Radio sudden death issue knowledge consolidation

[KarhU]

There have been multiple cases of Radios suddenly stopping to work lately. This is not related to NO GSM error as these occur while phone is in use and not while flashing.

Symptoms are as follows:

- Radio suddenly ceases to work (no signal with any SIM), or its condition deteriorates over the time.

- While trying to flash a different Radio ROM, the upgrade stops at 0% and bricks the device

- Devices can be recovered to operating state, however only OS is intact and GSM radio does not work.

- MTTY gives no feedback

- Information about device resembles these symptoms:

Radio Version : Nothing
Protocol Version: Nothing
IMEI : Nothing

Possible causes of this problem:

- Hardware fault
- Radio ROM corruption
- Bad blocks in NAND

This phenomena seems to be the new source of bricked Hermes devices and the number of occurences is growing.

Threads of people with this kind of bricks:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=346315
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=345230
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=347145
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=346894
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=338413
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=322587
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=325018
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=343260

There also were some threads with this issue in the Hermes WM6 forum.

What we do not know is:

- What was the last radio version those people used?
- Did they use custom ROMs or did it happen with official ROMs too?
- What do these cases have in common?
- Is it really a hardware fault (no results from the service centers so far)?
- Can something be done to prevent this kind of bricking?
- Anything that might help those people recover the phone capability of their devices.

Please share your knowledge about this problem so we can know what kills our device's radio.

Common symptoms:

ROM with radio (both official and unofficial) - flash stops at 12% (magic number?)
Radio ROM stops at 0%

[Asxetos]

After reading a lot about flashing - upgrading the Tytn, i think the first question to be answered is:

Has anyone with an official untouched device had the radio death situation??
(i.e never had any cooked-baked-boiled rom or radio other than the official flashed on the device)
On every incident i have read, there was at least one mentioning of "Unlock, SuperCID, HardSpl, cooked XXXX-WM6 rom, and so on.

Is it a coincidence?

Dont get me wrong, i my self love this forum and have used tools and roms many times (previously on my MDA Pro and now on my Tytn).

[chicharon]

my unit started the NO GSM syndrome just 3 days after i upgrade to 1.54.00 radio..

ROM without radio - flashes 100% working
ROM with radio (both official and unofficial) - flash stops at 12% (magic number?)

everyone else has thier rom + radio flash stop at 12%

[acr80]

I would add: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=343260

[KarhU]

First post updated with your comments&link.

[trion]

I opened mine this week, cleaned the inside and also taken the metal covers inside off. One very small chip looks like it has a little brown spot on it, like it has gotten too hot.

Don't know if this is the problem or not, but i think it has to do with the radio and that it's fried :(

my radio rom was 1.54 something i believe.

and before it broke my phone started to hang short times for a few weeks and when it got back the radio signal was also lost,so i guess it was starting to break down :(

now it is just a pda, i connect it to internet through my old phone, but it takes 5 minutes after turning on before it will use bluetooth, some programms also refuse to start in the first 5 minutes.

[sbrown138]

I have been seeing what I think is the beging of this issue. It started about a week or so ago, my phone locked up on a call so I soft reset it. IT cam back and I was able to use the phone again. About ten minutes later it locked again and this time when it came up my passcode would not work. After trying to log in 8 time it hard reset itself. I let it reset and then I upgraded my radio from 1.48 to 1.54.07.00 as I thought the radio was hanging the phone. A few days went by and everything was fine. Then I started to notice the radio was completely loosing signal and seeminlgy locking the phone. The only fix seemed to be a soft rest (at the time) This went on for a few days and eventually my password died again after a soft reset. and it hard reset me. At this point I upgraded from vp3G 3.0 to schapps 4.20 and 1.54.30.10 for the radio. Again it helped for a day or two maybe but it has not started to loose radio signal completely (no service and modem disconted error etc were I always have signal) I have tryed a few diffrent rom and radios in additon to all of these and still get the issues. Last night I got some more clues after installing the new google maps with the my location "soft gps". I was playing with it on my ride home folling my trip etc and about 25 min in my radio started acting up. This time the only thing that fixed the issue was to remove the battery and sim card and put them back in. I am startign to think this is a heat issue in one of the radio components. I also have a ruberized cover which could contrinute to a heat issue. Also for the record I have IPL-1.04 and SPL-2.10-0lipro.

Can anyone comment on ROM botloader etc AT&T would want to see on the phone if I got them to replace it? It is only like 3 months old.

[Prerna]

Ma

Great idea to open this post. Here's my experience of 2 issues I had this week:

First, I changed the ROM to HC Lite, and the Radio to 1.54.30 last week-end.Before that I never had an issue with GSM.

3 days later I operated a clean-up, using Oxios Close-Apps and Hybernate.1 or 2 hours later, the GSM signal disappeared, and the green button stopped responding. I also noticed I was unable to open "Contacts". Nothing would make it come back, not even a soft reset.

What I did is a Sprite backup, in case, then a hard reset. Everything was then back to normal, so I restored the backup, and it kept working! Now the sad part is that the exact very same event occurred today.

I'm a bit confused whether the issue is hardware related, or is it to do with the radio, the rom..? Anyway, I will right now change the Radio so as to see if any improvement. Your comments will surely be appreciated.

[sdemon]

It seems to be related to the newer radio versions. I am running the 1.47 that came with the official Dutch WM6 Rom and have had no problems what so ever with Schaps Rom. So my guess is that it is related to the 1.54 versions of the Radio.

Anyone had these problems with the older radio versions?

[blackout128]

Just thought I'd add some info to this topic. I have been running Radio 1.54.00.10 for about 1.5 months with Schaps 4.20 and vp3G's 3.62.3 and have not had any problems with reception, phone use, etc, but I ran 1.54.07.00 radio for 2 days and it was terrible.

It would hunt forever for a signal. If I went into a building and lost reception, I would have to soft reset to get a signal (after I left the building). I figured something was gonna get damaged(too much heat).

I don't know if anybody's experience with that version was as bad as mine, but I hope this problem can be narrowed down to a particular radio rom.

[Alcibiade]

I have been seeing what I think is the beging of this issue. It started about a week or so ago, my phone locked up on a call so I soft reset it. IT cam back and I was able to use the phone again. About ten minutes later it locked again and this time when it came up my passcode would not work. After trying to log in 8 time it hard reset itself. I let it reset and then I upgraded my radio from 1.48 to 1.54.07.00 as I thought the radio was hanging the phone. A few days went by and everything was fine. Then I started to notice the radio was completely loosing signal and seeminlgy locking the phone. The only fix seemed to be a soft rest (at the time) This went on for a few days and eventually my password died again after a soft reset. and it hard reset me. At this point I upgraded from vp3G 3.0 to schapps 4.20 and 1.54.30.10 for the radio. Again it helped for a day or two maybe but it has not started to loose radio signal completely (no service and modem disconted error etc were I always have signal) I have tryed a few diffrent rom and radios in additon to all of these and still get the issues. Last night I got some more clues after installing the new google maps with the my location "soft gps". I was playing with it on my ride home folling my trip etc and about 25 min in my radio started acting up. This time the only thing that fixed the issue was to remove the battery and sim card and put them back in. I am startign to think this is a heat issue in one of the radio components. I also have a ruberized cover which could contrinute to a heat issue. Also for the record I have IPL-1.04 and SPL-2.10-0lipro.

Can anyone comment on ROM botloader etc AT&T would want to see on the phone if I got them to replace it? It is only like 3 months old.


I had the same kind of behavior with mine. Radio was 1.47
After a few days of similar misbehavior... the radio died

[Alcibiade]

It seems to be related to the newer radio versions. I am running the 1.47 that came with the official Dutch WM6 Rom and have had no problems what so ever with Schaps Rom. So my guess is that it is related to the 1.54 versions of the Radio.

Anyone had these problems with the older radio versions?

Nope, I had it with 1.47 back 6 months ago...

[Alcibiade]

To me it is obviously hardware related: if I try to flash the radio 5 or 10 times I end up managing in flashing it (I have to try, retry, etc...) with another radio. However... I still have the No GSM issue, even after the new radio has been flashed
It's the best proof soemthing is broken inside, not just the radio

[eagercrow]

I had the same kind of behavior with mine. Radio was 1.47
After a few days of similar misbehavior... the radio died
I've had this issue with every radio after 1.47, and multiple cooked ROMS, I've tried every radio newer than 1.47 with a bunch of different ROMS. My phone hasn't died....yet but I wouldn't count on it in an emergency or any urgent situation.

I haven't even had this phone 1 year, no way I'm going to spend 300+ AGAIN because of a shitty HTC product.

What error messages are you guys getting?
I get (not verbatim) the following very often:
phone not ready, wait 15 seconds
answering modem has disconnected
(not a message) searching for signal
(not a message) no signal, just a ! in the signal meter
call not completed
(not a message) phone hangs when dialing a call
(not a message) received calls sent straight to voice mail when I have full signal, either a soft reset or attempt to make a call fix the problem. The attempt to make the call fails and the phone reconnects to the network.

I have noticed lately that I have less problems in 3G areas.

[zalees]

I've had this issue with every radio after 1.47, and multiple cooked ROMS, I've tried every radio newer than 1.47 with a bunch of different ROMS. My phone hasn't died....yet but I wouldn't count on it in an emergency or any urgent situation.

I haven't even had this phone 1 year, no way I'm going to spend 300+ AGAIN because of a shitty HTC product.

What error messages are you guys getting?
I get (not verbatim) the following very often:
phone not ready, wait 15 seconds
answering modem has disconnected
(not a message) searching for signal
(not a message) no signal, just a ! in the signal meter
call not completed
(not a message) phone hangs when dialing a call
(not a message) received calls sent straight to voice mail when I have full signal, either a soft reset or attempt to make a call fix the problem. The attempt to make the call fails and the phone reconnects to the network.

I have noticed lately that I have less problems in 3G areas.

I have the EXACT same problem as eagercrow. The only difference is that I HAVE NOT *repeat* HAVE NOT mod, or use any cooked ROMs. When i'm using WM5 and radio 1.04, the problem did happen very often. Then when the official WM6 witn radio 1.47 release by HTC, i flash it straight away. It clears all the problem for a few month but some of the problem start to appear since last month:

answering modem has disconnected
call not completed
(not a message) phone hangs when dialing a call
(not a message) received calls sent straight to voice mail when I have full signal, either a soft reset or attempt to make a call fix the problem. The attempt to make the call fails and the phone reconnects to the network.

It happen in any area with weak network (less than 4 bar/full), either 2G, 3G or 3.5G.

For answering modem disconneted, i have to shut down the phone and remove the battery to solve he problem. I must say that the problem may be due to heat. Since when i using it as a modem, the phone gets pretty hot.

I wonder why since i'm using the official ROM only (i've never use any cooked ROM). Even HTC servrice center can't really solve the problem. (my phone board controller was faulty and HTC changed it for me. After that all those problem just vanish for a few month). HTC says its normal!. I paid almost USD600 for the phone. I'm thinking of getting O2 but my friend says he had almost similar problem.

