Sony Ericsson XPERIA X1 - Kaiser killer

[ssarl]

Have you seen this phone? It is certainly a Kaiser killer. Maybe now HTC will start to care about graphics acceleration and performance.

[somynex]

have you read this (http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/10/no-wonder-sony-ericssons-xperia-x1-is-so-good-htc-makes-it/) too? :)

[4Site]

I heard it was HTC too but then i looked at the phone and realised HTC have NEVER had that much style.

Plus its like shooting themselves in the foot is it not. Making one of the best phones in a minute and then giving it to a competitor...

[ssarl]

:-o And why HTC does not provide drivers for their branded products?

[PointZero]

Time to reverse engineer the drivers?

[4Site]

I think everyones pretty much sussed that there's bigger forces at work with regards to the missing drivers, the amount of press the issue got, no company's arrogant enough towards it's customers to purposely with hold a driver that it somehow could of released. Either it doesn't exist and isn't available or there's hardware issues, that or there's financial constraints.

[unwired4]

I heard it was HTC too but then i looked at the phone and realised HTC have NEVER had that much style.

Plus its like shooting themselves in the foot is it not. Making one of the best phones in a minute and then giving it to a competitor...



Do you actually understand the dynamics here?

HTC have always made devices for other people. Its only recently that they have sold devices under their own branding.

I am not at all suprised that SE are using HTC to make these devices for them. HTC have the production line, experience in touch screen assembly and are expertees in WinMo devices.

[4Site]

i thought the phones HTC made for other people were just rebrands of their own phones.

[Boinng]

I'd say this phone was probably born in partnership; SE will have created the external design, HTC came up with the internals. Quite possibly the same internals we'll also see in the Tytn III, Vario 4 etc?

Calling it a "Kaiser killer" is missing the point a little - by the time this phone is released, HTC will be killing the Kaiser itself with their own new devices. This kind of spec (WVGA, strong video performance etc) is exactly what you'd expect of the Kaiser's sequel.

[andaroo]

it remains to be seen if this phone even exists, if its not an official announcement, its probably a load of crap

[Boinng]

it remains to be seen if this phone even exists, if its not an official announcement, its probably a load of crap

It is an official announcement, and it does exist (there was a press conference on it at Mobile World Conference yesterday). It's even on the Sony Ericsson website - http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/overview/x1?lc=en&cc=GB

There's also a minisite complete with video here - http://www.sonyericsson.com/x1/default.aspx?cc=gb&lc=en - so yes, it's pretty official!

Won't be on the market until the second half of the year, though, by which time I'm sure it will have competition.

[petsampress]

1. does this phone have drivers?
2. which processor?
3. ram?

[andaroo]

what we should be asking is,

does this phone have 3d hardware support because drivers arent any good without the hardware!!!

[anaethelion]

And here is the Press Release (http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/corporate/press/pressreleases/pressreleasedetails/globalx1-20080210) but there's no mention of any kind of processor, i think we'll have to wait for further infos since it's only the GSMA (http://www.mobileworldcongress.com/homepage.htm)'s Mobile World Congress, Sony tried to impress masses and make publicity, technical stuff will be for later.

[Boinng]

According to this hands-on article here - http://www.theunwired.net/?item=mwc-live-hands-on-video-with-the-sony-ericsson-xperia-x1-windows-mobile-smartphone - the processor is a Qualcomm 520mhz, no surprise really since this is a HTC phone under the skin.

Here's an interesting quote -

You will noticed in the video, that the device seems to be somewhat slow - sometimes. Sony Ericsson promised that this will be fixed with the release device, especially because the 520 MHz Qualcomm CPU should be powerful enough and Sony Ericsson also told me they will take benefit from the graphics hardware acceleration as available for Qualcomm chips.

Looks like the message has gotten through to at least one company :)

[andaroo]

ok, it seems official so i retract that statement.

only problem now is that I have 18 months left on contract with my vario III

grrrr

[bigshape]

ok, it seems official so i retract that statement.

only problem now is that I have 18 months left on contract with my vario III

grrrr

i'm in the same boat, but i wouldn't worry too much - if it's anything like the p990, release will be delayed.

it probably won't actually materialize until Q1 2009 at the earliest... ;)

it does look pretty sweet though! definately on my next upgrade list!

[bigshape]

wvga 858x484!!!

NICE!!! :D

[redblues]

This phone will probably be out in Asia before it hits the rest of the world.. any one wishing to grab one, I can pick up a few whenever it comes out and bring it over to the states.. for a small fee. :)

[redsrule2500]

man that phone looks awesome.....jumped on my kaiser purchase?!

[andaroo]

i'm in the same boat, but i wouldn't worry too much - if it's anything like the p990, release will be delayed.

it probably won't actually materialize until Q1 2009 at the earliest... ;)

it does look pretty sweet though! definately on my next upgrade list!

i dont have any major issues with it!

im sweet,,, for the moment!!!

[Boinng]

My Kaiser contract is up in October/November, so this could be perfect for me.

