antenna is (incorporated into the battery cover)

The WiFi drops on mine are tragic - I can be 3 metres from an access point and if you hold the phone incorrectly (!) the WiFi signal drops out completely and you are on 3G data. Even if directly under the AP you can easily get the signal indicator to drop from full to under 50%.

However the 3G drops are also bad. In my flat, which has a good signal, I can get to one or zero bars of 3G signal just by picking up the phone.

So I have a phone that is unreliable in picking up calls, switches to 3G data when there is a perfectly good AP just nearby, and is basically, generally unreliable.

It's a shame because, apart from this, it's a brilliant little device.

Am I the only one affected this badly? Maybe I have a poor example?

I have a case arriving today to see if it will help. Otherwise it's back to the shop!

[kartkk]

hmm..you are the first person to report a drop in 3g signal
can any one else confirm this?
or is it just that the OP got a defective unit?
(i am unable to test as i still dont have my device yet :( )

[colgate13]

I'm wondering if only certain phones are affected. Engadget doesn't mention it and this review specifically says it isn't a problem (http://www.smartphonegurus.com/forums/topic/13182-review-htc-desire-s-o2/page__view__findpost__p__128679). It is a mixed bag of responses from posters here. Is it possible that Techradar got an early review model and the problem has since been fixed? You think HTC would comment one way or another since this could affect sales.

[TheUndutchable]

Just tried it on my DS, but the death grip does not influence my 3G signal.

With wifi on, I manage to lose only a little bit of signal while holding it in such an unnatural way that it will never occur using it normally.

[kartkk]

Just tried it on my DS, but the death grip does not influence my 3G signal.

With wifi on, I manage to lose only a little bit of signal while holding it in such an unnatural way that it will never occur using it normally.

can you try covering the back of your device as much as you can with your hands & test the wifi & 3g signal?
it would be very helpful for us

[TheUndutchable]

Covered the back as much as I could, no problems with 3G, Wifi drops to zero...

[kartkk]

Covered the back as much as I could, no problems with 3G, Wifi drops to zero...
i am relived that there is no 3g signal drop
the wifi part is a bit depressing but i can manage without wifi...(but hope they fix it somehow)

@JonathonDesmond i think you got a defective unit try returning it for a new piece
& also tell us if the case helped

[TheUndutchable]

[QUOTE=kartkk;12918670]i am relived that there is no 3g signal drop
the wifi part is a bit depressing but i can manage without wifi...(but hope they fix it somehow)

You will never hold the phone like I did when using the phone normally. I pressed some buttons with my nose :D

[kartkk]

You will never hold the phone like I did when using the phone normally. I pressed some buttons with my nose :D

lol
but i hope htc does something like give replacement battery covers which fix the issue..because that is the only hardware defect that people are exaggerating about..

[fallenguru]

Ok, a few tests, as long as I still have it:

Portrait mode:
No issues in normal one- or two-handed operation.
As soon as something, e. g. my hand, covers the top plastic part at the back the wifi signal goes from all bars down to the dot, or disconnects entirely. I'm not so sure about the mobile signal, some of the time it drops to about half the bars it's had before, but with a considerable delay, and it's a bit erratic at the best of times, so it might just as well be other (environmental) causes.

Landscape:
I really only do this two-handed, with the left hand holding the phone, fingers bunched behind it, thumb in front, covering the HTC logo and first few mm of the screen; the right hand operates and/or stabilizes the phone.
This instantly kills the wifi stone cold dead. 3G actually stayed the same or got better(!)

To sum up: wifi is badly affected to the point of uselessness, 3G doesn't seem to be.

[kartkk]

hmm..
can you try the wifi again in landscape? this time without touching the aluminum part of the phone?
(dont cover the aluminum part with your hand or any other item)

[fallenguru]

can you try the wifi again in landscape? this time without touching the aluminum part of the phone?
Actually, I don't see how that would be possible? Covering the top plastic part without covering anything else, I mean. I tried a few contortions and nearly dropped it. :-)
Care to elaborate?

[kartkk]

it is a bit tricky i know (dont drop your phone trying lol)
how about putting on top of two books?(such that the books only touch the plastic :D)
i just want to know if it is the metal chassis which is causing this problem

[fallenguru]

Good thinking! :cool:

Desire S propped up on two stacks of books so that nothing touches the alu parts: all bars. (It did drop one bar from time to time, but that's just normal fluctuations, whereas putting it down on a desk or something reliably takes it down a notch.)