Wonder why......

[eagercrow]

I forgot to add one more problem to the list, phone sometimes will not disconnect from a call, I have to soft reset

[sbrown138]

What error messages are you guys getting?
I get (not verbatim) the following very often:
phone not ready, wait 15 seconds
answering modem has disconnected
(not a message) searching for signal
(not a message) no signal, just a ! in the signal meter
call not completed
(not a message) phone hangs when dialing a call
(not a message) received calls sent straight to voice mail when I have full signal, either a soft reset or attempt to make a call fix the problem. The attempt to make the call fails and the phone reconnects to the network.


I get most if not all of these 'errors'.

[sbrown138]

I forgot to add one more problem to the list, phone sometimes will not disconnect from a call, I have to soft reset

I get this one alot! But first it drops the actual call then just hangs the dialer.

[eagercrow]

two more to the list:
- long error message about the number not being right or something
- call not completed

I get this one alot! But first it drops the actual call then just hangs the dialer.
Yeah that is what is happening with mine, the phone call is ended but you wouldn't know it by looking at the phone.

[ai6908]

Well i didn't do my searching right, so i posted my issue in a new thread...:(

My issue is almost the same...It all started with BT getting disconnected from headset, and only soft reset will connect again...and then, radio started to act up. Phone went to sleep one night, and the next stay when i tried to wake it up, it wont wake up. Had to reset it to wake it up...it came back up, but when i plugged it to the puter, the puter wont recognize it. Here is what has happened so far...

1. GSM works after soft reset, and when on phone the phone freezes. Soft reset is the only option...(call is continued until soft reset)

2. BT will disconnect and will take forever to start up

3. Phone will not be recognized by PC (USB device not recognized error)

3. Can flash OS, Splash screens, ext ROM using SD flash method, but will not flash OS with GSM...hangs about as soon as it starts GSM (about 12%)

4. GSM, protocol numbers are still intact:confused:

My phone is less than 2 months old and i didn't get my phone through AT&T, so no warranty...kinda screwed eh:mad: I think this is a hardware problem...

[sbrown138]

I am nearly sure this is a hardware issue. My phone is only a few months old, does anyone know how AT&T is about replacing phones? And how I need to return the phone ROM/Radio wise?

[eagercrow]

radio completely died last night, none of the fixes I've found solve this problem:(

edit....Just got off the phone with att. I've had this phone for about 8 months and they are going to send me a replacement (refirb), I will be charged about $500 is they find I've messed up the phone, which sucks cause it is missing the warranty sticker over the torx screw, and has a modified OS ROM on the phone, somehow I need to change the ROM back to an official rom, but I'm having trouble finding any without the radio, since the radio can't be flashed.

[berdinkerdickle]

I've had this issue with every radio after 1.47, and multiple cooked ROMS, I've tried every radio newer than 1.47 with a bunch of different ROMS. My phone hasn't died....yet but I wouldn't count on it in an emergency or any urgent situation.

I haven't even had this phone 1 year, no way I'm going to spend 300+ AGAIN because of a shitty HTC product.

What error messages are you guys getting?
I get (not verbatim) the following very often:
phone not ready, wait 15 seconds
answering modem has disconnected
(not a message) searching for signal
(not a message) no signal, just a ! in the signal meter
call not completed
(not a message) phone hangs when dialing a call
(not a message) received calls sent straight to voice mail when I have full signal, either a soft reset or attempt to make a call fix the problem. The attempt to make the call fails and the phone reconnects to the network.

I have noticed lately that I have less problems in 3G areas.

Ditto!
To Everything!

I guess I will give Radio 1.47 a try again.
But, just as others have said, I think it's Hardware related.

[sbrown138]

Def hardware, I am now getting NO GSM on reboot about one in 3 times. I will call AT&T for a replacement, but I need to roll back the rom and spl first.

[max414]

radio completely died last night, none of the fixes I've found solve this problem:(

edit....Just got off the phone with att. I've had this phone for about 8 months and they are going to send me a replacement (refirb), I will be charged about $500 is they find I've messed up the phone, which sucks cause it is missing the warranty sticker over the torx screw, and has a modified OS ROM on the phone, somehow I need to change the ROM back to an official rom, but I'm having trouble finding any without the radio, since the radio can't be flashed.
Let me add my experience as well...I have radio 1.54.30...so far i havent encountered any bad flashing...but my phone works for some time like a day or two and then it starts behaving abnormally..it will keep searching for a signal or it will show ! mark....then i softreset again and agian to get the signals back and working ....
And it will just keep on searching for signals if i put a simcard other than my current operator....i dont think it is hardware because my hermes is new and has never fallen down:confused::(Should i try 1.47?

[watchdog2003]

Low on phone credit I swapped my T-Mobile SIM card from my T-Mobile MDA Vario II with O2 phone in credit SIM from BlueAngel (XDA IIs)

Result was that O2 SIM works fine in T-Mobile Vario II. However, T-Mobile SIM will not phone connect to network when installed in BlueAngel (albeit WM6 ROM is MDA III).

Upgraded BlueAngel Radio from v1.12 to v1.15 no netwrk discovered when T-Mobile SIM installed.

Restored unlocked SIM cards to T-Mobile and O2 device and both SIM cards find their networks and normal operation

[zim2dive]

I've had several instances of lockup during a call since going to 1.54.30.. the PDA still responds (I think), but the call (in progress) refuses to disconnect and no sounds gets thru.

I have to reset to clear things up. So far that has worked.. now this worries me it could be a questionable radio that is a SW issue that creates a HW issue (by over-heating, or something).. I may roll back to a previous radio.

Mike

[eagercrow]

I don't think it is the radio ROM, I think it is radio hardware. I got my new phone and immediately upgraded to the new ROM and radio available (for a limited time) on the HTC site, so far everything is working perfectly and my calls are very clear and crisp.

It was a hassle getting this done with ATT as they transfered me about 4 times and each time tried to walk me through their "trouble shooting steps". I would say the hassle was definitely worth it though. For any of you under 1 year with this phone give them a call and get a replacement.

[berdinkerdickle]

I'm going to give this a try for awhile (see attached pic)

The theory is that if the radio is fixed to a Band (Not 'Auto')
It won't start searching for a better signal when it gets down to zero bars.
Because with me, if it starts 'Searching' I might as well cycle the Radio (on/off) because it will give up and leave me with 'No Service'

For example; if you look at the pic and notice the 'G' (No Edge), this is where my phone would start searching and then give up. But with this setup it goes back up in bars (and back to 'E') when I return to an area with a better signal.

This is by far the solution, but I am way past my warranty, and I can't afford another phone right now.

I do think there seems to be a common thread among most of us who began to have this issue. In my search of the forums, I've noticed that most of us who are having this trouble, gave 1.54 a try, and since then, no matter what radio we try, we just don't get back to the quality of reception we had before.

My suggestion to all; If Your Reception is Good don't mess with it!
Don't be tempted to try the Latest Radio. If it's not broken - don't fix it!

[Prerna]

I do think there seems to be a common thread among most of us who began to have this issue. In my search of the forums, I've noticed that most of us who are having this trouble, gave 1.54 a try, and since then, no matter what radio we try, we just don't get back to the quality of reception we had before.

I also had this feeling, although it's hard to understand how this can affect some and not others.

[max414]

so should i give 1.47 a try??is that the best with battery and reception?

[indie]

I've had several instances of lockup during a call since going to 1.54.30.. the PDA still responds (I think), but the call (in progress) refuses to disconnect and no sounds gets thru.

I have to reset to clear things up. So far that has worked.. now this worries me it could be a questionable radio that is a SW issue that creates a HW issue (by over-heating, or something).. I may roll back to a previous radio.

Mike


I had the same issue. Clean the sim with an eraser. It worked for me. No more problems

[zim2dive]

I had the same issue. Clean the sim with an eraser. It worked for me. No more problems

roger.. I'll give that a shot.. I rolled back to 1.54.07 already, so it'll be hard to compare (I don't remember problems with 07... shrug)

Mike

[Maddog468]

I'm having the same problem. Started off with me just disabling the 3g on the phone through the comm manger, Then I would be able to connect with edge and would be able to use the phone as well.

Now only the phone works and I cannot even connect to the internet. I keep getting the answering modem has disconnected... if I try to connect with 3g. If I turn off 3g then I can connect with the edge.

I have tried flash new roms and radios but still the same.

Do you think it could be a hardware issue.

Using satinlight
radio 1.48.00.00

Thanks

Scott

[berdinkerdickle]

I'm having the same problem. Started off with me just disabling the 3g on the phone through the comm manger, Then I would be able to connect with edge and would be able to use the phone as well.

Now only the phone works and I cannot even connect to the internet. I keep getting the answering modem has disconnected...

I have tried flash new roms and radios but still the same.

Do you think it could be a hardware issue.

Using satinlight
radio 1.48.00.00

Thanks

Scott

If you're using isp, try switching to wap. If you're already using wap, try using opendns.
If your already using opendns, try using 'server-assigned'

[Maddog468]

I am using old at&t.

What would the settings be for using wap or open dns just "proxy" like in the other set ups.

Thank you

Scott

[MetroKnight]

You can add me as member of this exclusive club! i also think it has to do with 1.54.x

I did notice that my phone was getting hot, but thought that was only when I plugged it in for too long.

If there's no way around this, and it doesn't seem like there is, my only option to go for the 8925/tilt/kaiser but it's so freaking expensive! I'll have to get my 8125 back from a buddy of mine to be able to function. Too bad the screen doesn't work on it.

[chamelion]

And add me too! wow, this is crazy, it's an epidemic. i haven't touched / upgraded anything in a couple of weeks now. i noticed the phone had switched itself off, i rebooted, it said no radio. i'm thinking to myself oh boy, here we go again (this happened to me about 5 months ago, once again not during flashing.) i tried flashing to the latest radio rom which bricked my device. i'm currently trying to go through the http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1162054#post1162054 post (still downloading and installing) to see if i can at least get into windows so i can do a roll-back of my ROM and SPL...

[PAPPL]

I do have 1.54.07.00 Radio since release, and still no problems.

Maybe it's another cause, maybe somebody can test this:
-Tried another SIM already?
-Tried reflash Hard-SPL (2.10) and OS and then Radio? Maybe ROM memory lost a bit information and this causes the problem. I had this problem once with a mp3-player from creative. Always died after some seconds, then i reflashed the Software and okay again. If SPL starts the Radio maybe it can help to reflash SPL only for testing.

:confused: This is really a strange thing.

