Trinity will get GPS !!

[XenoV]

Just found official information that the Trinity will get GPS :) :)

See folowing link to the latest HTC brochure.

http://www.europe.htc.com/z/pdf/products/HTC_PRODUCT_BROCHURE_V2_111006.pdf

Guess many of us are happy now:)

[jsp_m]

read the bulletin - "Standalone GPS" means an indipendent accessories that provide GPS connectivity... it will be available shortly, which is not a specially fresh news since standalone BT GPSs' have been on the market for a while now (Haicom etc)

[zkip]

its all a bit ambiguous - if you have a look at the way they write up the p3300 you see there choice of words is "standalone gps"

[lmf_slacker]

it doesn't matter, even without the GPS function i will still get a set

[Lucas0511]

As we say in Germany : The one who can read has a clear advantage... Trinity will not have GPS on board, period. Xenov, first post, welcome, you are excused... :-)

[XenoV]

As we say in Germany : The one who can read has a clear advantage... Trinity will not have GPS on board, period. Xenov, first post, welcome, you are excused... :-)

Let's interpred the text this way: HTC will not praise their latest top notch product in the first line of text with "Standalone GPS" when in reality it is a separate GPS device. This is not like HTC.

When "standalone GPS" means a seperate GPS device, then this text would apply to all today's pocket PC's... and HTC would not use this phrase in the first line of text to praise their new pride...

Time will tell, let everyone judge for his/her own...;)

[Lucas0511]

Mate, read carefully: The "standalone" GPS refers to the HTC 3300, and that is the HTC Artemis, not Trinity. But by now HTC boss Peter Chou must have understood that you are really keen on GPS :-)))

And as we say in Germany :-): Other mothers have beautiful daughters, too. Look at this baby, a competitor to HTC Artemis, with GPS:
http://www.etencorp.com/products/Communication/x500.php

[jsp_m]

IMHO the standalone perhaps means that they will release the HTC branded BT GPS module

[XenoV]

Mate, read carefully: The "standalone" GPS refers to the HTC 3300, and that is the HTC Artemis, not Trinity. But by now HTC boss Peter Chou must have understood that you are really keen on GPS :-)))

At both devices HTC mentiones "Standalone GPS": P3600 aka Trinity AND P3300 aka Artemis... Sorry but this is the way it is... can't change it ;)

[zkip]

English - the worlds most ambiguous language......

Either HTC's marketing department is completely useless or they wanted us to stir up this debate for a reason (time for another paranoid pill)

or

we are all just kidding ourselves

(probably the latter)

inevitably only time will tell

[victoradjei]

What about letiting it mean that unlike the Artemis that comes with stand alone gps and program installed, Trinity will have stand alone gps, but without the program. So that you can choose whichever provider you like :)

Cheer up guys!!

[esackbauer]

If there would be GPS "in" the device, all those people testing the device would have noticed it for sure.

[vapor]

From what I read earlier, the GPS is already inside the device but it has not been activated as it conflicts with the Quad-band GSM chip. However, it is said there there will be a ROM upgrade in the future that would finally make the GPS module usable once the conflicts have been fixed.

From the PDF file, I would think that it supports the reports above. Reason being, for both the Trinity and Artemis, they are noted to have standalone GPS and we know for sure that the Artemis already has it.

I guess the reaon for them putting the * and saying that it would be available shortly for the Trinity is likely due to the reports where they are working on fixing the problem and would release a ROM upgrade to enable it in the future.

What do you guys think?

[XenoV]

If there would be GPS "in" the device, all those people testing the device would have noticed it for sure.

You might be right providing the GPS hardware is connected by software somehow.

The way I understand the situation is that the GPS unit is in the hardware, but not connected by software. Production of the hardware is running from mid october so the hardware won't change anymore.

The only way HTC can make the promised "standalone GPS available shortly", is by software update...

[XenoV]

......
What do you guys think?

Agree.... :D

[Lucas0511]

Nice Trinity pics, even for those (like me) who do not understand Polish.
http://pdaclub.pl/view.php?news_id=11939

[zerimar]

I guess you guys should check this this out; http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=279546 for clarification.

[lmf_slacker]

ah a beauty! white version triumphs big time over the black version...

if theres so much conflict abt the GPS issue in the Trinity why cant HTC rectify the problem then release the Trinity with GPS or discard the Quad-band GSM chip n use another chip!?!?!?

[cidriver]

Thanks for the piscs, really nice the white one.

Hope we can enjoy the GPS on a next ROM upgrade. The time is more close...

[Lurker0]

Being involved into GPS business, I can say that "standalone GPS" would mean "standalone GPS mode" an opposite to AGPS, or even DGPS/RTK (though I doubt the latter). Read e.g. here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS):The resulting AGPS system boosts performance beyond that of the same receiver in a stand-alone mode.If it was an external unit, I'm sure it would be called as such with additional "optional" remark.

[XenoV]

Being involved into GPS business, I can say that "standalone GPS" would mean "standalone GPS mode" an opposite to AGPS, or even DGPS/RTK (though I doubt the latter). Read e.g. here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_GPS):If it was an external unit, I'm sure it would be called as such with additional "optional" remark.

Thanks for your supporting remarks which reflect my thoughts when started this threat.

[Hatydu]

That was little cocky answer Mr Lucas responding to the query or piece of information .In the case of all the pocket pc products and manufacture will advertise their products that it supports outside gps receivers in fact If I'm not mistaken in fact in this case 99% of all the pocket pc's will have to advertise like that it supports gps receivers . it will be like little cheating , misinformation or using marketing speak in today's environment where everybody knows all the pocket pc support gps receivers and coming from the guys who started quality microsoft pocket pc and they have have to resort to confuse consumers to sell their products . they don't need to .It will have some kind on inbuilt gps functionality . and if it has it could also get tmc means FM radio . what a complete device only `qwerty keyboarders ' would find something amiss

[victoradjei]

I love this thread, so am stoking the fire!

Look here and read the footnote:) on page 6

http://www.europe.htc.com/z/pdf/products/HTC_PRODUCT_BROCHURE_V2_111006.pdf

Victor

[lmf_slacker]

I love this thread, so am stoking the fire!

Look here and read the footnote:) on page 6

http://www.europe.htc.com/z/pdf/products/HTC_PRODUCT_BROCHURE_V2_111006.pdf

Victor


'available shortly' it reads

[XenoV]

I love this thread, so am stoking the fire!

Look here and read the footnote:) on page 6

http://www.europe.htc.com/z/pdf/products/HTC_PRODUCT_BROCHURE_V2_111006.pdf

Victor

No news... see the first post in this thread :)

[victoradjei]

No news... see the first post in this thread :)

Of course this is no news. Just keeping the mood lively:)
Victor

[XenoV]

It's getting time for some more official news from HTC about this mystery.