[mariu$]

please people contact htc

[fallenguru]

please people contact htc Why? We arent't their QA department and I've no hopes of getting more than ... err ... yes, "You're holding it wrong." in soothing customer rep speak. Raising awareness of the issue is the best one can do, IMHO - once the tech mainstream press picks this up there's at least a chance of a fix. (That is, if one is actually possible, it might be a concession to the design.)

[E-Tech]

Why? We arent't their QA department and I've no hopes of getting more than ... err ... yes, "You're holding it wrong." in soothing customer rep speak. Raising awareness of the issue is the best one can do, IMHO - once the tech mainstream press picks this up there's at least a chance of a fix. (That is, if one is actually possible, it might be a concession to the design.)

i'm in contact whit the HTC Dutch support desk. After a view mails whit the 1st line of support they send me to the technical support.

It looks like that they are doing there job.

[ignited]

i tried and tried and tried again... i couldnt find any sings of the grip of death!!

[kartkk]

Good thinking! :cool:

Desire S propped up on two stacks of books so that nothing touches the alu parts: all bars. (It did drop one bar from time to time, but that's just normal fluctuations, whereas putting it down on a desk or something reliably takes it down a notch.)

just as i thought it is the metal chasis....
i have heard that wifi has problems passing through metal...
if this really is the reason then i think nothing much can be done:( ...
can someone else also verify this?

[shanz]

just got phone and wifi definitely drops when held landscape

[JonathonDesmond]

I just put mine in a Desire case for the time being (waiting on Desire S cases!)

This has helped; it makes a difference to the attenuation and the phone now remains usable on both 3G and WiFi in my flat.

It's a plastic case and I am thinking the posters who say the problem is related to direct physical contact are onto something.

JD

[mariu$]

Why? We arent't their QA department and I've no hopes of getting more than ... err ... yes, "You're holding it wrong." in soothing customer rep speak. Raising awareness of the issue is the best one can do, IMHO - once the tech mainstream press picks this up there's at least a chance of a fix. (That is, if one is actually possible, it might be a concession to the design.)

because they need to correct their mistake and media doesnt give a fak

i tried and tried and tried again... i couldnt find any sings of the grip of death!!

i is possible that youre so lucky?
place your phone on your knee and see if the signal drops
or try to cover the upper plastic and press

[RogerPodacter]

I've got a brand new Desire S and I love it. Fast, smooth, responsive. Battery life (OK, over my total 2 days of ownership only!) has been brilliant - 9% drop overnight for example.

I'm about to return it.

Why? Because of one thing that makes it almost unusable.

I am, of course, referring to the "Grip of Death" - as per the iPhone 4.

There are a few oblique references to this on the net, but I can't find any detailed posts.

Some mention has been made about this only being a WiFi issue, and it is true that WiFi is badly affected. However I also see 3G signal drops when I hold the phone in portrait mode with my hand wrapping around the base (as most people would in normal "phone" use) - which is, of course, where the antenna is (incorporated into the battery cover)

The WiFi drops on mine are tragic - I can be 3 metres from an access point and if you hold the phone incorrectly (!) the WiFi signal drops out completely and you are on 3G data. Even if directly under the AP you can easily get the signal indicator to drop from full to under 50%.

However the 3G drops are also bad. In my flat, which has a good signal, I can get to one or zero bars of 3G signal just by picking up the phone.

So I have a phone that is unreliable in picking up calls, switches to 3G data when there is a perfectly good AP just nearby, and is basically, generally unreliable.

It's a shame because, apart from this, it's a brilliant little device.

Am I the only one affected this badly? Maybe I have a poor example?

I have a case arriving today to see if it will help. Otherwise it's back to the shop!

Well the nexus one antenna is located in the bottom, just like every HTC phone the last few years. And I can drop the signal completely just by holding and covering the antenna. But it sounds like the desire s is a bit more sensitive than most regarding signal attenuation, especially with wifi. But its not abnormal.

[kartkk]

I just put mine in a Desire case for the time being (waiting on Desire S cases!)

This has helped; it makes a difference to the attenuation and the phone now remains usable on both 3G and WiFi in my flat.

It's a plastic case and I am thinking the posters who say the problem is related to direct physical contact are onto something.