[Alcibiade]

I left it several months in a corner of my appartment. Was so pissed off about it I just didnt want to touch it again
However I wanted to test some ROMs and thought I should go with the phone with the broken radio (If I fuck up something else... I just dont care !!)
I didnt want to take out the SIM from my phone so I just put another crappy SIM card (An old one I had from France (Living in Japan right now))
My phone is not unlocked, so the phone complained, etc, etc...
And then I thought about... trying with my original SIM again. Miracle... the phone works perfectly
Not sure it si the SIM switch (Could also be the fact I left the phone several months without battery) however I suspect that the SIM swicth reinitialized something (In the past I managed to get some life from my dead radio by taking out the SIM and puting it back again)
Now my phone works perfectly
I suggest to anybody who may have broken its radio to try one of his friends SIM and then revert to his own SIM. He may have a happy surprise (Btw I am selling a Hermes now... :) )

[Kedi]

The unbeatable member of No GSM is here :)
I flashed a ROM with no radio, this one here [19/08/07 Released] .:: TNT 2.0 Series ::. (Official/Professional).

After flashing i noticed my Trion was getting very hot 2-3 times and i flashed back to official O2 ROM and leave it that way.
Since then i didnt flashed any ROM or Radio updates.
Suddenly it showed No GSM if i reseted it.
Sometimes it was ok for 10 minutes and sometimes i had to reset 100 times before i get any call.
Now i try to flash radio ROM`s with no help.

After 1 month i can flash almost nothing (except ROM`s with no radio).
The official O2 WM6 ROM stops at 12%
and the WM5 ROM at 13%

Flashing from SD card is also impossible when it begin to flash the GSM part it stops and nothing happens (for some hours...).

As you can see i didnt flash 1.54xxx and have problems.
So i would say its not the 1.54 xxx part.

Today i gave it to O2 to repair it.
24€ to send it to the repair service if it cost too much and i dont want it repaired i have to pay 22€ to get it back.
Lets see :)

I want a Orbit 2 anyway because i need navigation and UMTS (and a phone ;)).

[chamelion]

question to all you no radio users - are you using the standard battery that came with the phone or the extended battery?

i bought the extended life battery a few months ago and definitely noticed a temperature increase of the phone. wonder if there's a correlation?

[Kedi]

i use/d the standard battery bought it updated OS only and problems :D

[Alcibiade]

Standard battery

[christonge]

Standard battery also...

I haven´t touch my Hermes for almost 2 months now after the No GSM appeared after a soft reset. I had previously upgraded the radio to 1.54 and had noticed some heat so downgraded but just 3 days later the No GSM issue appeared. I´m not sure it´s this radio that´s the problem more than the fact perhaps something is fried. It´s definately hardware as any fix (and I spent days trying!!!) hasn´t brought it back to life.
I have been using the device for VOIP calls at home and the OS works fine. I will try with a different SIM to see, if like Alcibiade, it can be brought back from the dead :rolleyes:

[Prerna]

Ma

Great idea to open this post. Here's my experience of 2 issues I had this week:

First, I changed the ROM to HC Lite, and the Radio to 1.54.30 last week-end.Before that I never had an issue with GSM.

3 days later I operated a clean-up, using Oxios Close-Apps and Hybernate.1 or 2 hours later, the GSM signal disappeared, and the green button stopped responding. I also noticed I was unable to open "Contacts". Nothing would make it come back, not even a soft reset.

What I did is a Sprite backup, in case, then a hard reset. Everything was then back to normal, so I restored the backup, and it kept working! Now the sad part is that the exact very same event occurred today.

I'm a bit confused whether the issue is hardware related, or is it to do with the radio, the rom..? Anyway, I will right now change the Radio so as to see if any improvement. Your comments will surely be appreciated.

Hi, here's a happy feedback, after running no trouble since about 3 weeks.

What did I do? I downgraded my Radio to 1.50.00.00, changed the ROM from HC Lite (could it be the culprit?) to Schap's 4.22, and least but not least, the SIM.

I can' tell for sure what was causing the problem; I'm glad enough that my Hermes is back to normal (so far...)

All the best to get it cured as well. After all how could it be that so many of us suddenly experience a hardware failure?

[Alcibiade]

Suddenly back to NO GSM after ome week
Crap phone... Definitely a Hardware issue I would say... Probably long inactivity made it work again and then after using a bit too much back to death...
What pisses me off is to be stuck without being able to use any warranty, while obviously the problem doesnt come from any flashing but from HTC wrong hardware...

[yurz]

From reading this thread it looks there seems to be a problem with the radio on this device. Mine's went dead bout 3 weeks ago. It's a dopod 838 pro. What's worse no phone repair shop would even want to attempt to repair the device as obviously they do not know what exactly is the problem. It's a shame as I was starting to love this phone, in fact I am a convert from symbian to Windows phone. But this problem really changed my perspective. BTW had this phone bout 6 months only :( :(

[Mikeapollo]

This is a very weird epidemic... Before people start slating the hardware I'm not convinced that this is a problem caused by "crap radio hardware" otherwise we would have a lot more dead hermes out there than there is now...

It appears from reading the threads about people who've bricked with this problem that one of the radio roms (1.50+?) is making a change somewhere which is damaging the hardware.

Bearing in mind whenever a firmware update "improves" reception it is driving the radio hardware FPGA chip differently it may be a case that simply, the newer radios are "overdriving" the hardware therefore killing it. You can, after all, only turn the wick up so high :eek:

What we could do with is to know what radios have been flashed onto the affected devices previously (not just the current radio) and for the new owners who've had their machines "die" - how new were they? Were they the latest rom images or were they modified etc..?

Just my thoughts...

[ai6908]

Wonder how many people had 1.54 radio before their hardware died!! Kahru can you create a poll for this in this thread? Thanks

[Mikeapollo]

Wonder how many people had 1.54 radio before their hardware died!! Kahru can you create a poll for this in this thread? Thanks

Looks like there is another case brewing here (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1784605#post1784605)

This users post is apparently showing the same early signs so I've asked them to provide a little more information...

[Prerna]

It's tempting for me too to think 1.54 is a possible culprit, although so many installed it without complaint (as seen on 1.54 thread)

[ai6908]

It's tempting for me too to think 1.54 is a possible culprit, although so many installed it without complaint (as seen on 1.54 thread)

Agree there are many people with 1.54, so I really cant say for sure it is the radio...if it is really 1.54 that makes it bad, then everything out there with 1.54 will go bad.


Life of a device if always different from each other, maybe 1.54 makes them go bad which on on its edge.

In my case, i was running 1.54 for couple or three days, didnt like the reception in my area, so went back to 1.47.

[sbirsen]

I can tell you all for sure that this has definitely got nothing to do with version 1.54. Maybe 1.50 xxx and upwards...Or HardSPL etc..

I had the official WM5 T-Mobile UK ROM for 8 months, and everything worked fine until I started installing cooked and official WM6 ROMs. I never even tried 1.54 and still always have the exact same problems as everybody else on this thread whatever ROM and radio version I try (like loosing signal, '!' signs,'No IMEI', 'Phone not ready', calls going to voice mail... etc). I never tried HTC lite, but did install some of the other cooked ROMs, both with and without radio

I since have bought a Vario III (Kaiser) and I'm using it with the same SIM without problems.

So to summarize, the SIM, HTC lite or any other ROM or radio 1.54 are not the problem. I tried reverting back to the official T-Mobile WM5 & WM6 ROMs without success, it always works for a few days and then starts screwing up again.

[sbrown138]

I did not start running 1.54 until after the issue started so I have a hard time believing that 1.54 caused this issue.

[Mikeapollo]

I can tell you all for sure that this has definitely got nothing to do with version 1.54. Maybe 1.50 xxx and upwards...Or HardSPL etc..

Ok.. So you're a hardware designer within HTC then that knows exactly whats inside the radio firmware and the tolerances of the radio hardware? :eek:

Also, one of your previous posts here states that you had "no problems until you upgraded to radio 1.50" (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1492623#post1492623) so shall I add you to the list of dying Hermes running a 1.5x radio?

NO-ONE can tell for sure until there is more facts about this problem and to say catagorically there isn't a problem (or to catagorically say there is for that matter) is irresponsible at this stage.

OS images, Hard SPL etc certainly do not cause any GSM issues on their own - they are tried and tested and been around too long - however what needs to be investigated is :
* Radio in use when machine died and circumstances of death
* OS ROM and radio combination
* Hardware modifications
* Age of device
* Location, network and band behaviour.

Also, some "problems" with missed calls, dropped data and dialing problems etc are well known and well discussed on T-Mobile UK's 3G, EDGE and HSDPA network which has (since birth) suffered some problems in some cells with calls not getting through, failed calls etc. There are threads documenting this, T-Mobile are aware of this and these issues do not occur when on the GSM/GPRS band.

There are a lot of variables to research at the moment and it's only FAIR to state that there has been a large number of dead GSM's recently and they all have a lot in common. A lot more since October than during the rest of 2007 (as posted on this board and around the usenet).

Look at the deaths posted here since the end of November - only ONE was NOT using a 1.54.xx.xx radio.. (see attached table - ASCII format).

As ai6908 stated in his post - if it is a bad radio, we will see ever more of these failures and a trend *will* ultimately become clearer - and as he's also pointed out (and as I said in my original warning) IF there is a problem it may only happen under certain circumstances.

There have been too many "co-incidences" recently and all I (and others) are saying is to be careful until more details are known. Too many people have become "flash happy" and then cry about the devices being crap when problems could have been avoided *IF* people did their research properly first.

[Mikeapollo]

It's tempting for me too to think 1.54 is a possible culprit, although so many installed it without complaint (as seen on 1.54 thread)

Yup :( I tend to agree that it can't just be 1.5x.xx/1.54.xx on it's own - something else must be happening - some circumstance that's common - but whatever is happening, it's happening in the radio PGA and it fatal.

Now I have some specific cases to study and have some updated info in this thread (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1787110#post1787110). Very long post but trends are starting to appear.

I've spent nearly 15 solid hours now looking at peoples comments on the 1.54,xx radios and cross-referencing individuals users posts from other threads to find common issues - Possibly the same amount of time I spent here yesterday and will probably spend here tomorrow (not working until Monday!)

Thats why I got a bit heated with sbirsen's comments below (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1785970#post1785970) - who is a classic case in point when you look through his history of posts here (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1486411#post1486411) (when first trying 1.50 and finding problems that he couldn't resolve) and here where rollbacks to anything fail (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1492623#post1492623) -
Happy hermies until 1.50 then problems regardless of ROM/radio installed and apparently no knowledge (at the time - but prolly learnt lots now) that OS/RIL are separate and can suffer separate issues yet was happy to dismiss everything as OK with 1.54 as he buggered his hermes with 1.50! We're all safe to 1.54 and suffer the same fate he suffered if a bug is indeed present :rolleyes:

His post wasn't helpful, and was irresponsibly dismissive when a problem is trying to be researched to prevent people innocently killing their devices and it's the sort of thing that generates a flamewar - and I need to keep my temper a bit :o as I assume it was a comment made in good faith from someone who doesn't understand what we're talking about... And ironically a good case study that at least made me smile after 15 hrs sat on this terminal :p

[neshke]

I have hermes 200 with radio 1.54.30.10
and naked rom 3.62 for about 30 days testing it and I have no problems
except when changing from 3G to EDGE , radio needs to much time to switch from 3G to EDGE and reverse ,
This can be because network provider I don't know.