If only we would know for sure the first batch of hardware does support standalone GPS :confused:

We wouldn't mind waiting for a ROM upgrade to make things work properly ;)

In this case we would preorder a Trinity, but the lack of information from HTC is holding us back :mad:

So mister Peter Chou and mister Florian Seiche, when you are reading this.... please get your marketing people communicate! Otherwise many of us might start to consider the E-TEN X500 which seems to be a fine device too :eek:

Anybody out there who does not agree?

[emay]

I do agree, and the X500 is exactly what I am looking at right now.

[machinagod]

Actually one of the first pre-release ROM's had GPS enabled. But it was quickly disabled due to terrible performance...

Bye,
machinagod

[cidriver]

A lot of speculation but truly we still at the same point of departure.

I'm sick to call, mail a lot of well know stores for these device, nobody knows nothing about the exactly date of sale. Expansys UK says "DUE" november 23 and Expansys Spain... No comment, the have no idea about the date, they only know the color, is GREY!!!! oohhhh God!

[Lucas0511]

@cidriver
The grey Trinity is reserved for a Euro operator, likely HTC´s new strategic partner Vodafone. First batches of HTC-branded Trinity´s will be white, black with the HTC brand will follow for Europe only (Dopod in Asia). A good discounter at Hamburg offers it for just above 500 euros, and if you order from Spain you have to pay German VAT, but no longer the Spanish one. Tax free would only be outside Europe, and even if the British (like we Swiss) would rather not be a part of EU, they are.

http://www.handyattacke.de/cgi/websale6.cgi?shopid=etronixx&subshopid=attacke&act=product&prod_number=203066&cat_index=1-274&ref=psm_attacke&subref=203066

PS: Shipping to Spain is 45 euros, rather high, but UPS records a lot of "losses" there... :-)

[Lucas0511]

Just received the latest product sheets on white Trinity for Euro operators, there is absolutely no mention of GPS in both the product sheet and the leaflet. Of course (and I truly hope for it) there might still be a deactivated SiRF III chip inside), and I am sure someone will open his Trinity in order to check it out :-))), but dont count on your Trinity to offer GPS.

If you need it and can live without 3G/UMTS, go for the X500 Glofish.
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2006/10/30/e-ten-glofiish-x500-smartphone-gets-official/

And if you can wait and want to sport a real hot baby but again sans 3G nor GPS, go for the Gigabyte i200, that offers both DVB-H and DVB-T digital TV reception. Looks similar to a Ipod, just cool.
http://asia.cnet.com/reviews/handhelds/0,39001709,61960257,00.htm

Watch out HTC, Gigabyte takes O2/Telefonica business where you left it...

[XenoV]

X500 will be available in the Netherlands very soon for max 569 euro's but probably less.
Great form factor, 400MHz and GPS :D

[Lucas0511]

Another point in making a purchase decision on HTC now is their service and support in Europe (and according to our mates in Singapore Dopod Taiwan, a HTC company, is not much better). Support is minimal, even with the new HTC UK centre, and service is offered via the UK, too. But for customers like me used to 2-day turnaround repair or exchange by i.e. O2 "can do" Germany HTC will not do :-). Who wants to send his device to the UK for repair. We´re talking about 500plus Euro devices and minimal service and support. To give HTC credit, they are in the middle of building a Euro infrastructure, but who wants to suffer until it is in place? E-Ten/Glofish at least have a proper rep in Germany, and Gigabyte will have very soon. Just my 2 cents.

[lmf_slacker]

A lot of speculation but truly we still at the same point of departure.

I'm sick to call, mail a lot of well know stores for these device, nobody knows nothing about the exactly date of sale. Expansys UK says "DUE" november 23 and Expansys Spain... No comment, the have no idea about the date, they only know the color, is GREY!!!! oohhhh God!

grey? so there's black, white and grey version?

[lmf_slacker]

Dopod's customer service is notoriously 'famous' in singapore, mention it to any pocket pc device holder in my country and u will hear lots from them... yes after sales services n customer service is very important, with the price we pay for the device we the public of course expect some decent service if out device fails on us

[cidriver]

grey? so there's black, white and grey version?


Yes it is.

Expansys Spain = Grey

Expansys UK = Black

MundoPDA, Optize = White

[helten2]

Yes it is.

Expansys Spain = Grey

Expansys UK = Black

MundoPDA, Optize = White

Sure about that? Expansys only have the black version as far as I can tell...

Have any pics of the grey one?

[Lucas0511]

HTC P3600 black
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/5315/htcblackac7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[XenoV]

Everywhere we hear and see shipment dates of November 23 but still no info whether or not the hardware does support GPS.

Even something simple as colors remains subjet of discussion. We want to sell something but we don't know what to sell.... What kind of marketing strategy is this??

Shame on you HTC, you are seriously loosing business here.

HTC may be a leader in building devices, but they don’t grasp dealing directly with their end user market.

[forcedalias]

From what I read earlier, the GPS is already inside the device but it has not been activated as it conflicts with the Quad-band GSM chip. However, it is said there there will be a ROM upgrade in the future that would finally make the GPS module usable once the conflicts have been fixed.

Sounds feasible. Remember when they released the WIZARD/Qtek 9100 with 802.11b enabled instead of 802.11b/g? Well, they patched it up didn't yet? Let's hope for the same here.

[XenoV]

Sounds feasible. Remember when they released the WIZARD/Qtek 9100 with 802.11b enabled instead of 802.11b/g? Well, they patched it up didn't yet? Let's hope for the same here.

Fully agree, that's what we all hope for.

Would be nice though if HTC would confirm this. Now their brochure only states "available shortly". Would be great if they would write "available shortly by software update".

Sad that the world leader in manufacturing communication devices does not know how to communicate...

[lmf_slacker]

Fully agree, that's what we all hope for.

Would be nice though if HTC would confirm this. Now their brochure only states "available shortly". Would be great if they would write "available shortly by software update".

Sad that the world leader in manufacturing communication devices does not know how to communicate...

would be even nicer if they could sort out the GPS problem before they launch the device, making it available upon release

[XenoV]

would be even nicer if they could sort out the GPS problem before they launch the device, making it available upon release

Oh YESS that would be even great!!

However production of the P3600 already started mid october. So I'm affraid this is no option anymore. Devices of the first production batch became available in Portugal yesterday and still no clarification on GPS capabillities, not from HTC nor in Portugal.

Currently the P3600 is just a TyTN without keyboard put into a Prophet housing. Quite disappointing after all big anouncements of a "no limits" Trinity device.

[cidriver]

I just finish to order one, but the price is to hight, almost 700,00 €

[lmf_slacker]

Oh YESS that would be even great!!

However production of the P3600 already started mid october. So I'm affraid this is no option anymore. Devices of the first production batch became available in Portugal yesterday and still no clarification on GPS capabillities, not from HTC nor in Portugal.

Currently the P3600 is just a TyTN without keyboard put into a Prophet housing. Quite disappointing after all big anouncements of a "no limits" Trinity device.

well if it has the ability of the Tytn i wouldnt mind coz have come across the Tytn n quite a neat device i might say except for the screen alightment issue, hope no such screw up for the Trinity...