JD


is there still any reduction in wifi signal?if so how man bars does it drop?
has anyone else tried using a plastic case?

[E-Tech]

I just put mine in a Desire case for the time being (waiting on Desire S cases!)

This has helped; it makes a difference to the attenuation and the phone now remains usable on both 3G and WiFi in my flat.

It's a plastic case and I am thinking the posters who say the problem is related to direct physical contact are onto something.

JD

HTC have a TPU Case does have a case for the Desire S only not sure if it help.

htcaccessorystore.com/uk/p_htc_item.aspx?i=217322

srry for the link can't do it yet...

I do have a Case-mate case for the Desire S and it helps very little for the wifi signal.

[E-Tech]

crap missed that it will come out on april 30

[shanz]

crap missed that it will come out on april 30

what comes out on april 30th?

[kartkk]

what comes out on april 30th?
i think he is referring to this case
http://www.htcaccessorystore.com/uk/p_htc_item.aspx?i=217322
(its available from 3rd may)

i think it is worth a try as its made of TPU

[JonathonDesmond]

is there still any reduction in wifi signal?if so how man bars does it drop?
has anyone else tried using a plastic case?

There is still attenuation, just less of it. For example, without a case if I am lying on my bed (3.5M and 2 walls from my AP) holding the phone in landscape I would be dropping off the WiFi and onto 3G constantly. With the case I have to cup the phone in both hands quite unnaturally (now, now!) to get the WiFi to drop. Previously I used an iPhone 3GS that had no issues at all of this sort.

In regards to 3G signal I can be a bit more scientific thanks to the phones built in signal strength meter. Obviously any wireless signal fluctuates but this is what I see happening to the 3G signal:
1) Holding the phone carefully by the top (so there is no meat in the way of the 3G antenna): -88 to -93 dbm
2) Holding the cased phone by the bottom in a "natural" grip: -97 to -101 dbm
3) Holding the uncased phone by the bottom in a natural grip: -105 to -113 dbm

(I'm right-handed so all these measures were taken this morning holding the phone carefully in position with my left hand thumb and forefinger on the top front and back, using my right as the test control; the phone was kept in about the same location give or take a cm or so - I wasn't waltzing around my flat while doing this, or anything like that!!)

The case I am using for the time being is a Casemate Desire-sized "Barely There" case. It maybe adds 1mm spacing to the phone-hand gap and so obviously decreases the capacitive coupling across the phone to meat barrier.

Thinking that the degree of physical separation may be a factor (as you would expect) I have tested using a piece of paper (very thin) as insulating material.... this gives a result very similar to the that of using the casemate case. It is probably statistically slightly worse (as you would expect with increased coupling) but still better than direct contact.

I have conducted the above tests several times in several different locations and although the absolute signal strengths obviously vary the relative drops do not.

Obviously any phone suffers when a conductive foreign object is in the vicinity of the antenna. That's not an issue. What is an issue for me is that the Desire S seems to have an additional issue when direct contact is a factor - as per the iPhone 4. This, at least in my tests, is sufficent to account for my initial problems using the device and can be alleiviated by using a non-conductive case to prevent direct contact.

Conclusion (at least for me): Get a plastic case for the Desire S and hopefully be happier with the phone. Only time will tell!

[norocel]

You definayelly have a faulty phone,mine has no such problems,i even covered the whole phone,the only loss i could have done 1 line from wifi.better send it to warranty? This is not something to live with.

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA Premium App

[mariu$]

norocel where did you buy it from?

[E-Tech]

i think he is referring to this case
http://www.htcaccessorystore.com/uk/p_htc_item.aspx?i=217322
(its available from 3rd may)

i think it is worth a try as its made of TPU

yea that one i did referring too but in the Netherlands it will be out on april 30

[IMI7]

HI
I JUST BOUGHT THE PHONE HTC DESIRE and having the same issue bad signal drops like no other phones, I have work mates who are on orange,o2 everyone has strong signal except for me sent back to orange, I thought phone is faulty will let you guys know when i get the next phone,brillant phone but if this is a issue is unusable! am going contact htc . keep posted guys

[Ziplock9000]

I just got my Desire S today and this issue is massive. If I hold the phone with the tips of my fingers at the top i get 5 bar. If i grip the bottom in my palm like normal it drops to 1 bar instantly. I can repeat this over and over again. This is very worrying.