[Prerna]

@ Mikeappollo, your study and works on this topic are really impressive, and come right on time. Thanks a lot for that, and keep up with the great job!

[Mikeapollo]

Ok... bit more information coming to light when drilling into this.

My thinking is if there is a bug in this radio it will be something to do with the PIC16LF72 chip with the D/A and A/D stuff that drives and measures outputs from the phyiscal hardware radio chips (the Qualcomm ones and the Anadigics amplifiers) on the main mobo and stores/executes the radio firmware.


A small firmware bug affecting values returned from D/A and A/D measurements
This bug or whatever causes either false return values or bad data
This causes radio to work harder
This then either causes wear or heat based issues on the PIC effecting the storage area and causing bad blocks (death) or causes damage to the rest of the radio chipset (qualcomm and anadigics amps).


SOME users who have nearly dead radios after an encounter with 1.5x radio are reporting lots of bad blocks when testing with the radio bootloader before their radio completely snuffed it. These radios accept either a full flash or part of a flash but still have "NO GSM", imei etc, or same problem as before flash (intermittent issues etc).

The potential fixes to try are at the bottom of this post for the people not technically interested and want hands on only. for the rest of us who are interested in the technicals of this problem please use your knowledge to either add to this theory or rip it apart publically. - It is one of a number of possible scenarios for this issue and is a long shot but you'll know sort-of what I'm getting at if you've dealt with temperamental or old programmable logic arrays or field programmable proms etc.

To define nearly dead radio :


Accepts radio flash with no errors but still has "NO GSM" OR
Has GSM but no network lock - Can SOMETIMES after a long time or many *many* reboots "regain" a signal for a short period BUT the moment the device is attempted to be used for anything radio-based it vanishes again into never-ending loop of searching for network for hours/days. OR
Accepts part of a flash and gets stuck - radio bootloader reports BAD blocks when queried.


With nearly dead radios a problem therefore could (potentially) be one of three things :

Seriously corrupt PLA storage (bad blocks causing errors - possbily recoverable)
Fried physical radio hardware (possibly from running corrupted radio) - Unfixable
Or a combination of both (one causing the other so to speak).


I'm thinking of two scenarios (and accompanying theories) that I've seen in another device (which, OK was a telecoms router but hey - you've seen one programmable chip you've seen them all!)

Scenario 1.

Bug in firmware somewhere within radio
Bug "overdrives" hardware by whatever means generating a heat/wear issue (actual overdrive or "invisible" restart(RTE)/re-connects/disconnects stressing hardware)
Heat/wear issue (due to proximetry) starts cooking the PLA where firmware is held
This causes intermittent "false" bad blocks leading to unpredictable radio behaviour/drop outs/etc
A rest period resolves issues temporarily but they will return
The now already unstable radio behaves even more erratically driving the radio hardware more (as it keeps loosing signal lock due to false bad blocks in radio and it therefore "crashing" and restarting the radio hardware) thus generating more heat and wear
PLA chip over time in this condition now has *real* bad blocks as is damaged OR radio hardware burns out (whichever effectively wears out first)

Scenario 2.

Logical bad block appears in PLA (bad addressing by bootloader passing ROM image to radio bootloader for writing / maybe just old age / whatever)
--branch--
2a --> Bad block appears in critical area (imei/etc) --> kills GSM but accepts flash
2b --> Bad block appears in critical CODE area
eg. 1 Radio bootloader - GSM no longer flashable as SPL can't parse instruction and code to write to IPL and vice versa)
eg. 2 Stored environment "variable" in rom image (physical radio driver properties - ie. clock rate/power output/etc - a variable that may change from rom to rom but not (obviously) a variable that is changed by firmware, OS or anything else :D - You know what I mean )
eg. 3 Multiple bad blocks

In Scenario 1 - We have the classic software bug killing hardware. Symptoms are intermittent grow with age. As they become more frequent and unless action is taken real damage is then done until it reaches a point where massive hardware failure occurs (radio hardware) or PLA is damaged or a critical block goes bad therefore killing the radio bootloader and killing GSM. If this is therefore caught early enough and rectified it is possible that the device may be recoverable.

In Scenario 2 - We have a small hardware issue caused by whatever means which introduces ONE bad block leading to a 2a or 2b situation.
in 2a - Bad block appears in an area where code is stored that is critical to the operation of the radio but NOT critical some parts of the radio bootloader, therefore a flash appears to be accepted but radio won't work because block is bad. This may possibly be recoverable.

in 2b - eg.1 GSM now unable to accept flash - Radio unable to be written to PLA therefore module killed. No fix
in 2b - eg.2 GSM hardware could be fried by incorrect driving over time (causes scenario 1) - Possible limited recovery if dealt with when symptoms first start - not fixable once fully died.
in 2b - eg.3 - speaks for itself - bad blocks developed all over - Nothing will work. Radio dead.

Potential fix for not /quite/ dead hermes

IN ALL 3 OF THE FIXES BELOW - COOL THE DEVICE DOWN SLIGHTLY (removing the battery first!) BY PUTTING IT IN THE FRIDGE FOR 10-15mins - DO NOT FREEZE IT (your radio is already frozen anyway - ho ho ho:D )

Pot. Fix 1 : Users who still "HAVE GSM" but don't signal lock for hours or only remain locked for short periods and while locked find the signal they have is useless. (ie - not quite dead hermes - symptom of a brewing problem)


Take battery out of your phone for a few mins - then boot it up again
Get the PC ready to flash either radio 1.43 or 1.47 (any flavour) DO NOT USE ANY 1.5x.xx RADIOS!
Connect it up (let it sync etc)
Watch your phone carefully for when it gets a signal (this could be a long time) - do NOT attempt to use your phone when signal pops up.
The MOMENT it gets a signal, start the radio flash.
Wait for signal again and flash it again IMMEDIATELY without restarting it
Disconnect, power off, disconnect battery and soft reset.


Pot. Fix 2 : Users who have NO GSM who's device accepts radio flash without errors.


Flash radio 1.43 OR 1.47 *three times* without manually rebooting (if possible)
Power off, disconnect battery and soft reset.


Pot. Fix 3 : Users who have NO GSM who's device is UNABLE to radio flash without errors past the first few %.


Flash radio 1.43 OR 1.47
On error - flash radio again (avoid restarting if possible but you may have to)
Try a further 2 times - it will now either accept flash on last attempt or will not accept flash. If it accepts flash, flash it again then Power off, disconnect battery and restart it.


Sounds crazy - worth a shot. Give it a try - and let us know what it does. If this works please let me know ASAP (PM me if necessary) - I'll also then send you my paypal address for a donation to my current "I'm unemployed again cos Barclays were <insert expletive here>" fund :D If we can get one device working from someone trying this then it's a good use of my vast quantities of free time :o

Quick note about the logic behind this : All programmable function chips can develop "logical marked bad blocks" - some /can/ (and are!) recovered by rewriting them once or twice in quick succession with an identical image preferably without hard power cycling inbetween writes. "False" bad blocks therefore may be recovered. "HARD" bad blocks sadly won't be. The fridge thing - well cooled PGAs generally "accept" a state change in each "pocket" more efficiently at low temperatures than warm ones. The opposite to write-only PROMS which used to like being blown straight out of the lab oven (or at least 15 mins under a 100w bulb!)

Good luck - PS. If any tech support desk needs a bum on seat in either North-West or the South East of the UK - I am now OFFICIALLY AVAILABLE FOR HIRE as I'm officially unemployed from tomorrow morning! I don't have a degree so never get through the paper sift (hence unemployed) but do have the experience and skills and plenty of developers certificates..I-thank-you.

[max414]

Potential fix for not /quite/ dead hermes

IN ALL 3 OF THE FIXES BELOW - COOL THE DEVICE DOWN SLIGHTLY (removing the battery first!) BY PUTTING IT IN THE FRIDGE FOR 10-15mins - DO NOT FREEZE IT (your radio is already frozen anyway - ho ho ho:D )

Pot. Fix 1 : Users who still "HAVE GSM" but don't signal lock for hours or only remain locked for short periods and while locked find the signal they have is useless. (ie - not quite dead hermes - symptom of a brewing problem)
Take battery out of your phone for a few mins - then boot it up again
Get the PC ready to flash either radio 1.43 or 1.47 (any flavour) DO NOT USE ANY 1.5x.xx RADIOS!
Connect it up (let it sync etc)
Watch your phone carefully for when it gets a signal (this could be a long time) - do NOT attempt to use your phone when signal pops up.
The MOMENT it gets a signal, start the radio flash.
Wait for signal again and flash it again IMMEDIATELY without restarting it
Disconnect, power off, disconnect battery and soft reset.I probably lie in this category,But i am a bit different than others..I have no problems with (Waridtel)but i get infinite search for signal on (Ufone)..Is there any logical reason behind this?I mean the same radio runs good for one network and not for the other?Well both are gsm..
Could you elaborate these steps?
What if the phone doest catch the signal?i have to flash it twice?Should i allow the device to reboot after one successful flash?How can I disconnect battery and do a soft reset without a battery?:confused:I know i am being stupid..:cool:

Was using 1.54 before and had the same prob and using 1.47 these days but the prob lies there...

[Mikeapollo]

I probably lie in this category,But i am a bit different than others..I have no problems with (Waridtel) but i get infinite search for signal on (Ufone)..Is there any logical reason behind this? I mean the same radio runs good for one network and not for the other?Well both are gsm..
Could you elaborate these steps?
What if the phone doest catch the signal?i have to flash it twice?Should i allow the device to reboot after one successful flash?How can I disconnect battery and do a soft reset without a battery?:confused:I know i am being stupid..

I'm very tired having been up for over 24hrs and esp after that last post so forgive me if I come over a little blunt :eek:

You DO NOT fall into this catagory - here's why :

1) Networks vary and different networks work differently - thats why they compete with each other for your hard earned cash. If your phone works fine with one network with no issues at all - but doesn't work on another and this is repeated in many different locations (not just your home cell) then it's either an issue with the network OR you haven't got a radio optimised for both. That's why different network operators ROMs have different radio rom updates in them:D That's your logical reason for what you are seeing. I'm in the UK and have no access to either of your networks so can not directly test or help you by explaining the differences between them as I have no access to either networks technical data (and my test kit wouldn't stretch from my desk here anyway :D )

2) If your radio is running fine on at least one network with no issues at all then you do NOT have sudden radio death nor a symptom of it. If it was running poorly and behaving the same on BOTH or MANY networks after trying many different radios then could be a symptom of something very wrong but you do not have this problem either. From what you've said it is not showing symptoms of sudden death.