Funnily enough, the Kaiser is my first non-Sony Ericsson phone in about seven years, after I got fed up with SE's terrible smartphone OS (UIQ). I'm very pleased with the Kaiser, and with Windows Mobile, but a combined Sony Ericsson/HTC device sounds like a dream ticket..

[cproaudio]

It uses aGPS and memory stick. That's enough for me to wait til the next Kaiser killer.

[fb401]

I heard it was HTC too but then i looked at the phone and realised HTC have NEVER had that much style.

Plus its like shooting themselves in the foot is it not. Making one of the best phones in a minute and then giving it to a competitor...
LOL, they're actually competing with themselves. Same thing with Palm. They get money whether you buy this or an HTC device.

[Boinng]

It uses aGPS and memory stick. That's enough for me to wait til the next Kaiser killer.

No, it uses microSD, same as the Kaiser. And isn't the Kaiser also classed as aGPS, since it uses the Quick GPS feature to download satellite info periodically? The X1 is being built by HTC and apparently uses a Qualcomm chipset, so it's almost certainly the same in that regard.

[arabbitte]

Looks like it doesn't have in-built GPS so this is a non-runner for me. The official Sony pages refer only to AGPS and if you follow the links for GPS, you get a HGE-100. This is a phone-powered stereo headset with GPS functionlaity.

At least it is phone powered (so no extra chargers to drag around), but
1) No GPS if you forget the headphones
2) These are not bundled with the phone

I'm also pretty sure that because the GPS is not built in to the motherboard like on the Qualcomm 7200-powered Kaiserm it would not be as power efficient.

Painfully close to perfect ... :eek:

[EskimoPie]

I was worried about the aGPS thing too until I looked it up on Wikipedia... apparently aGPS is NOT just crappy cell-phone GPS... it's regular GPS that ADDS the ability to receive augementation from data provided via the cellular network. Makes lock times much quicker and improves accuracy. I think this phone is going to have a fully capable GPS like we have in the kaiser.

My favorite feature is the WVGA... I used to have VGA on my axim x50v and it makes SUCH a big difference in screen clarity and web browsing... I'll DEFINITELY be swapping my Tilt for this bad boy... assuming it works fine on AT&T's network.

[dungbeetle]

No, it uses microSD, same as the Kaiser.

According to the spec sheet on the SE site.

Memory
Up to 400 MB Phone Memory
Memory Stick SanDisk Micro™ support

[draxredd]

way more interesting is the Nvidia announcement of its APX 2500 SOC. Geforce 6 graphics, anyone ?

[gogol]

Yes, thats MicroSD:

http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=Memory+Stick+SanDisk+Micro&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2

And I bet, it is also MicroSDHC

According to the spec sheet on the SE site.

Memory
Up to 400 MB Phone Memory
Memory Stick SanDisk Micro™ support

[Sane]

How much ram, isnt this info any where... Has to be 128mb...

[mZimm]

Am I the only one who gets tired of the whole "killer" idea? I mean, there are plenty of phones that have less features than others, but that doesn't mean that they are really killed. There is a niche for so many different devices these days, that to wipe something out is just not feasible.

[XtreMe_G]

Yes, thats MicroSD:

http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=Memory+Stick+SanDisk+Micro&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2

And I bet, it is also MicroSDHC

no, that's not microsd, its called a micro memory stick or M2. see that M2 written there?

trust me, i know, i made the mistake of buying that........i saw the word micro and just went straight to the counter with it.

[y2whisper]

yeah its the same type of card that u can use on other sony ericson phones. I currently have an 8gb in my ps3 (got it free from a promo.

[gogol]

Ah! Shit :(

I spent quite a lot of money buying 4GB + 6GB + 8GB MicroSDHC already :(

no, that's not microsd, its called a micro memory stick or M2. see that M2 written there?

trust me, i know, i made the mistake of buying that........i saw the word micro and just went straight to the counter with it.

[andaroo]

Am I the only one who gets tired of the whole "killer" idea? I mean, there are plenty of phones that have less features than others, but that doesn't mean that they are really killed. There is a niche for so many different devices these days, that to wipe something out is just not feasible.

Additionally, there is no such thing as an iPhone killer, in terms of useability and looks, there probably never will be.

[cproaudio]

I was worried about the aGPS thing too until I looked it up on Wikipedia... apparently aGPS is NOT just crappy cell-phone GPS... it's regular GPS that ADDS the ability to receive augementation from data provided via the cellular network. Makes lock times much quicker and improves accuracy. I think this phone is going to have a fully capable GPS like we have in the kaiser........

That may not be the case for this SONY. According to the spec sheet from SONY it only has aGPS which means it gets its position from cell towers not the satellites. Kaiser has true GPS built but the aGPS is turned off by default. Kaiser tweak can turn it on. I'm not going to make the same mistake of assumption with this SONY having a true GPS like I did with the Kaiser with full video support just because it has the MSM7200 chip. I'll wait til it's released then decide.
Edit: you can have agps without a real gps. All sprint phones have aGPS built in.