[XenoV]

well if it has the ability of the Tytn i wouldnt mind coz have come across the Tytn n quite a neat device i might say except for the screen alightment issue, hope no such screw up for the Trinity...

Sure, the TyTN is a neat device, though still a little too fat and heavy to carry in a shirt pocket all day (based upon experience with the Wizard). The Trinity is more like the Magician in terms of size and weight, which suited me very well.

From the moment on the Trinity was announced in the HTC roadmap I was waiting for this device. A loooong wait for a superior device which had it all in one, including GPS :D

As many may have noticed, I am now quite disappointed about the current GPS status of the device. And also disappointed with regard to the lack of information comming from HTC :(

[Lucas0511]

@XenoV
A word of caution: I am also looking at the X500 with GPS built-in, but according to the German Eten user forums repairs of Eten devices can only be performed in...Taiwan. They only have distributors, and ROM updates can be downloaded from eten.ch, their Swiss rep, but no service centers in Europe. Not very comforting. But I am sure other manufacturers also have GPS-included PDAs in their lineup for Q1 2007. May be better to wait.

[XenoV]

@Lucas: I still didn't give up on HTC (I'm almost there though).

The quality of E-TEN devices is also not allways the best. Anyhow, usually these devices don't last here longer than a year and a defective device gives me an excuse to get a new model earlier. Also quite interesting is the upcomming Asus P535 (sounds like a BMW), same size and weight as the P3600 but a 525 MHz processor and.... GPS. Should be available in december ;)

[lmf_slacker]

Sure, the TyTN is a neat device, though still a little too fat and heavy to carry in a shirt pocket all day (based upon experience with the Wizard). The Trinity is more like the Magician in terms of size and weight, which suited me very well.

From the moment on the Trinity was announced in the HTC roadmap I was waiting for this device. A loooong wait for a superior device which had it all in one, including GPS :D

As many may have noticed, I am now quite disappointed about the current GPS status of the device. And also disappointed with regard to the lack of information comming from HTC :(

a Magician user still at the moment n the form suits me well, fine, good! thats y me looking forward to the Trinity to be release in my country soon but the price is a major turn-off, sgd1298 is a bit too expensive as most of my peeps expresses so too...

GPS wise no worries coz i don't use it at all, just hope the conflict doesn't affect the device performance

[Lucas0511]

Reply from HTC´s support:
"Dear Sir,

The GPS is not yet available on the P3600, I believe this will come through a software upgrade but we do not have yet a date for its release. However, the P3300 is available now and has an inbuilt GPS system.

Thank you for your enquiry. Should you need further assistance, please do not hesitate to call us. Your local number can be found at:
http://www.europe.htc.com/support/cs_by_phone.html

Best Regards
Candylor Salahou
callservice@htceurope.com
http://www.htc.com"

But as we know from experience, callcenter supporters sometime do not know what they are talking about... :-) The verdict is still open...

[XenoV]

@lmf_slacker: Would not worry about any performance conflict due to GPS problems. The GPS functionallity of the chipset is separated from the phone functionallity. When the GPS part is not adressed by software it is simply not there and can't interfere with anything else.

As far as prices concern: Lowest price I've seen here in Holland is 525 euro ( approx sgd1055). Guess tax differences play a role here.

[XenoV]

Reply from HTC´s support:
"Dear Sir,

The GPS is not yet available on the P3600, I believe ......

....The verdict is still open...

LOL
Yes I'm a believer too, though rather know it for sure :eek:
So besides some more hope nothing news ;)

[Guybrush]

I don't believe hardware conflict by HTC.... i just think they had disabled GPS for give more market to P3300...

[XenoV]

I don't believe hardware conflict by HTC.... i just think they had disabled GPS for give more market to P3300...

This would really be a "amateur" marketing strategy which I don't believe for a number of reasons:

usually a manufacutrer starts with the top model, followed by less performing models. This has proven to gain more cash.
the trinity was scheduled for september and the artemis should come thereafter.
first early prototypes for testing had the GPS enabeled, but due to very bad performance GPS was disabled in later test models.

[manisa236]

Here's a good review.. in French.
http://www.mobinaute.com/mobinaute/article.php?id=20061113194219

[manisa236]

Well.. I read the article with my limited French..
Soon-to-be-activated GPS has been mentioned couple of times, but no details about the actual chipset (SiRF or not etc.).
So, the verdict is still well-open.
I just hope by GPS they don't mean AGPS capability of the Qualcomm GSM chipset the device has. That'd be a real bummer..

[Lucas0511]

Thanks manisa, interesting review. The review refers in fact to the A-GPS capabilities of the Trinity. As I understand A-GPS, correct me if I am wrong, is Location Based Service-GPS (from the nearest GSM/UMTS cell tower) info combined with GPS satellite info via GPRS or UMTS. A-GPS is for example available in Austria ("3" provider), but no success. Go figure.

This info would fit into my knowledge that France Telecom´s Orange unit starts to push A-GPS now, with Trinity available as M700.

"Ne possédant pas premièrement de fonctions GPS, le PDAPhone sera mis à jour en début d'année prochaine pour exploiter ses fonctionnalités A-GPS associées jusque là désactivées en standard."

Funny Babelfish translation:
"not having firstly functions GPS, PDAPhone will be updated at the beginning of next year to exploit its functionalities A-GPS associated until decontaminated there out of standard." :-))))

[anonimo]

At the moment I would settle for a P3600 user's manual. It's a bit strange that 9 days before supposed availability we haven't seen any documents but two leaflets on the HTC site.

[XenoV]

More positive GPS news from an more or less official source: See the link below.

http://msmobiles.com/news.php/5763.html

[jsp_m]

they just translated the same txt we did... no new news

[XenoV]

@jsp_m
Sorry, posted the link before reading latest additions :eek:

[forcedalias]

Well.. I read the article with my limited French..
Soon-to-be-activated GPS has been mentioned couple of times, but no details about the actual chipset (SiRF or not etc.).
So, the verdict is still well-open.
I just hope by GPS they don't mean AGPS capability of the Qualcomm GSM chipset the device has. That'd be a real bummer..

I second that, bro.

I definitely wouldn't buy it if it has a lesser GPS-unit inside than the Artemis.

[XenoV]

@forcedalias
I don't think it will be AGPS only as AGPS needs provider data to function, so AGPS could not be qualified as "standalone".

The Artemis has a SiRF III GPS receiver.

The Tinity might make use of the GPS-ONE receiver from the chipset supplier Quallcom. How GPS-ONE performs as "standalone" application is not known to me. From rumours I've heard it's not as good as SiRF III. In combination however with AGPS (we need a supporting provider here) GPS-ONE would out-perform SiRF III.

It is still possible though that HTC did put SiRF III GPS hardware in the box. Also because they experienced a lot of trouble with the Quallcom design. Guess we will know more soon. The first one who is willing to disassemble his new toy will be able to tell us :)

[forcedalias]

@forcedalias
In combination however with AGPS (we need a supporting provider here) GPS-ONE would out-perform SiRF III.

That's the thing, I don't want any dependence on cellphone towers, I just want to be anywhere in the world and able to get my position.