3) The steps are quite simple - but in your case you DO NOT need to perform this operation, it will NOT cure your problem and it would probably cause more harm than good. (too many unnecessary radio flashes are baaaaaad)

Thank you and goodni... oh bugger it - I've missed night and it's clearly starting to be day outside *again* <groans>

PS. If any tech support desk needs a bum on seat in either North-West or the South East of the UK - I am now OFFICIALLY AVAILABLE FOR HIRE as I'm officially unemployed from tomorrow morning! I don't have a degree so never get through the paper sift (hence unemployed) but do have the experience and skills and plenty of developers certificates..I-thank-you.

[max414]

what if both the networks work fine on my friends hermes?his radio is 1.16..

Want to add a ittle more,while i was using 1.54.30 i was able to get signals of ufone after waiting for almost 8 hrs..but whenever i placed a call or a sms it would just get buggy and i had to softreset and then it would again start searching for signal.But eversince i downgraded to 1.47 my phone couldnt get ufone signals no matter how long it keeps on searching for signals..
Is there anything i can try before blaming my operator for all the fuss?

[Mikeapollo]

what if both the networks work fine on my friends hermes?his radio is 1.16.. <snipsnipsnipsnipsnip>

You have not posted any relevent new information and I can tell this question is going to go on and it's now in the wrong thread.

Can i refer you to your own post made here in November (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1656388#post1656388) when you couldn't get the ufone SIM to work in Hermes. That _is_ the same issue and it is _not_ GSM death related at all if another sim works good. I haven't read all your posts about this in other threads (as I'm doing my own research at the moment) but have you checked to see if your Hermes is SIMlocked, if the SIM card itself you are attempting to use works in another phone and even if its the correct type of SIM. Once those options are ruled out we can then look into the radio issue.

You **MUST** realise every radio has the potential to work differently on every network even when sitting in the same spot in the same chair... Networks that work on 1.47 might not work on 1.16 and vice-versa. Your phone is still not broken (We can arrange this for a small fee tho - I thought you'd be pleased it wasn't a sudden death phone!) If you put that ufone SIM in *my* Hermes here it prolly still not work but my phone works absolutely fine on all 4 GSM networks here in the UK (good on 2, bad on 2).

You arecomparing a tennis ball with a lemon and asking why the lemon doesn't bounce on the bat while your mates telling you how the tennis ball he is sucking tastes funny but you're both agreeing each item is yellow and round and asking whats wrong with your oranges.:D

TO CONFIRM A HARDWARE PROBLEM - YOU NEED TO COMPARE LIKE TO LIKE. Your phone with radio xxxx and mates phone with *SAME* radio and try both networks on both phones or at least find someone else who uses ufone and ask them what radio they are running and then YOU try that radio if you can safely flash it on!!.

</polite>

That answers this question in this thread (seriously)
If you really think you've got a 1.54/1.47 issue then we can continue this discussion in "potential 1.54 problem (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=356081)" thread.

If your phones radio completely bricks up on ALL networks including one you KNOW works wells on your device then we can discuss this further in this thread.

[thuper29]

I've been having the problem with my signal unknowingly becoming useless after a few hours, or losing it completely and have been running 1.54.07. I tried the potential fix #1 last night installing 1.43 and left my phone on all night, and still have a working signal so things are looking good so far...

[galaxys]

I've been having the problem with my signal unknowingly becoming useless after a few hours, or losing it completely and have been running 1.54.07. I tried the potential fix #1 last night installing 1.43 and left my phone on all night, and still have a working signal so things are looking good so far...

ok, but what's your device rom, where u located, and what carrier do u use???

[thuper29]

Ive got vp3g's 3.62 rom on an 8525 and Im on att in northern california

[sbirsen]

...................................

[Jeeest]

I have had "No GSM" problems for the last few weeks. I have installed "HERM_Radio_Only_1.54.07.00_CustomRUU" at one time. At one time I was not able to boot any longer. Don't ask me to reconstruct it, but somehow I managed to reinstall the ROM "K's Rom v1.30a Full (4mbpp)" (and still got these error messages). I went back to "HERM_Radio_Only_1.47.00.10_CustomRUU". I even tried Mikeapollo's 'installing it three times in a row' method, and unfortunately still got these errors.

Desperately I took the thing apart (essentially point 1 - 5 from http://www.pdacenter.ru/razborka/razbor_hermes/) and tightened the screws inside and put some extra screws in holes that had no screws (I did this because I thought my keyboard was hanging a little bit loose). By the way, one of the holes should not have a screw because then it gets through the keyboard (luckily it didn't damage anything). Take your microsd out before doing all this (I forgot and broke it). Anyhow, it seems everything is working fine again and even the battery is back to normal. So this might be an alternative method for people to use. No, I don't have any pictures of where I put the extra screws and do not intend to open the phone again (sorry for that).

K's Rom v1.30a Full
Radio: 1.47.00.10
HERM300

DISCLAIMER DISCLAIMER *** I AM NO EXPERT IN THIS MATTER *** DISCLAIMER DISCLAIMER

[Mikeapollo]

Interesting... and glad you got it working again!

I'm suddenly getting visions of wonky ground connections on this brick fixed by tightening the screws..? Maybe a few others have a screw loose ;)

Certainly I could understand poor connections causing unpredictable hardware issues... Either way, for the last resorters it might be a good idea to check the hardware is all firmly connected on the inside if nothing else works and see if that solves mystery problems.

Nice post Jeeest - thanks.

[zim2dive]

It will be interesting to see if the battery consumption tests show any correlation between the newer radios and higher consumption ...

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=358933
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=358599

[igord]

I have problems with signal. But it is not NO GSM problem, I see only "none"...Once I saw NO GSM, but with some help of MTTY I get it back to "none".

HERM300
T-Mobile TEST ONLY WM6

[Andrey_ORIN]

In short, this situation: devays HTC TyTN(Herm200)overnight has been turned off in the morning put SIM worked well until the first Power OFF After switching already wrote NO GSM I withdrew the accumulator. so 20minutes without Akkumulyator, and then put in place and is working steadily again = ( A What is the problem?
in Fly mode work very well, when "turn on" phone in Comm Manager her shut down =(
Radio flash stoped in 0% ( sometimes it flash
Rom's flash very well
Ships stoped in 11%-12% ((( Sometimes it flash

my English is bad =(
Если что отвечайте на русском

[yurz]

ok now I think I know basically that the problem is due to the gsm chip being fried.Does anybody ever tried to get this thing repaired ? Any idea how much it would cost ? I'm from Brunei and there is nowhere locally I can get it repaired here. There is just no expertise. Could I get it repaired say in Malaysia or even Thailand ? Thanks.

[igord]

I think if GSM/Radio chip is fried the motherboard will not work, and you will see physical damage on the chip. You can tell that problem is coming from heat and when is cooled down it works ok, but I think that is not problem. Someone says that there are some errors in the radio rom code.

[yurz]

I think if GSM/Radio chip is fried the motherboard will not work, and you will see physical damage on the chip. You can tell that problem is coming from heat and when is cooled down it works ok, but I think that is not problem. Someone says that there are some errors in the radio rom code.


your comment really gives me some hope as my hermes never experienced any overheating issue.It just went dead. No GSM. So how do you get the code working ? Where can I get it sent for repairs ? Thanks

[Jeeest]

I have had "No GSM" problems for the last few weeks. I have installed "HERM_Radio_Only_1.54.07.00_CustomRUU" at one time. At one time I was not able to boot any longer. Don't ask me to reconstruct it, but somehow I managed to reinstall the ROM "K's Rom v1.30a Full (4mbpp)" (and still got these error messages). I went back to "HERM_Radio_Only_1.47.00.10_CustomRUU". I even tried Mikeapollo's 'installing it three times in a row' method, and unfortunately still got these errors.

Desperately I took the thing apart (essentially point 1 - 5 from http://www.pdacenter.ru/razborka/razbor_hermes/) and tightened the screws inside and put some extra screws in holes that had no screws (I did this because I thought my keyboard was hanging a little bit loose). By the way, one of the holes should not have a screw because then it gets through the keyboard (luckily it didn't damage anything). Take your microsd out before doing all this (I forgot and broke it). Anyhow, it seems everything is working fine again and even the battery is back to normal. So this might be an alternative method for people to use. No, I don't have any pictures of where I put the extra screws and do not intend to open the phone again (sorry for that).

K's Rom v1.30a Full
Radio: 1.47.00.10
HERM300

DISCLAIMER DISCLAIMER *** I AM NO EXPERT IN THIS MATTER *** DISCLAIMER DISCLAIMER

This trick worked for a week or so, but now I am back to the usual "NO GSM". Indeed I am no expert.

[eperez84]

having same problems as everyone else though mine started running radio 1.48 and black satin

wanted to try possible 1.43 radio fix any clues where i can find it?

[GreatGrey]

We have about 800 Tytn's (Vodaphone 1605) in my company, I do a lot of field upgrades on the devices. Ran across one that GSM worked right after booting, but then quit after a few minutes. Did a radio rom flash, and it failed.

Put the brick in the fridge for a few hours, and it then accecpted the radio rom flash. But the dead GSM reappeared once the device got warm. On one boot I would get NO GSM, another I got the NONE message, in no particular order. I was able to duplicate the effect multiple times, and I swapped out the users device for a good one.

He lost it 3 hours later.

:mad::mad::mad:

[AdamTibi]

After reading a lot about flashing - upgrading the Tytn, i think the first question to be answered is:

Has anyone with an official untouched device had the radio death situation??
(i.e never had any cooked-baked-boiled rom or radio other than the official flashed on the device)
On every incident i have read, there was at least one mentioning of "Unlock, SuperCID, HardSpl, cooked XXXX-WM6 rom, and so on.

Is it a coincidence?

Dont get me wrong, i my self love this forum and have used tools and roms many times (previously on my MDA Pro and now on my Tytn).

Hi,

I had the same problem without touching my phone (SPV M3100 from Orange), I didn't do any type of software upgrade! I started losing the signal every 5 to 10 min and while I'm using it! Then I needed to wait a while waiting it to find the network and connect again. Some friends reported calling me and got the voice mail. Also, I've noticed that when the signal fails while talking on the phone, clicking the "end" from the screen or clicking the "end call" hardware button won't end the call (even though, I am sure I am disconnected as I can't hear the other party)! It takes from 5 sec to 30 sec to get disconnected.

I've been using this phone for a year without having any signal problem. So, I tried to following:

Upgraded to the official ROM by Orange - Same problem.
Then I started trying all Radio versions - Same problem.
Tried WM6 and other cooked OSes (I know that this has no effect, but it won't harm) - Same problem.

That leads me to that this is a hardware problem, what do you think?!

Cheers

-------------------------------------------------------

Update

My phone reception has been working for 13 consecutive hours (and still working) without interruption after removing the battery for 30 min.