The reason I found this thread is because my brand new phone has to be rebooted to lock on to wifi and even 3g signals. This needs to be dont sometimes after an hour.. This is a MASSIVE problem..But as pointed out, I'm not sure HTC will do anything other than say I'm holding it wrong /sigh

[GideonB234]

I only have this issue with the death grip when I am at home on wifi, might be a defective phone?

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[InfernalByte]

Wifi use microwave energy? It doesn't even know your hand exists, it'll pass right through something with so little mass.

[kartkk]

Wifi use microwave energy? It doesn't even know your hand exists, it'll pass right through something with so little mass.

oh really??

no it won't ,it will get attenuated

[ben_pyett]

I only have this issue with the death grip when I am at home on wifi, might be a defective phone?

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

No I doubt it, as sounds like your problem its identical to all of ours, there its some light at the end off the tunnel though, once you apply the software soff (which should be released very soon) and get root and apply custom roms then the wifi fix does reduce this issue

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA Premium App

[skyfall007]

Remember Legend?

Almost the same construction with DS aslo got this issue

But my DS's wifi is not that weak as Legend

Maybe HTC fix somehow?

[yanic123]

try as I might, I fail to make my Desire S stop working. Ive tried landscape and portrait and cannot diminish my wifi signal below 3 bars by death gripping it.

Connecting to a Virgin super hub wifi access point.

Very happy desire S owner here.

[yungyeh]

As I know, the case itself is an antenna. You will need to close the cap in order to gain a better reception.

Now, here is the problem. If you look at the battery case, you will find two snips of copper at the bottom left. So the mobile wireless signal will significant affect if your palm cover on the left bottom area.

The design of the case makes HTC Desire S is only for Right-Hand person!

Here is a few possible solution:

1. Make sure the battery cap is closed properly.
2. Hold the phone with you RIGHT hand.
3. Get a TPU protection cover so your palm will not touch the phone directly. (TPU cases may affect GPS signal thought, you can cut the area where cover the GPS antenna)
4. Buy a new phone (my least useful suggestion)

[bioan]

I also tried covering my Optimus backpanel with my entire hand and the wi-fi signal dropped to one bar. I think this is a normal behaviour, because you are obstructing the antenna. It's not a bad design.

[ben_pyett]

try as I might, I fail to make my Desire S stop working. Ive tried landscape and portrait and cannot diminish my wifi signal below 3 bars by death gripping it.

Connecting to a Virgin super hub wifi access point.

Very happy desire S owner here.

Are you sitting next to your router? ;)

[hookguy]

I think is issue is mainly software related, since many people are reporting it not to exist in their phones. So when we can all root our phones we should be able to get rid of this issue :)

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[chancooluk]

I'm struggling with the 3g death grip too. In fact I've noticed that my desire s always seems to have 1 less bar of signal than my other phones.

It's a problem for me at work as the signal is very weak, my desire s shows no network whereas my optimus 1 shows 1 bar and continues to function.

If I obstruct the battery cover I usually lose 2 bars of signal. I've had no WiFi issues though.

I'm quite dissapointed as I really like the phone. The signal issues and Bluetooth disconnect prob I'm having are ruining it for me. :'(

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[ben_pyett]

I'm struggling with the 3g death grip too. In fact I've noticed that my desire s always seems to have 1 less bar of signal than my other phones.

It's a problem for me at work as the signal is very weak, my desire s shows no network whereas my optimus 1 shows 1 bar and continues to function.

If I obstruct the battery cover I usually lose 2 bars of signal. I've had no WiFi issues though.

I'm quite dissapointed as I really like the phone. The signal issues and Bluetooth disconnect prob I'm having are ruining it for me. :'(

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

I don't experience any 3g death grip with this phone, if I tightly grip the phone around the battery case, I may lose one bar of signal but this is a very unusual method of holding the phone and I'd probably expect signal to drop if smothering the device

The wifi death grip is a real landscape only probably, but is mainly fixable through software fix once root

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA Premium App

[marsexpress]

I am readily and frequently affected by the wifi death grip issue with my desire s, never had any trouble with my original desire. I can just about hold the phone in a landscape way that avoids the problem but it is very sensitive and if my hands are slightly out of place then boom, signal's gone.