Worst part is down to my lack of patience (I've been waiting since the whole PDA-phone fad started) for my first PDA phone and I really thought this one would be it so I went and pre-ordered my P3600.

God damn it. Looks like I will have to sell it on eBay once I get it. What a waste of time and money.

[lmf_slacker]

@lmf_slacker: Would not worry about any performance conflict due to GPS problems. The GPS functionallity of the chipset is separated from the phone functionallity. When the GPS part is not adressed by software it is simply not there and can't interfere with anything else.

As far as prices concern: Lowest price I've seen here in Holland is 525 euro ( approx sgd1055). Guess tax differences play a role here.

>Xenov - ok glad to hear that coz i don't wanna get my hands on a set n problem start arising due to the conflict causing more conflicts in the set! hahaha...

seems like the price in my country is quite high (sgd1298) for the Trinity, many people i come across all complained about the initial release price due to the unresolved GPS issue, i believe some will change their mind and get other devices instead...

[lmf_slacker]

More positive GPS news from an more or less official source: See the link below.

http://msmobiles.com/news.php/5763.html

'by first quarter of 2007'? hmm that will be between next jan til apr in which its not confirmed also... what a wait it will be but if the problem can be resolved when they release the solution then it will be worth the long wait

[XenoV]

'by first quarter of 2007'? hmm that will be between next jan til apr in which its not confirmed also... what a wait it will be but if the problem can be resolved when they release the solution then it will be worth the long wait

First quarter of 2007 applies to the Orange branded device. As far as I know the HTC P3600 version will be available in europe next week.

[Gilbert]

Hi,

I read the manual and there is no mention of GPS capability on the device. Just wondering if HTC even deleted any reference to it in the manual and will surprise us all with an activation mechanism sometimes in year 2007?

Thanks,

Gilbert

[XenoV]

I've read the manual too and couldn't find a word on GPS either.
So far the only formal references made by HTC are:


the brochure (first post in this threat)
an email from their support dept stating they think GPS will be made available by software upgrade, no releasedate known yet


The software upgrade has also been mentioned by telecom provider Orange. As far as I remember Orange said the update will be available in january 2007. Especially in Europe GPS is a huge sales argument as GPS is highly popular here. So, besides HTC understanding this, also Orange will put some pressure to make GPS "available shortly".

Though we have to realize there is still a risk: It still may turn out the HTC hardware design is not suitable for proper GPS functionallity. Then HTC cannot provide a software update to make GPS available on the currently manufactured devices....

For the moment the only thing we can do is wait and see what happens....

[futureshock]

sorry,... but the devices that are going around today has definitly no gps...

i think these forseries products should have it... to test... and when not good then in the final devices it is not available...

also i think thats not a little hw change in the device... because of that i don't really think that it maybe will be available with software update... strange thing ...

i hope in near future theres an pda phone with GPS and 3G & HSDPA... may already with HSDPU ... (my provider has testet this a few weeks ago.. -> http://www.teltarif.de/arch/2005/kw23/s17412.html found german news only..)

[devon]

I contacted HTC support via email regarding the GPS ... they responded, I wrote back asking for clarification, saying "I have a boat, and I want to use GPS in the middle of the ocean, far far away from cell phone towers - will the Trinity be able to do this".

I'm waiting for a response, if same turnaround as the first human reply it should be 24h or so ... I'll post their response to the email thread here when I hear anything.

I've spent about 8h trying to get a good answer on this, right now I'd say it's pretty likely there's a GPSone chip in there - bad news, as your cell phone carrier has to provide ancillary service for the Trinity's GPS to work and they will quite certainly charge for it if they do.

So far...:
__________________________________________________ _______

Hello [snip],

Thank you very much for the quick response. Is this GPS chipset one which can operate without the assistance of a cellular network (eg would it work in the middle of the ocean) or does it require a cellular network with a special service activated in order to pinpoint your position (as is the case with gpsOne chips).

I have a boat, and would like to use it in the ocean - far, far away from any cell phone towers. Will the HTC Trinity be able to do this?

Thanks in advance,

Devon

HTC Technical Hotline Support wrote:
> Customer email address:[snip]
> Hello Devon
>
> Yes, this is correct. The GPS chipset in the device has been disabled at present, while we write a new firmware for the device. Once this ROM has been released the GPS chip will be activated.
>
> Yours sincerely
> [snip]
> callservice@htceurope.com
> http://www.htc.com
>
----Original Message----

Caller_Name: Devon
Mobile_Number: [snip]
Calling_From: gb
E_Mail: [snip]

Date= [snip]

Customer phone model= htcp3600

Problem_Description= I have heard rumors that the HTC P3600 has a GPS chip in it which will be activated in a future ROM update ... is this true?

Thanks,

Devon

Customer PC= acer
Customer PC model=
Customer PC OS= winxpsp2
Customer PC other=

Troubleshooting info= Not coming from troubleshooting guide


D

[XenoV]

Excellent try! Really hope you manage to get more precise info! So please keep us informed about the progress.

[futureshock]

when a gps receiver is inside the phone... we just can see it!!

anyone now have already a trinity should open it and look for the chip... maybe theres no gps inside the presale devices but i don't think so... gps is just a big hardware fact and can't easly ripped out of the hw layer design...

...

just waiting for first pics of the inside...

[llemtt]

No need to open it! Trinity is built around the Qualcomm chipset which has integrated gpsOne functions.

gpsOne is usually operated in AGPS (assisted GPS) mode giving 5-10m accuracy, but it can be operated also stand-alone with less (but unpublished) accuracy.

Assistance from network is mainly indications on which satellites to use for positioning; my understanding of this is that the integrated GPS receiver has very few channels, compared to the usual 8-20 of today receivers, and the selection of the best satellites to use is demanded to the network: this way it draws less current and it's faster, two very important things in a mobile phone that lets you keep the gps always on without the risk to need a charge in the middle of the day..

Without network assistance expect performances not comparable with current receivers.

Everything is somehow documented on the qualcomm site.

teo

[devon]

OK, here's an updated thread of my conversation with HTC support. The first part of the conversation is above (#72) ... still questioning whether he knows what he's talking about, but that's probably just my skepticism. Sounds promising anyway.

(read from the bottom)

Devon

_______________________________________________
Customer email address:? [snip]
?
Dear Mr.? Devon [snip]
Thank you for contacting HTC Europe support

In response to your query the gps antenna on the 3600 is switch off, but in the future we are going to provide our costumers with a new upgrade to turn on this option in the device.

If you use the device on the open sea it will work "if you use an external antenna" this will work as well when the new upgrade is coming up, GPS don't have any relation with service operators?or GSM "cell signal", gps depends only of a certain number of active satellites to provide you with your position.

Please don't hesitate to contact us back if this doesn't solve your query

Kind regards

[snip]
HTC Europe Support

[snip]
HYPERLINK "http://www.htc.com/"http://www.htc.com

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hello [snip],

Thanks for the quick response. Your answer is very clear, and if you are right then the issue is closed and I'm going to happily go out and buy the p3600 (trinity).