Even though before that I tried hard resetting it and removed the battery temporarily to clean the SIM but that didn't solve it! However, leaving the battery out for 30 min might have solved it!

cheers

[AdamTibi]

question to all you no radio users - are you using the standard battery that came with the phone or the extended battery?

i bought the extended life battery a few months ago and definitely noticed a temperature increase of the phone. wonder if there's a correlation?

Standard battery

[Bergerac56]

Hi,

...

That leads me to that this is a hardware problem, what do you think?!

Cheers

I believe also that it is a hardware problem. It seems that heat is affecting the radio part. At the good old time of physical overclocking of PCs, THE test was to overheat a bit the processor with a hairdryer or to cool it down with one of those refrigerating sprays. Could it be possible that, due to the radio firmware, the radio chip is pushed to its limits (a sort of overclocking)? The normal result would be a shorter life, or destruction of the chip. If this is the case, i fear that there is no "logical" solution. Only replacement of the chip. Could be interesting to be able to "freeze" the chip on a tytn intermitently affected by the problem. If it works again fine when very cold... then...

[cauboi25]

Hi, can anyone help me?

i was sufring the "NO GSM" problem, and could not flash radio roms...now i can't even boot my 8525. It gets stuck in the green screen
What should i do?

Tankxs!

[XellDusk]

This has happened to me. No problems flashing my radio (i've done it with my previous Hermes with no problem - was replaced by insurance) before, but going from Orange's standard WM5 radio 1.30, to Pays WM6 ROM and 1.47, I have had the sudden death issue. What I noticed only today is that the radio information is missing from the Device Information, but after an hour or so, it comes back.

I haven't been able to make outgoing or incoming calls when I do have reception as well.

Finally, I've downgraded to the Official Orange ROM and Radio with no luck at all.

[kingkhan]

having same problem...

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=362790

thanks for reading and possibly helping :)

[fhteagle]

Phone: Cingular 8525
ROM at death: official HTC released (AT&T branded) WM6, radio 1.54.07
Time w/ ROM on: 3 weeks, plus or minus a couple days
Symptoms: "No GSM" after soft or hard reset, cannot hold calls or data connections, symptom continued after downgrade to official WM5

Previous use info: Phone was manufactured in the 47th week of 2006 (according to HTC America RMA department... apparently the first 3 numbers of the S/N like 647 tell you that). Phone used by college student in South Carolina until summer 07, when I purchased it. No idea what ROM or battery he was using but I got it with the standard batt and WM5 / 1.43.x radio on it. Phone worked fairly well until I put the WM6 / 1.54.07.00 on (still with standard battery and etc).

All of my use was in the US, mostly near Dallas metroplex with 2+ bars of HSDPA-ready signal, but with some amount of travel to EDGE only areas (maybe 12-15 hours a week in such locations). Phone may have been driven fairly hard before/during/after the WM6 flash as I am often in the cockpit of airplanes which acts like a big farraday cage with lots of additional RF transmitting and receiving gear in it... aka an electronic transmission nightmare!

Phone has never had cooked or unofficial ROMs on it to my knowledge.

Good news is that AT&T is covering what HTC claims is "not under warranty damage" ***, and is supposed to be shipping me out an 8925 to replace it. I am still out $28 bucks for THC to 'triage' the 8525, but if AT&T honors their word about getting a new phone out to me, well, I will certainly consider it a small loss indeed. Either way this is still the first and the last HTC made anything I spend my money on.

*** Someone please explain to me how _their_ firmware release damaging _their_ hardware design is something that voids a warranty?


---------------------------

Update 2008-02-09:

Finally convinced the escalations team that if I was promised a replacement phone twice (then a third time), that they really do need to ship one out. It should be here Monday.

IF YOUR 8525 IS WITHIN ONE YEAR OF DATE OF PURCHASE AND THIS OCCURS TO IT, IT IS A WARRANTY ISSUE. HTC and ATnT may try to complicate the issue and make it seem like they do not need to cover it, but bottom line is that they do, especially now that there is precedent that they will!

[chupchae]

After reading a lot about flashing - upgrading the Tytn, i think the first question to be answered is:

Has anyone with an official untouched device had the radio death situation??
(i.e never had any cooked-baked-boiled rom or radio other than the official flashed on the device)

Unfortunatelly, people with "untouched" devices are not going to show-up at this or other forums. I can only assume that they ("untouched" with radio failures) are existing, but if you try to do statistics from the forum members it is going to be very, very different from the real statistics of whole TyTN population.

[chupchae]

... but I ran 1.54.07.00 radio for 2 days and it was terrible.

It would hunt forever for a signal. If I went into a building and lost reception, I would have to soft reset to get a signal (after I left the building).

This is known bug of newer ROMs. After loosing of signal (or device power off) phone shows "infinite search for GSM signal" but indeed it has GSM connection, because phone is functioning during this "search". Soft reset is synchronising today screen with actual situation of having GSM connection.

[gondalguru]

I am having all these problems discribed here. Intermitten NO GSM message, frequent call drops, Unable to make calls even showing 3-4 bars signal strength, phone freezes in the middle of the call, unable to disconnect the call, calls directly going to voicemail even phone shows 4 signal bars.

I was testing different things and I kept field test open to see happens. In the field test window most numbers will become zone / na intermittenly. So I think even the signal strength is 4 bars radio keep loosing signals or malfunctioning intermittenly.

I have tried variety of coocked roms and radio's. I don't recall what radio I had last when this started to happen like 3 - 4 weeks ago. Currently I have 1.40 and using crc's rom. I do remember that this started to happen after I flashed TNT se professional rom. May be its just a co incidence.

I am still able to flash OS / radio ROMs with out any problem.

One more thing - I did drop the phone 2-3 days prior to the onset of this problem.

I love this phone and I got it on the first day It was launched by cingular - Nov 16th 2006. I am obviously out of warranty. Talked to HTC and they say they need to look at the phone to see whats wrong with it and charge is 28 dollars for that plus extra depending on the problem.

For those who bought the phone using credit card -- try extended warranty benefit offered by master-visa-amex cards. I am trying my luck with mastercard and see if they will cover the cost under the extended warranty benefit.

Good Luck to all.

[AdamTibi]

Unfortunatelly, people with "untouched" devices are not going to show-up at this or other forums. I can only assume that they ("untouched" with radio failures) are existing, but if you try to do statistics from the forum members it is going to be very, very different from the real statistics of whole TyTN population.

I haven't touch my device and this happened to me... After that I tried different radios and roms to try solving the problem, but couldn't, I think it is a hardware one.

[mcfisco]

The radio on my Herm200 has died after allowing the battery to drain completely - just nothing there now after recharging.
I can flash new roms onto it but not radios or run the unlock again

It doesn't look promising at all as I bought it 2nd hand & don't have the original receipt :(

[ai6908]

The radio on my Herm200 has died after allowing the battery to drain completely - just nothing there now after recharging.
I can flash new roms onto it but not radios or run the unlock again

It doesn't look promising at all as I bought it 2nd hand & don't have the original receipt :(

Try putting it in the ice box for about 10 to 15 mins, and then flash using SD card method. Maybe that can be help!

[pedro2k]

Just like with everything on these threads, please proceed with caution. This fix worked for me. It may not work for you. Read all the necessary info and understand what you’re about to do.

If you bricked your phone upgrading, this will not work for you.

A little background. I have been for the last three weeks getting the dreaded “no gsm” on my phone. It starts when I lose a signal and the phone tries to reacquire it once I get into a better area. The phone would lock up, leaving me with no choice but to soft reset. But once it boots up, “no gsm” shows up and my device would throw a tantrum and not get back to a stable state until I get home, remove the battery for a while, then reboot. It got progressively worse, to a point where when I’m traveling and I lose the signal, the phone became worthless as I soft reset fifty thousand times trying to get the no gsm error to not show up.

For three weeks, I have experimented with changes to the ipl/spl, different radios, and different roms. Different combinations of these three things, hoping that there was some software conflicts I could find that was frying my radio. I have tried just about every radio and rom combination available. Made some tweaks that worked for awhile but eventually, things would regress back to fubar.

One of the tweaks I did that I thought was a bit interesting was to the “bitpool” found in some of the cooked roms under advance config. When I lowered this value, my phone became more stable. Less drop calls and lock ups in a good signal area. Being that I’ve tried just about all of the combos with all of the other things, I decided to delete the ad2p folder which can be found with a registry editor. I don’t have a stereo Bluetooth headset anyway.

Problem solved! No more nasty “no gsm”. Not in the last four days of use with extensive travel going in and out of a 3g area. I cannot tell you what exactly in that folder is conflicting with or frying the radio. Frankly, I don’t care. More than likely, I will never get a stereo Bluetooth headset anyway. I know from reading the wiki, Bluetooth and wifi are suppose to be independent of the radio stack, but this has resolved my intermittent no gsm problems. To reconstruct what I have done, Here is what you would need to do:

1. If you have advanced config on your device, tweak whatever you would want to tweak, then if you can, delete the icon. You probably don’t need to do this, but I want to sailor proof this solution. :D

1A. Download a registry editor. Read and understand how to use.

http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_Registry

2. Once you have the device booted up, connected to activestink and your registry editor running, go to

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/SOFTWARE/Microsoft/Bluetooth/AD2P

Right click the folder and delete. Wait thirty seconds or so, suspend your device once or twice then close out the program and soft reset or power down. Boot up, go to the registry editor again to check if the deletion of the folder was a success.

3. If you pair up your Bluetooth headset and find that your phone is a bit unresponsive, ie “operation failed” messages, dropping calls, freezing and locking up, run registry editor and go to

HKLM/SOFTWARE/Microsoft/Bluetooth/AudioGateway/Capability
(Default is 37)

Lower the dword value. I have mine set at 20. If you find that the phone is responding well, but the bluetooth audio is subpar, raise the dword. I have seen some recommending this setting to 60. We have different mono Bluetooth headsets, find what’s best for you.

Once again, this worked for me. My radio was still alive as it came on sometimes during the five million times I’ve done a soft reset during my travels. Yours may be a hardware issue. If you currently have no gsm all the time, I suggest to take out the battery, leave it out for twenty four hours or even a week, then fire it back up again. See if that revives your radio. Do not install a new radio until you have tried this and/or have the device at a relatively stable state with the phone showing a signal. If nothing else, you’ve tried and failed, back up everything then do a hard reset. That should bring you back to the proverbial drawing board. FYI, on this phone, I am using a cardo scala S-800.

Why does it happen to only some of us? Possibly, it’s because only some of us lose our carrier signal then pick up a different non provider signal. In my situation, I initially saw the no gsm error when this happened. If you live and travel in good signal areas mainly using your cell provider towers, I doubt if you’ll ever get infected with no gsm.

I cannot think of a situation where this possible fix would irreversibly brick your phone. I haven’t experienced any unwanted effects yet. As far as I knew, the ad2p folder only applied to the settings for the sound quality of the stereo Bluetooth headset. Probably why it took me so long to delete it because it was one of the last things I thought about that could possibly throw off the radio stack. If you can think of one, please post your cautions and advice.