Haven't noticed much of a 3g death grip but reception in general is quite weak I feel. Ok, I can nearly always get at least a GSM connection which is good, but just the other day I was at a pub and a friend with an iPhone 4 on the same mobile network had 3g (and thus could surf the web), my desire s never got above a GSM connection, says it all really!

[chancooluk]

Yea same here., signal is really weak. Another prob I've got is that I'm on three, so if I can't get a good enough signal it just shows no signal. Three used to let me switch to the Orange gsm network but they switched it off in my area... I've resorted to keeping my optimus one in my car as it can get a much more reliable signal.

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[djpbx]

I think that every Phone suffers something like a grip of death. Just dont pay attention too much to your top bar. Ignorance is your best friend.

Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[marsexpress]

Of course every phone can be death gripped in some way, but the Desire S wifi antenna is far more susceptible to it than any other phone I've owned. My original Desire could be held anyway, portrait or landscape, my Desire S has to be held with very careful finger placement in landscape orientation to avoid completely dropping the connection.

[bronx]

That is extremely weird. As I stated somewhere in here before, on my factory unlocked d.s I have to try hard to reproduce death grip. Under normal use I am not having any problems with wifi or 3g signal, antenas are not that sensitive. Maybe some devices are faulty or have badly tuned software?

[kennyhkw]

Same problem with my Desire S, randomly drops wifi signal when your fingers are round the back of the phone at the top. ie. where the camera lens is.

On my old Wildfire there was never ever any wifi issues. I've checked and with the 2 phones side by side the Wildfire always has a stronger signal and doesn't get affected by how you hold it.

Either a major design flaw or software issue, hopefully they issue a fix soon. Apart from that its a superb phone.

[diarmaid]

My D.S is at -95 dbm while holding it with my fingertips

If I hold it gripped at the base as a 'natural grip' or put the phone base down on a table it goes to -110 dbm - so annoying when trying to look up websites and holding the natural grip

Also I have the landscape issue with WiFi.

Strange thing is I have had 2 desires and this is my first Desire S
The first desire worked perfectly and the second had this network issue too just the same as my new Desire S, I sent my second desire back as I thought it was faulty and I upgraded to a Desire S at the same time - same stupid issues.

You would think that HTC might have learned something from the iphone4 issue.

[Igl0]

I have the same problem while putting my fingers on the vol.up/down button... :(

[TeemoHH]

just got my new Desire S today and I got huge issues with the wifi loss.

Its really easy for me to reproduce: I just have to cover the upper back of the phone with my hand and the wifi signal is gone in a couple of seconds.
Its even worse in landscape mode :-/

I think I'll send it back because under these circumstances its completely useless for me.

Not sure if I should try my luck with another Desire S or switch to a new phone.

quite disappointing tho ... =/

[dloulou]

3. Get a TPU protection cover so your palm will not touch the phone directly. (TPU cases may affect GPS signal thought, you can cut the area where cover the GPS antenna)


Can someone tell me which part of the case you have to cut so it does not cover the pgs antenna?

[roeylee]

Is there an official response from HTC?
I'm interested in purchasing but just learned about this "Grip".

[Codeplayer]

As said before, there is a somewhat hidden setting to get the wifi to perform a bit better and at least not dropping the connection. Go to: Settings -> Wireless and setworks-> Wi-Fi settings, press menu, choose Advanced and check the Best Wi-Fi performance checkbox. Note that as it says in the menu itself, it may consume more power.


Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

[Skanob]

As said before, there is a somewhat hidden setting to get the wifi to perform a bit better and at least not dropping the connection. Go to: Settings -> Wireless and setworks-> Wi-Fi settings, press menu, choose Advanced and check the Best Wi-Fi performance checkbox. Note that as it says in the menu itself, it may consume more power.


Sent from my HTC Desire S using XDA App

have already proven and I've tried that as well, but Wi-Fi death grip is still not fixed.

[eagertosave]

Hi guys, (I have posted this in another thread with the same issue mentioned)

As you can see I am new to the forum. i got my Desire S last month. This is on 'three' network in UK. I recieved a FOTA 2 days ago and my software version now is 1.47.206.2.

Earlier I used to have the death grip problems. Now its completely gone!! I can use my wifi where i wasnt able to before. I can confirm that on landscape mode, the wifi bars dont fall down at all !!!!

So wait for the FOTA update and you will be just as chuffed as I am

Also I should mention, I am S-off. Stock ROM