However, there is still the confusion of this issue: this article

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.solopalmari.com%2Fcon tent%2Fview%2F2471%2F38%2F&langpair=it%7Cen&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools

which provided the image that I have attached regarding the internal structure of the p3600, clearly indicates that the HTC p3600 has a GPSOne chip (I've circled it in orange), not the industry standard which is SirfstarIII.

The first link in a google search of GPSOne is this one from Qualcomm who makes it:

http://www.cdmatech.com/products/gpsone.jsp

and it states that GPSOne is reliant on wireless service providers in order to function. If the Trinity uses GPSOne as it's GPS system, then it appears that it would not in fact function in the middle of the ocean.

So either the Trinity doesn't use the GPSOne chip, or the Qualcomm website above is wrong, or I'm misunderstanding things (and if I am, please explain), or the Trinity does *not* have standalone GPS that would function in the middle of the ocean far far outside the range of wireless service provider's towers.

Can you please confirm, I'm really quite confused here.

Thanks in advance for your time, it is appreciated.

Devon

[snip] wrote:
> In response to your query the service of the gps is totally non dependent
> of
> the call operator service, when you use the gps you are receiving the
> signals
> from satellites not from a carrier or any cell antenna.
>
> If you are using the device in the sea, you should check the type of
> software
> that you can use to navigate and check also for signal quality in the sea,
> as
> my personal experience on merchant ships, why usually used external
> antennas to
> amplify the quality of the reception.
>
> Please don't hesitate to contact us back if this doesn't solve your query

[XenoV]

@Devon

The fact this person is talking about antennas tells me that the person does not really know what he/she is talking about. So you're not the only one.

Promising, yes, but.... sofar HTC continues to refuse (also by my own experience) to get a crisp and clear message into the world about the real (future) GPS capabillities. Most probably they will keep refusing this untill they resolved the said firmware problems.

Though more than anyone else I hope you will succeed and get a clear answer from HTC one of these days.

@IIemtt

This is the very best and shortest explaining summary of GPS-ONE I have read so far. Very clarifying. However we still don't know for sure which RF-head is used in the Trinity, this could also be a non-Qualcomm solution. If so, this might explain the difficulties HTC has with their firmware.

[devon]

Update: received this (which is from someone else @ HTC support) this morning. Much more clear. My only questions now are whether the GPSone chip is compatible with tomtom etc when not using the gsm network, and whether the accuracy in this situation would be sufficient for road navigation.

Since the chip is not yet activated I guess we'll have to wait until people install the upcoming update and actually try to use tomtom etc with it.

I'm going to read the link she sent me and maybe try to followup with the woman who gave the response below (as she clearly knows what she's talking about).

Does anyone have any first hand experience with GPSone chips and navigation software ... does it work well enough w/o the gsm network??

Devon

>Good Afternoon,
>
> The Trinity utilizes a Qualcomm GPS one chip, but it has not been
> activated as it conflicts with the Quad-band GSM chip at the moment.
> The GPS one chip supports A-GPS (assisted GPS) and will combine GPS
> positioning with GSM/GPRS/UMTS technology (where there is a gsm signal).
> The advantage is to get more accurate positioning and also is useful
> for location based services. Please read on:
> http://ubikwitus.blogspot.com/2006_10_01_ubikwitus_archive.html
> If a GSM/GPRS/UMTS network is not available then the GPS module could
> be theoretically used as a stand alone device to get GPS positioning
> on the sea, but at the moment it is deactivated. Also you would
> require nautical maps to get accurate readings.
>
> Best regards,
>
> [snip]
> HTC Support
> [snip]
> http://www.htc.com

[XenoV]

@Devon

Okay, a much better response from HTC this time, but still nothing really new.

The GPS functionallity in the Trinity consists of two parts. First the Qualcomm 6275 chip which contains the processing part and provides the possibillity of assitence by cellphone towers (AGPS). Second part is the RF-head which is the actual sattellite receiver (a still unknown chip).

- We know already everything about the 6275 and the abillity to provide location based services. Superb, but this is not what we are really interested in.
- Based upon the last mail from the HTC lady we may assume, but not be sure, that the RF-head is also a Qualcomm solution. If this is true then the GPS-ONE summary posted by IIemtt becomes valid.

Stand alone precision of a Qualcomm RF-head is said to be 15 meters(info from Italian reviewer), with a slow TTFF (time to first fix) due to limited number of monitoring channels in the RF-head GPS receiver. The TTFF issue can be resolved by offline data derived from internet containing approximate sattellite positions.

Based upon own experience with early GPS receivers (also at best 15 meters precision) I can tell that this is sufficient for road navigation with fi TomTom.

Latest SiRF III receivers are from time to time also 15m or more off from the real position, so the slight decrease in precision would not be something to really worry about.

[llemtt]

The RF head is a RFR6250

http://www.cdmatech.com/products/diagram_rfr6250.html

[S0NIC]

Provider Orange France:

"le SPV M700 possède bien un GPS intégré... Il n'a pas été activé par le fabricant. Courant premier trimestre 2007, le fabricant mettra à disposition une mise à jour logicielle qui ré-activera le GPS intégré. En attendant, il est nécessaire d'utiliser une antenne GPS externe."

...which means...

"The SPV M700 has integrated GPS but it is currently not activated by the manufacturer. During the first quarter of 2007, they will make a software update available that will activate the integrated GPS. Until this time, an external GPS is required."

src= http://mobile.orange.fr/0/visiteur/PV?file=chaines/sedeplacer/navigation_gps/fiche_mobile/orange_spv_m700.shtml

src= http://www.modaco.com/index.php?showtopic=248461

[anonimo]

It seems we are getting into a hard loop here! :)

[autolycos]

Straight from the source:
http://www.europe.htc.com/z/pdf/products/HTC_PRODUCT_BROCHURE_V2_111006.pdf

"Packed with technology, the HTC
P3600 supports standalone GPS* to
keep you connected wherever you
travel. The combination of Microsoft®
Windows Mobile®5.0 with 3G, Quad-
Band EDGE, Wi-Fi®and Bluetooth®
2.0 all in a slick phone, designed
for work and play."

* Available shortly

[XenoV]

Gentlemen please read the thread before you post

@autolycos:

The info you provide is already mentioned in the very first post of this thread.

@sonic:

Sorry, but we knew this for a while already.

[XenoV]

The RF head is a RFR6250

http://www.cdmatech.com/products/diagram_rfr6250.html

llemtt do you assume this is the RF head or know this for sure?

[Manne]

If there is a GPS receiver inside the Trinity, how does one connect an external GPS antenna to the device? Does anyone know?

[XenoV]

If there is a GPS receiver inside the Trinity, how does one connect an external GPS antenna to the device? Does anyone know?
The P3600 has one external antenna connection which is only to be used for the cellphone function.
As far as I can see it now there will be no provision for a hard wired external GPS antenna. There are however also external GPS antennas which re-radiate the GPS signals near the device GPS antenna without the need for a hard wired connection. If there is need for an external antenna you may as well consider an external bluetooth GPS receiver.