If you try this, post your results. If this is the cause of the current crop of no gsm phones, maybe we can get some of the geniuses on these boards to figure out exactly what is the conflict between the radio and the ad2p folder. Thanks and good luck J

[gondalguru]

Just like with everything on these threads, please proceed with caution. This fix worked for me. It may not work for you. Read all the necessary info and understand what you’re about to do.

If you bricked your phone upgrading, this will not work for you.

A little background. I have been for the last three weeks getting the dreaded “no gsm” on my phone. It starts when I lose a signal and the phone tries to reacquire it once I get into a better area. The phone would lock up, leaving me with no choice but to soft reset. But once it boots up, “no gsm” shows up and my device would throw a tantrum and not get back to a stable state until I get home, remove the battery for a while, then reboot. It got progressively worse, to a point where when I’m traveling and I lose the signal, the phone became worthless as I soft reset fifty thousand times trying to get the no gsm error to not show up.

For three weeks, I have experimented with changes to the ipl/spl, different radios, and different roms. Different combinations of these three things, hoping that there was some software conflicts I could find that was frying my radio. I have tried just about every radio and rom combination available. Made some tweaks that worked for awhile but eventually, things would regress back to fubar.

One of the tweaks I did that I thought was a bit interesting was to the “bitpool” found in some of the cooked roms under advance config. When I lowered this value, my phone became more stable. Less drop calls and lock ups in a good signal area. Being that I’ve tried just about all of the combos with all of the other things, I decided to delete the ad2p folder which can be found with a registry editor. I don’t have a stereo Bluetooth headset anyway.

Problem solved! No more nasty “no gsm”. Not in the last four days of use with extensive travel going in and out of a 3g area. I cannot tell you what exactly in that folder is conflicting with or frying the radio. Frankly, I don’t care. More than likely, I will never get a stereo Bluetooth headset anyway. I know from reading the wiki, Bluetooth and wifi are suppose to be independent of the radio stack, but this has resolved my intermittent no gsm problems. To reconstruct what I have done, Here is what you would need to do:

1. If you have advanced config on your device, tweak whatever you would want to tweak, then if you can, delete the icon. You probably don’t need to do this, but I want to sailor proof this solution. :D

1A. Download a registry editor. Read and understand how to use.

http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Hermes_Registry

2. Once you have the device booted up, connected to activestink and your registry editor running, go to

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/SOFTWARE/Microsoft/Bluetooth/AD2P

Right click the folder and delete. Wait thirty seconds or so, suspend your device once or twice then close out the program and soft reset or power down. Boot up, go to the registry editor again to check if the deletion of the folder was a success.

3. If you pair up your Bluetooth headset and find that your phone is a bit unresponsive, ie “operation failed” messages, dropping calls, freezing and locking up, run registry editor and go to

HKLM/SOFTWARE/Microsoft/Bluetooth/AudioGateway/Capability
(Default is 37)

Lower the dword value. I have mine set at 20. If you find that the phone is responding well, but the bluetooth audio is subpar, raise the dword. I have seen some recommending this setting to 60. We have different mono Bluetooth headsets, find what’s best for you.

Once again, this worked for me. My radio was still alive as it came on sometimes during the five million times I’ve done a soft reset during my travels. Yours may be a hardware issue. If you currently have no gsm all the time, I suggest to take out the battery, leave it out for twenty four hours or even a week, then fire it back up again. See if that revives your radio. Do not install a new radio until you have tried this and/or have the device at a relatively stable state with the phone showing a signal. If nothing else, you’ve tried and failed, back up everything then do a hard reset. That should bring you back to the proverbial drawing board. FYI, on this phone, I am using a cardo scala S-800.

Why does it happen to only some of us? Possibly, it’s because only some of us lose our carrier signal then pick up a different non provider signal. In my situation, I initially saw the no gsm error when this happened. If you live and travel in good signal areas mainly using your cell provider towers, I doubt if you’ll ever get infected with no gsm.

I cannot think of a situation where this possible fix would irreversibly brick your phone. I haven’t experienced any unwanted effects yet. As far as I knew, the ad2p folder only applied to the settings for the sound quality of the stereo Bluetooth headset. Probably why it took me so long to delete it because it was one of the last things I thought about that could possibly throw off the radio stack. If you can think of one, please post your cautions and advice.

If you try this, post your results. If this is the cause of the current crop of no gsm phones, maybe we can get some of the geniuses on these boards to figure out exactly what is the conflict between the radio and the ad2p folder. Thanks and good luck J

Thanks pedro for one more suggestion.

I tried it and it didn't work for me. Same problem continues. My only hope is creditcard extended warranty program to get anything out of this situation.

[brici]

Does anyone have new information? Maybe someone who shipped it back for repair? Or anyone trying the 3 times flash?

[beebrox]

I have been having similar problems with my i-mate JASJAM (HERMES 100) for the last couple of months.

Troubles started after I upgraded to WM6 with 1.54 radio. The symptoms observed were:
- Cannot close the call
- GSM not available
- Sometimes GSM signal is there but callers would get the message that "the phone is switched off". A soft reset works sometimes.

Problems persisted even after I reverted back to WM5. Finally, I sent it off for repair.

I couldn't find out what exactly was repaired, but here are brief responses from the repair guy:
- Replaced a power amplifier or something like that...
- Reinstalled WM5.

It is been one week and working fine. Haven't tried out moving to WM6 again. May be, I will wait for some more time :-)

[brici]

for me it looks like it is enough to put the hermes into the fridge for some 15 minutes. it works now for several hours. will keep you posted.

edit: I was able to fully flash the rom now for the third time within 40 minutes. Without a failed update. What's the secret? I really do not know. Maybe the fridge :). I also moved back to the ancient rom upgrading method of the Himalaya when I had to remove the sim card. We just passed 11%. So the radio is refreshing again. Try upgrading WITHOUT the sim card. Feedbacks welcome.
ps: it is definitely not my idea in case it works. just posting.
bad news: it did not help anything at all. Will bring it back to the operator to have it repaired.

[one hand high]

I guess I was lucky to catch this early. I had Radio 1.54xxx on my 8525 and last week I started to have problems with GSM. It would take a long time to find a signal and when it did it wouldn't connect to the internet and no calls could be made. I just flashed back to 1.47 and all seems to be well so far. I'll keep my fingers crossed.

[hodgsonio]

I have same issue -unable to flash radio on herm300. I have tried all combinations of roms and flashing methods but no luck. also tried the "flash 3 times" method and no luck again.

I'm beginning to think that maybe the 1.5x radio has indeed goosed the chip. has no-one found any kind of definate fix? (even getting hardware fix with decent explanation would at least confirm that chip is being fried)

[namspa]

I have spent over a month reading many, many posts and wiki pages here and on several other forums. I have a Cingular 8525 HERM100 IPL-1.04 SPL-2.03, standard battery that I acquired after the original owner updated from OEM wm5 to AT&T’s wm6 upgrade. The upgrade installed with no problems. Everything worked great for several weeks. Then it started dropping calls, loosing signal, could not hang up after calls, PDA functions hanging up and so on with a lot of soft resets to recover. Same problems as many have been having. Now the phone has ‘NO GSM’ on bootup and with a sim installed, pretty much locks up. With no sim installed and after a hard reset, most of the basic PDA functions work. He contacted AT&T customer service and they talked him into buying a new (different type) PDA phone + another two year contract. The phone was less than a year old but they refused to take it back under warranty. They insisted the warranty was 6 months. So, he gave it to me and now I have a new hobby. I downloaded AT&T’s 8525 wm6 upgrade from their link on their web site and tried to reinstall the rom with no sim or memory card installed. It goes into the tri-color bootloader and starts the install but it gets to 11%, stops for several minutes, and then gives me an update error 262. I follow the recovery step by step and still error 262 over and over again. It was also locked up in bootloader mode. I ran mtty and was able to get back to the OS (problem #4; Common Upgrading Problems in HTC Hermes; Cmd>set 14 0 did not work: Cmd>set 16 0 did). Then, I tried HTC Hermes SIM & CID Unlock – v3a. Ran AUTO_Unlock_v3a.bat. It goes into bootloader. Installed new bootloader IPL-1.01 SPL-1.40 Olipro. When it went into rom update mode and displayed the update progress bar, it stays at 0% for over a minute. Then, again I get an update error 262 and it locks in bootload mode. Run mtty to get back to OS. I have done this process a dozen times both auto and manual installation. Nothing has worked. v3a stays at 0% and official rom at 11% on two desk top pc running XP Pro and one laptop running XP home. Finally used sdcard method and was able to load SIM & CID Unlock v3a. I then ran Olipro v7 2.10 with no problems. I have gone back and tried to reload AT&T’s rom trying slightly different setups with activesync and having the usb connected before I run the RUU that others have posted that they used to fix this problem. Still hangs at 11%. Going to try to load radio only ‘ROM 1.47.00.10’ as mrvanx suggested on thread 358163 pg 2. Not very optimistic! I think as others do that this is a hardware problem. Also going to try the ‘cool down’ theory before flashing. Hopefully I will have time in the next few days. I too would like to know what is being replaced when it gets sent back for repairs. Below is the info from mtty.

Cmd>info 2
HTCSSuperCID?HTCE
Cmd>info 3
HTCSH
Cmd>info 4
HTCSCWS__001Ùü¤HHTCE
Cmd>info 6
HTCST ÚÈÒHTCE
Cmd>info 7
HTC Integrated Re-Flash Utility, Common Base Version : 1.51d
Device Name: HERM100, Bootloader Version : 2.10.Olipro
Built at: Apr 22 2007 13:32:26
Copyright (c) 1998-2007 Modified By Olipro - Hard-SPL

CPU ID=0x41129200
Main CPLD version=0x5
Upper CPLD version=0x4
Main Board version=0x6

Cmd>info 8
Block 0x0(0) is Reversed block
Block 0x1(1) is Reversed block
Block 0x2(2) is Reversed block
Block 0x3(3) is Reversed block
Block 0x4(4) is Reversed block
Block 0x5(5) is Reversed block
Block 0x6(6) is Reversed block
Block 0x7(7) is Reversed block
Block 0x8(8) is Reversed block
Block 0x9(9) is Reversed block
Block 0xA(10) is Reversed block
Block 0xB(11) is Reversed block
Block 0xC(12) is Reversed block
Block 0x1FE(510) is BAD block !!!
Block 0x393(915) is BAD block !!!
Block 0x3C2(962) is BAD block !!!
Block 0x3D3(979) is BAD block !!!