[jasjamming]

Anyone Dare to Open their Trinity UP to see if it has a SIRFIII GPS unit in it?

From what I have read, the GPS unit conflicts with the Qualcomm Chipset - thats why its not enabled at present (due to software problem)

So based on that, maybe the trinity doesnt use the GPSone module in the Qualcomm chipset itself (because there will be no conflict as qualcomm made the chipset). It maybe in fact that there is a "standalone" chipset (might be SIRFIII) in the unit itself.

Does anyone have the guts to check?

[Lucas0511]

Peer at France Telecom´s Orange future lab has received Trinity usability training from HTC, says the device exists indeed in a version with a SiRF III chip complimentary to Qualcomms A-GPSone offering, but the two services do not work side by side - a big disappointment for Orange, who wanted to start its A-GPS service introduction Dec. 14 with the Trinity. Orange has already samples with activated and working GPSone chip in their lab, under testing.

[Azamat]

...says the device exists indeed in a version with a SiRF III chip...

Could it be that the P3600's that are sold today do not have the SiRF III Chips in it but an other version does...???

Hope not, cuz I ordered it 2 days ago

[jasjamming]

Based on this, in the HTC Product PDF file in states - standalone GPS*

*available soon

- I beleive they are referring to the SIRFIII Chipset as it is standalone by nature.

If it didnt state "standalone" then implicitely it will mean A-GPS - gpsone from qualcomm.

Cheers

[XenoV]

Based on this, in the HTC Product PDF file in states - standalone GPS*

*available soon

- I beleive they are referring to the SIRFIII Chipset as it is standalone by nature.

If it didnt state "standalone" then implicitely it will mean A-GPS - gpsone from qualcomm.

Cheers
A pure Qualcomm GPS implementation consists of two chips. One chip for processing (which provides also the "Assisted" part, AGPS) and one chip for sattellite reception, called the RF-head.

Such a Qualcomm implementation can also function as stand-alone, without assistance of data from cellphone towers. The Qualcomm chipset is designed for 24/7 operation and thus has a very low power consumption (battery life) compared to for instance a SiRF III.

The backdrop of a Qualcomm RF-head is that, in order to keep the power consumption low, it has only a few receiving channels compared to the nowadays common 20 channels in a SiRF III RF-head.

This means that a Qualcomm RF-head without "assistance" will perform less than a SiRF III (accuracy and first time to fix). With "assistance" the Qualcomm outperforms the SiRF III.

The assumption that there might be a SiRF III RF-head connected to the Qualcomm 6275 processing chip inside the Trinity is not new. This might be also the explanation why HTC has the said problems with the firmware.

The said firmware problems are also speculation. Another speculation is that the reseller Orange obtained the right to be the first with Trinity GPS. For this reason HTC could hold back the GPS ROM update. Not very smart though (and therefore maybe not true) as the HTC P3600 would be immediately a wordlwide topseller when offered with GPS functionallity.

[Lucas0511]

@XenoV
Orange is only interested in the A-GPS functionality, that´s for sure, they want to sell that service, combined with LBS (Location Based Services) infos.

[XenoV]

@XenoV
Orange is only interested in the A-GPS functionality, that´s for sure, they want to sell that service, combined with LBS (Location Based Services) infos.

Sure understand that. For this reason a "Trinity GPS first" may fit into their marketing strategy. Besides that I just wonder if any LBS will sell well. Just can't imagine the "average" user is interested in such, but maybe I think too conservative.

[Viper®]

Sure understand that. For this reason a "Trinity GPS first" may fit into their marketing strategy. Besides that I just wonder if any LBS will sell well. Just can't imagine the "average" user is interested in such, but maybe I think too conservative.

Well, if you look at the big picture.

You could use that LBS for example with:

-TomTom buddy list, see where your collegues are driving.
-Live messenger, to see where your contacts are at the moment (especially when they're signed in mobile)
-online navigator. No TT needed, just use a service/website to navigate
-advertisement on location, when you get near a MacD you get a text about their newest burger
-restaurants or POI near your location

:)

[Guybrush]

we'll know all when a hero disassemble his trinity for first

[XenoV]

Well, if you look at the big picture.

You could use that LBS for example with:

-TomTom buddy list, see where your collegues are driving.
-Live messenger, to see where your contacts are at the moment (especially when they're signed in mobile)
-online navigator. No TT needed, just use a service/website to navigate
-advertisement on location, when you get near a MacD you get a text about their newest burger
-restaurants or POI near your location

:)

That's exacly what I mean :)
Why should I pay extra for such service? I don't need/want advertisements thrown at me. All other so called LBS features I can do also with standalone GPS and simple low speed GPRS. So where is the added value I should pay for? :)

[anonimo]

That's exacly what I mean :)
Why should I pay extra for such service? I don't need/want advertisements thrown at me. All other so called LBS features I can do also with standalone GPS and simple low speed GPRS. So where is the added value I should pay for? :)

This is totally off topic now but just clarify: you can't have a buddy list in your phone with location of other buddies unless this is provided by your network operator, you can't search a dating system where people having a drink in the same pub as you are shown first in the list :) Maybe you are not interested in these services but if you were then there would be an added value to pay for.

[XenoV]

This is totally off topic now but just clarify: you can't have a buddy list in your phone with location of other buddies unless this is provided by your network operator, you can't search a dating system where people having a drink in the same pub as you are shown first in the list :) Maybe you are not interested in these services but if you were then there would be an added value to pay for.

Yes I can have LBS without need for a network operator service.

I do not need a network operator for LBS and I do not need A-GPS for LBS. Any computer connected to Internet can provide LBS. The only thing you need in your mobile device is a standalone GPS and a data connection for internet.

GPS will soon become a standard feature in mobile phones, just like Bluetooth and GPRS. As a result of that there will be soon a wide range of "free of charge" LBS through internet. Including buddy lists, dating systems, car parking systems and whatever more you can think of.

Just watch for instance the upcomming - near future - windows life developments. They are going - amongst others - also into this direction. Again no need for paid network operator support.

And yes, I am very interested in LBS, but not as a paid and limmited service by network operators :)

[Lucas0511]

Fact is, operators would already be happy if you just use their data services more, since they thought they could refinance their 3G licence and network development through it. LBS Buddy lists and all the like - Swisscom had it already a few years back, and customers where passing on it. Maybe a flat rate data plan (like mine at 32 dollars/month for unlimited 3G/GPRS) could help introduce LBS services. But in order to pay i.e. a parking spot in my city I only need to send a SMS with the number of the spot... :-)

[Matterhorn]

Fact is, operators would already be happy if you just use their data services more, since they thought they could refinance their 3G licence and network development through it. LBS Buddy lists and all the like - Swisscom had it already a few years back, and customers where passing on it. Maybe a flat rate data plan (like mine at 32 dollars/month for unlimited 3G/GPRS) could help introduce LBS services. But in order to pay i.e. a parking spot in my city I only need to send a SMS with the number of the spot... :-)

Yes, $wi$$com is a total rippoff. I don't know who they have working in their marketing department, but they should be fired. They could make so much more money if they just had an affordable unlimited plan. As it is, people are afraid (with good reason) to access any services because they think it is going to cause a CHF 200. + mobile phone bill. Those data charges do add up fast. Once they offered me an unlimited plan...I knew it was too good to be true, I ran up a CHF 250. bill using my phone as a modem for my laptop. It turns out the plan was only for their little in house system and not the entire internet. Their advertising was totally misleading.

[anonimo]

Yes I can have LBS without need for a network operator service.

Yes I see your point. We will get there. But today an operator can offer LBS to millions of subscribers with standard GSM phones, while I personally don't know a single person with a GPS-enabled phone. Obviously two or three years from now things will be different.

[IamGuest]

we'll know all when a hero disassemble his trinity for first

I am your hero. :D

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=285090

[Guybrush]

I am your hero. :D

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=285090

great!! ;) i'll look now :P

[neofix]

Nice:) Great work!

[helten2]

This confirms the previous analysis by Solopalmari (http://www.solopalmari.com/content/view/2471/38/) and confirms that the HTC P3600 actually contains a full (hardware) GPS solution. Only thing missing from the pictures is the RFR6250 chip that I presume is one of the two partially hidden chips in the upper part of the front board.

The RFR6250 chip contains the actual GPS-receiver: http://www.cdmatech.com/news/releases/2003/031106_rfr6250.jsp (could only find a press release).

The rest of the supplementary chips for the MSM6275 are present on the board: http://www.cdmatech.com/download_library/pdf/diagram_msm6275_cs.pdf

Now we are only waiting for that firmware update ;)

[neofix]

For you guys with a bit more tech-knowledge: Keen on filling us up on what the different parts do? :)

[IamGuest]

Only thing missing from the pictures is the RFR6250 chip that I presume is one of the two partially hidden chips in the upper part of the front board.

The RFR6250 chip contains the actual GPS-receiver: http://www.cdmatech.com/news/releases/2003/031106_rfr6250.jsp (could only find a press release).

I found that chip.

:)

[klavier]

The RFR6250 chip contains the actual GPS-receiver:

Does this mean that the Trinity has AGPS capability ONLY, and you'll still need an external GPS receiver?

[Guybrush]

Did you found the chip RGR6200 ?

[XenoV]

Does this mean that the Trinity has AGPS capability ONLY, and you'll still need an external GPS receiver?

No, the RFR6250 chip is the actual GPS receiver, so you will not need an external GPS receiver :D

[XenoV]

I am your hero. :D

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=285090

YESSS !!! YOU ARE !!!

[horatio.pants]

So to try and gauge whether HTC will ever enable this on the Trinity I'll ask a question about their past behaviour:
Has HTC ever officially released updated ROM's for it's other pda phones, and if so how many updates have they issued and how long since initial release did it take for the first?

[Guybrush]

the GPS receiver is "QUALCOMM’s RGR6200™ GPS radio receiver" this is integrate into RFR6250 chip... so no sirfstar III and no FM radio seem...
i'd like to know accuracy of qualcomm gps in standalone mode... because the only information i found is 5 meters in GpsOne mode with radio signals... :(

[adewidt]

Did you found the chip RGR6200 ?
You dont need the RGR6200.
The RGR6200 is build-in the RFR6250


The RFR6250 chip integrates the following – formerly separate – chips to create an advanced solution that reduces component count while maintaining a high level of performance:
QUALCOMM’s RFL6200™ low-noise amplifier (LNA)
QUALCOMM’s RFR6200™ receiver
QUALCOMM’s RGR6200™ GPS radio receiver

source (http://www.cdmatech.com/news/releases/2003/031106_rfr6250.jsp)

The diagram for the RFR6250
http://www.umtschips.com/images/block_diagrams/RFR6250.png

[Guybrush]

yes I know... I saw it before... but what about accuracy of this chipset ? It's a pitty there isn't a sirf star III... the same chips are also in HTC TyTN.

[adewidt]

yes I know... I saw it before... but what about accuracy of this chipset ? It's a pitty there isn't a sirf star III... the same chips are also in HTC TyTN.Good question,

I am still not sure if the RFR6250 can fully work as standalone GPS or need an extra chip like SirfStar III.

[XenoV]

Good question,

I am still not sure if the RFR6250 can fully work as standalone GPS or need an extra chip like SirfStar III.

The RFR6250 is a fully functional GPS receiver. The only additional component needed is the actual receiving antenna connected to the pre-LNA input.

[muxul_man]

Hello...
If you read carefully the text of both HTC, you will find something that's equal just with one difference... In the P3600 it's written the "HTC P3600 supports standalone GPS*" and in the HTC P3300 "Standalone GPS and TomTom NAVIGATOR 6". :confused:
So... let's wait...:rolleyes:

[Guybrush]

maybe there's some chip we can't see... but i don't believe there's another GPS except RFR6250.... as there isn't a FM radio on board :(

[remixme]

Direct links to pdf's.....
Pretty much confirming what we know already

General GpsOne info:
http://www.cdmatech.com/download_library/pdf/gpsone.pdf

MSM6275 info:
http://www.umtschips.com/download_library/pdf/msm6275_chipset.pdf

People might want to check in the TYTN thread as well for info on msm6275
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=279151

[sectorlord]

Im confused with this GPS thing ....?

Is the chip in question also found in Hermes ?

Will hermes also has the same GPS potential as Trinity ?

Wanted to buy the trinity as backup phone ... but wanbted to confirm the GPS thing ....

Will it have it later ?

Thanks

[mmone3]

Im confused with this GPS thing ....?

Is the chip in question also found in Hermes ?

Will hermes also has the same GPS potential as Trinity ?

Wanted to buy the trinity as backup phone ... but wanbted to confirm the GPS thing ....

Will it have it later ?

Thanks


From what I have read so far it looks like hermes is missing the RFR6250 chip which is the gps receiver.

[sectorlord]

...and trinity has this chip ?

[The_Stranger]

...and trinity has this chip ?

Apperently yes, the hero who dared open his trinity gave us some pics

http://forum.xda-developers.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31769&d=1165164947
(his pic, not mine)

[Gtot]

The chip is also present in the Hermes....

Gtot

[firstime911]

I wonder if this Trinity will have GPS,

the GPS chip speed (GPS usage) can be compare with Artemis?



I really confuse what to buy now between Artemis and Trinity -_-"

[Guybrush]

if you want buy just for GPS choose Artemis... the chip is much better... if you need umts choose trinity.

[victoradjei]

I wonder if this Trinity will have GPS,

the GPS chip speed (GPS usage) can be compare with Artemis?



I really confuse what to buy now between Artemis and Trinity -_-"

I bought artemis for now and waiting until Trinity gets GPS. UMTS is not an issue for me now:)

[firstime911]

Sorry what is UMTS??

[remixme]

Sorry what is UMTS??