Partition[0], type=0x20, start=0x2, total=0x18FE
Partition[1], type=0x23, start=0x1900, total=0x1900
Partition[2], type=0x25, start=0x3200, total=0x1F900
Partition[3], type=0x4, start=0x22B00, total=0x17D00

CE Total Length(with sector info) = 0x4675800
CE CheckSum Length(without sector info) = 0x4560000

Cmd>task 2a
Check block : 510 - Bad

Check block : 915 - Bad

Check block : 962 - Bad

Check block : 979 - Bad

[KPAHK]

Hi from me too,

I got my tytn bricked in the same way:mad:

I was using it for about 6-8 months after last ROM update ( WM6 BLACK PRO)
with ROM 1.47.xx.xx

Last week 25.02-2.03 I experienced the same problems with HTC.
Phone starts to hang. After reboot No GSM massage. after reboot without SIM it work for 20-30 min and hangs. So I decided to Flash the ROM without reading all of this usefull posts and guess what??

STUCKED at 11%.

Now it is in fridge :rolleyes:

So as I see all of you consider that it is a new Radio ROM bug but it isn't as I was with 1.47 verssion. I still think it is a hardware problem maybe in GSM module.

I have another freak Idea - some kind of VIRUS!!!

If anyone has any idea please share with us for a try :D

[tracylynnt]

I was using the "official" At&t WM6 ROM downloaded from Hermes site, had never done anything except upgrade to that. Mine started locking up during calls that went over about 10 minutes. I would have to soft-reset and it would come back up NO GSM and it would have blanks under Settings, Device. If I left it like that for a few hours eventually it would come back (almost seemed like it was overheating or something and had to cool down). I started doing research and I flashed it with the 1.54 radio and the phone took it fine, no errors (keep in mind I don't play with my 8525 ao I have NO idea what the radio version was before, it was whatever was released with the latest official AT&T ROM). It will work for a day or so then it will lock up (not necessarily during a call anymore, sometimes while it's just sitting soing nothing). Once you do a soft-reset it will go to NO GSM again until it decides to come back and all of the GPRS network seetings are gone and any email accounts set up other than MMS or SMS are also gone. If you had unread email in the inbox it will show up on the Today screen and you can't get to it or get it to go away, not even with the unread mail count tool I found on this forum. Apparently the phone thinks the account is still set up and since it did have unread mail in it the count is correct. You just can't get to it. Personally I think something is frying the hardware.

[Lars]

After reading a lot about flashing - upgrading the Tytn, i think the first question to be answered is:

Has anyone with an official untouched device had the radio death situation??
(i.e never had any cooked-baked-boiled rom or radio other than the official flashed on the device)
On every incident i have read, there was at least one mentioning of "Unlock, SuperCID, HardSpl, cooked XXXX-WM6 rom, and so on.

Is it a coincidence?

Dont get me wrong, i my self love this forum and have used tools and roms many times (previously on my MDA Pro and now on my Tytn).
I have a new Hermes 300 fresh from factory with the same problem. Didn't even show radio version and IMEI. It was an exchange device from T-Mobile Ger as the old device didn't do any sounds anymore...
Meanwhile I tried a lot (HardSPL - SChaps ROM 4.30 - Some Radio VErsions 1.40,1.5.10,1.5.30, Schaps Advanced Config, different SIM Card which is from a different provider)...
Will try the bad block trick now... ... Didn't work...

Trying the radio 1.47 now...

[tianz]

I think we need to find Hermes sevice manual with schematic, not only dismantling picture. with more information maybe we can isolate the problem to specific hardware part (my opinion it's hardware problem). Since too many issues regarding Hermes.

It's a shame though, such a nice phone but with a lot of hardware issues.

[ffaridi1]

I fall into same hole as you guys :(
I exchanged my Treo with my friend's 8525, every thing was going smooth when I upgraded one of the cooked roms and it installs the 1.54.0.7 radio rom, initially I noticed that in morning phone started to drain whole battery overnight and calls start dropping plus phone freeze up lots of time..... eventually I got "No GSM" when I found out that my HERMES is almost bricked.....
I install so many ROMS, radio roms etc but no solution, then this morning I tried something which shows sign of hope......

I removed my SIM and install Radio ROM 1.47.0.10 via micro SD card, it installed fine.... then I insert my wife's phone's (AT&T) SIM and restarted the phone.... for 6 hours the phone works like charm ..... I made calls and stuff, moved in different areas and see reception bars going up and down whic means radio hardware was all good as it was doing its stuff.....

Then I replaced my old SIM and you know what..... same symptoms come back..... phone was locked up and No GSM is back, so I again removed my SIM, reflash same radio ROM and insert my SIM again, this time phone is up with signals for last 30 minutes...... I'll update the progress in a while but I got a feeling that this is a combination of RADIO ROM + SIM ..........

Can some one try my steps and let us know if that solves the issue?

ALSO

this thread is static for a lot of time, does that mean you guys are moved to other phones and rest the HERMES in peace ????

Update:
As soon as I tried to make a call it goes back to the "bricked" state, I don't have the other SIM right now other wise I would have checked the SIM theory again.

[Prerna]

Interesting! Surely SIM can often be the culprit in several issues.

For you, it is still unclear whether the SIM is either damaged or not anymore fully compatible after the ROM upgrade. Or it could be the Radio version that does not suit with the operator you connect to.

You could try:

1.- Downgrade Radio until one works all right
2.- Get a new SIM (128k preferably) from your operator

Whatever the output, please report the results.

[ffaridi1]

I called AT&T and report the issue... the CS rep gave me the good news that my Warranty with AT&T still has 3 more days left and after few "standard" troubleShooting questions agreed to replace the phone :)
I revert my SPL/ROM to AT&T's went to device support center and exchanged my phone with another one (which is much fresh looking than my scratched old 8525) and which comes with another 90 days warranty :)
It comes with 1.40 radio rom so I would stick with it for a while before I'll put my phone on ebay for sell which will happen very soon.

The guy at support center , after listening to all symptoms asked me the first question :
" Did you use another SIM !!!!!!!!!!!!"
So again , even though I got a replacement but I still think SIM replacement could solve this problem for many guys here who had bricked the phone due to 1.54.0.X radio ROM.

Can some one else with a No GSM Bricked phone try this out?

[radialsoliton]

Radio version : 1.54.07.00
Rom: 3.62.502.3
CE OS 5.2.1622 (Build 18128.0.4.4)

About 14 months ago, my 8525 came with WM 5.0 and an earlier version of the ROM. 6 months ago, I downloaded both the new ROM version and WM6 from the HTC site. First I updated the ROM. No update issues at all. In fact, the phone jumped in performance. I was able to walk around in my building with usable signal. A couple weeks later, I updated from CE 5 to CE 6. Since then, the phone has suffered below par performance needing soft resets every day to find the network. In my office near a window, it is sometimes able to get 1 bar, but mostly shows the exclamation point. Walking out to my car across the parking lot, where there should be 3~4 bars, it can't find the network at all and displays the exclamation point. To use bluetooth in my car, I need to do 1~3 soft resets using the comm manager to get the phone to find the network. There are even dropouts along the interstates, now.

I have been thinking of re-flashing the ROM with the same update. This is primarily because the software is not transitioning between functions correctly. But there is a second flaw with performance and I think the 2 are connected. Both are SW flaws. AT&T technical staff recorded my problem but have nothing to add. Together this morning, an AT&T rep and I searched the windows mobile area at Microsoft and could find nothing related to comm issues in 8525s. I strongly suspect WM6 has a flaw that impedes radio operation and performance, and that the problem is not hardware. There is a WM 6.1 for 'business'. but no comm issue is id'ed. Shame, it worked spectacularly well those couple of weeks.

[diablos872001]

I'm here too!

Radio: 1.54.07.00

At the beginning NO GSM, after 2 days: G NONE and R NONE.

So there isn't a solution, right? :(

[ffaridi1]

I'm here too!

Radio: 1.54.07.00

At the beginning NO GSM, after 2 days: G NONE and R NONE.

So there isn't a solution, right? :(

Did you try another SIM from someone else's account in your phone?

[diablos872001]

yes i've tried another sim, but no solution.

I think i've the worst problem, R none and G none, radio flash update always fails, OS + radio flash fails when arrives at gsm module...

Good times when there was only NO GSM and a reboot can fix it :p

I'll try with the fridge hehehe :D

[romeu]

I have a Hermes with R:NONE G:NONE.
I bought it so because I thought it would be easy to fix. Smart guy I am...
I have read most of these threads about this problem and the No GSM issue.
In several cases people writes that they droped the phone. I wonder if more people have droped the phone without mentioning it because it doesn't seem relevant.
It could be a physical damage. Some connector that losens or cracks or some stress in any component that makes the solder to crack.
It would be interesting to find out how frequent it is that people has droped the phone or given it a hard impact prior to the problem.
It may sound crazy (maybe it IS crazy) but as long as we don't know all clues are relevant.

[754boy]

If I replaced the motherboard with another one, would that fix the radio?

[Mikeapollo]

If I replaced the motherboard with another one, would that fix the radio?

Yes... However, depending on where you are you may be better off just buying a second-hand (working) Hermes and keeping your existing GSM'less one as a dumb PDA or a deveopment machine..

[ALEX_STAMOS]

Dear XDA-Developers

I have also been victim of this HTC Radio Hardware behavior; I have dropped trying to fix this long ago, since i had the capability to buy NEW phone.

But not everybody does...and i am really DISAPPOINTED from YOUR behavior of IGNORING these people requests, to either to solve their issue...or to forget about it completely.

If YOU XDA-DEVELOPERS (which i imagine you do) have such HTC internal information ... please ANNOUNCE to people and relief them as this issues are now officially global.

Best regards

[ai6908]

Dear XDA-Developers

I have also been victim of this HTC Radio Hardware behavior; I have dropped trying to fix this long ago, since i had the capability to buy NEW phone.

But not everybody does...and i am really DISAPPOINTED from YOUR behavior of IGNORING these people requests, to either to solve their issue...or to forget about it completely.

If YOU XDA-DEVELOPERS (which i imagine you do) have such HTC internal information ... please ANNOUNCE to people and relief them as this issues are now officially global.

Best regards

Hmmmm :confused::rolleyes::confused:

[Mikeapollo]

Dear XDA-Developers

I have also been victim of this HTC Radio Hardware behavior; I have dropped trying to fix this long ago, since i had the capability to buy NEW phone.

But not everybody does...and i am really DISAPPOINTED from YOUR behavior of IGNORING these people requests, to either to solve their issue...or to forget about it completely.

If YOU XDA-DEVELOPERS (which i imagine you do) have such HTC internal information ... please ANNOUNCE to people and relief them as this issues are now officially global.

Best regards

Hmm... I share your frustration but I really think expressing disappointment at a group of enthusiasts who are NOT HTC employees and do not have access to any HTC internal official documents is really unnecessary.

This thread contains a number of "potential" solutions to people who are having radio issues - as well as other threads warning of the risks of changing the radio ROM in the device.

The whole radio death issue is one that is not well understood, has no definite cure and is (apart from here) completely undocumented. The more established people in the forum have offered whatever advice they can but there is no "total fix" other than replacing your mobo / device.

On the whole - to reitterate what I originally said regarding this :
1) Radio firmware changes how the softw