Seriously.....but google and wikipedia are wonderful tools, please search before asking questions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMTS

[anonimo]

Sorry what is UMTS??

www.google.com

ops... I was slow...

[rodnav]

well... what's the verdict of the group? will it or will it not have gps built in???
in the process of replacing my benq p50...
trying to pick whether it's the hermes or the trinity...

[klavier]

I'm getting the Globalsat BT-359 GPS receiver whether the Trinity's internal GPS is activated or not. I just don't see how anything can be as accurate as SiRF III or Nemerex chipsets.

[XenoV]

well... what's the verdict of the group? will it or will it not have gps built in???
in the process of replacing my benq p50...
trying to pick whether it's the hermes or the trinity...

Just read the threat and you will know just as much as we do :)

[XenoV]

I'm getting the Globalsat BT-359 GPS receiver whether the Trinity's internal GPS is activated or not. I just don't see how anything can be as accurate as SiRF III or Nemerex chipsets.

Navigation packages work also very excellent with a little less accuracy (if this is noticable at all). The big point of the whole discussion is to have an in-build GPS which is much more convenient than an external GPS to carry around, charge etc.

[XenoV]

Latest official statement from HTC found in a Dutch forum:


The HTC P3600 currently does not offer GPS Functionality. There is a possibility of an update to enable the GPS functions of the device at a future date, and we hope to be able to do this as soon as possible, but we cannot and do not guarantee this. If you buy the P3600 for possible future GPS functionality, you do so entirely at your own risk.

Source: http://gathering.tweakers.net/forum/list_message/27076342#27076342

[Matterhorn]

Navigation packages work also very excellent with a little less accuracy (if this is noticable at all). The big point of the whole discussion is to have an in-build GPS which is much more convenient than an external GPS to carry around, charge etc.
Exactly, I already have a BT GPS. I'll use it in my car with the BT GPS on the dashboard. When I'm walking around I hope to be able to use the built-in GPS.

[saminegm]

Exactly, I already have a BT GPS. I'll use it in my car with the BT GPS on the dashboard. When I'm walking around I hope to be able to use the built-in GPS.

I have a car GPS built in my radio which has TMC and I use it for driving (because of TMC). I have a BT TomTom MkII which I used with my Axim and I am using it with my Trinity now. Works great biking or walking. Battery lasts quite long (at least a whole day) and its not heavy at all. I can recommend this solution. Of course having GPS internally activated would be nice....

[IamGuest]

The HTC P3600 currently does not offer GPS Functionality. There is a possibility of an update to enable the GPS functions of the device at a future date, and we hope to be able to do this as soon as possible, but we cannot and do not guarantee this. If you buy the P3600 for possible future GPS functionality, you do so entirely at your own risk.
Source: http://gathering.tweakers.net/forum/list_message/27076342#27076342


I got this info too.
Dopod International will send the Test Rom for me in Jan or Feb'07.
He said this rom will enable the GPS functions of this device (Dopod D810:Trinity).

I got ,you got. :)

[adewidt]

I got this info too.
Dopod International will send the Test Rom for me in Jan or Feb'07.
He said this rom will enable the GPS functions of this device (Dopod D810:Trinity).

I got ,you got. :)
Great news :)

[XenoV]

I got this info too.
Dopod International will send the Test Rom for me in Jan or Feb'07.
He said this rom will enable the GPS functions of this device (Dopod D810:Trinity).

I got ,you got. :)
Super news :D
Dopod=HTC so HTC has scheduled the software for jan/feb next year.
Thanks for sharing and we will look forward to your future postings !!

[Lucas0511]

Super news :D
Dopod=HTC so HTC has scheduled the software for jan/feb next year.
Thanks for sharing and we will look forward to your future postings !!

The new ROM with GPS functions enabled is under testing at Orange for few weeks already, but the "testing" phase could well extend into February, so no "official" release for quite a while. But I agree a test ROM would do for us :-))))

[SaarAvigour]

I'm following this discussion from starts, I agree that in as much as there's a HTC brochure mentioning black on white that GPS will be activated soon it will be (otherwise remember what happened to HP when promissing a 65K upgrade to their old Jornadas)...

But even say that 3600 has a GPSOne hardware inside, where would be the internal GPS Antenna... don't think there is one, neither I see any external socket for external patch Antenna... hmm ... hope it isn't a marketing spin after all..

=====
Saar

[Lucas0511]

I'm following this discussion from starts, I agree that in as much as there's a HTC brochure mentioning black on white that GPS will be activated soon it will be (otherwise remember what happened to HP when promissing a 65K upgrade to their old Jornadas)...

But even say that 3600 has a GPSOne hardware inside, where would be the internal GPS Antenna... don't think there is one, neither I see any external socket for external patch Antenna... hmm ... hope it isn't a marketing spin after all..

=====
Saar

Good point, the GPSone has three GPS modes, network, device-based, standalone. We might only see the modes required for A-GPS - the one function i.e. Orange is interested in, to make $$. And HTC could still claim to have enabled "GPS"-functions. Time will tell... :-)))

[zkip]

afaik a gps Antenna only needs be very small - may look like a 20mm square foil sheet stuck to the case or be as big as the pointy bit at the end of a stylus. some one else may know better.

[bouaroudj]

It is reported on this site that the GPS solution has been tested on the orange version, the qualcomm chip uses the com 9 port. It's also said that it's less accurate than the sirf star III :
http://www.mobinaute.com/mobinaute/article.php?id=20061207175319

[sectorlord]

Just browsing the Manual... and on the Table of content...

"A3 (appendix 3) - How to use the GPS"

But the page A3 is missing...

[anonimo]

Just browsing the Manual... and on the Table of content...

"A3 (appendix 3) - How to use the GPS"

But the page A3 is missing...

Not in the english version of the manual that can be downloaded from the HTC website. In that document appendix 3 is "Specifications".

[calvinyuen]

I bought HTC P3600 (D810) already. I am wondering why HTC disabled the GPS function of P3600. It didn't benefit to their product coz it can sell higher if P3600 enhanced with GPS function. I can't find any reason that HTC didn't release it.

But there are a lot of rumor keep stay around us, said the GPS function will enable soon by software upgrade. I would say that it may come from the related parties to drive us to buy it and wait for the G.... P.....S!

[mmone3]

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that someone leaks the orange gps enabled test...

[laurent865]

hello

rfr6250 http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/ensemble14.php

Hello everyone,


Here the photographs of the chip rfr6250 or must connect the antenna

rfr6250 http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/ensemble14.php

And here an overall picture on the 9600htc

http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/general1.php

Now which can say to me or I must weld the antenna ?

mail laurent865@hotmail.com

[adejager1]

hello

rfr6250 http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/ensemble14.php

Hello everyone,


Here the photographs of the chip rfr6250 or must connect the antenna

rfr6250 http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/ensemble14.php

And here an overall picture on the 9600htc

http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/general1.php

Now which can say to me or I must weld the antenna ?

mail laurent865@hotmail.com

??????

not quite getting the message? what do you want to weld and what for?

Like what you did to your trinity:D