[bandit2xx]

I think there will be pretty loads of kaiser "killers" by 2nd half of 2008, I-mate 8502 and 9502, mwg zinc II, eten glofiish v900 and the x800 and the m800, gibabyte gsmart ms800, etc... just check www.pdadb.net for upcoming models and I saw many devices I would prefer instead of the kaiser, but they are not available yet or not available in europe. Off course the kaiser has one or more features like 128mb of ram instead of 64mb, but i'd rather have 64mb and be able to play videos properly like in a pc or better like it happened with my old ipaq h1940 and the hx2750.
I think it's more wise to wait... and let the battle begins... my bet goes to the mwg zinc II and eten...

[cproaudio]

http://www.pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1117

[Blowfish64]

I think everyones pretty much sussed that there's bigger forces at work with regards to the missing drivers, the amount of press the issue got, no company's arrogant enough towards it's customers to purposely with hold a driver that it somehow could of released. Either it doesn't exist and isn't available or there's hardware issues, that or there's financial constraints.

Not really. Check this thread. Their douchebaggetry really does run that deep.
http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=1316749&page=2

[dgduris]

i'm in the same boat, but i wouldn't worry too much - if it's anything like the p990, release will be delayed.

it probably won't actually materialize until Q1 2009 at the earliest... ;)

it does look pretty sweet though! definately on my next upgrade list!



Except that this is not the P990. It is not a new OS, but a new UI over WinMob 6.x. Not new from scratch, but a built-by our friends at HTC with a UI overtop. Much like TouchCommander or Point.

This will be here...and not soon enough.

[Menneisyys]

I've also posted some comparative (!) pictures of the new device to http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=mwc_more_s_e_xperia_x1_info_aamp_photos&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

(Sorry, this time, I can't cross-post if there because I'm on a VERY restricted and expensive connection.)

[marm0lade]

I've also posted some comparative (!) pictures of the new device to http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=mwc_more_s_e_xperia_x1_info_aamp_photos&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

(Sorry, this time, I can't cross-post if there because I'm on a VERY restricted and expensive connection.)

They let you take it away from the booth!? :eek:

Too bad that they can't give you a definite on the 3D hardware acceleration. Kinda makes it sound like its their but they are having trouble getting the drivers.......hmmm, sounds familiar.

[Cavey.co.uk]

They let you take it away from the booth!? :eek:

Given they let you hold it, you didn't accidently dump the ROM to a memory card or something did you?

[nsa666]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESPFacfrRkA

[Blowfish64]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESPFacfrRkA

That screen transition from portrait to landscape seemed a tad slow...

[Blowfish64]

"When I’ve asked them about the 3D acceleration, they have stated they try to implement it, but nothing is for sure."

*sigh* Can't any company learn from another one's mistakes? If this thing ships without 3D acceleration, this is all just hot air.

[Jimmyy]

I hate how every time you buy a new gadget something better has comes out next month =(

Being a SE, the fact that its WM 6 and not Symbian was my selling point for this guy.

Kaiser up for sale, anyone?


... jk, not just yet :p

[~~Tito~~]

Well, I think this will be my next. I will wait for a brave few to test it for benchmarks and speed comparied to newer phones and if it all adds up for me ill get it, plus I like the black and sleeker look to it and its a tad bit higher resolution.

Also, use gizmodo for coverage they have better video and info, engadget is great and all but I like their pranks they do to people and how they can get the facts from a spokesman,He said the 520mhz processor and he said that they will put it but it will be until the final release.

Spec's from gizmodo:
http://gizmodo.com/354742/xperia-x1-hiptop-killer-sony-ericssons-first-video-plus-gallery
a lot of frequency's it can use! HSUPA!!HSDPA!!GPRS, EDGE!!

Video of it in real life!(gizmodo):
http://gizmodo.com/354853/video-first-hands-on-sony-ericssons-xperia-x1

[~~Tito~~]

Also:
Memory

* Phone memory: up to 400 MB
* microSD™ memory card support

Availability and versions
Networks

* GSM/GPRS/EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
* UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA 900/1700/1900/2100 MHz
* UMTS/HSDPA/HSUPA 850/1700/1900/2100 MHz
DOT DOT DOT. . .

[Boinng]

According to the spec sheet on the SE site.

Memory
Up to 400 MB Phone Memory
Memory Stick SanDisk Micro™ support

But according to the press release (http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/corporate/press/pressreleases/pressreleasedetails/key.PressResource.Global_X1-20080210) and every other report and hands-on, it's microSD. Stands to reason, as it's made by HTC - it also sports a standard mini-USB port, which is very un-SE too (they have their own proprietary connector).

I expect the SE webmaster just made a wrong assumption, based on every other phone they have on the market.

Also, I really think too much is being made of this aGPS thing. I'm sure I've seen the Kaiser referred to as aGPS too - that's what the Quick GPS app is all about, assisting the GPS lock with downloaded satellite data. While the SE site may well link it to their external GPS accessory, this phone has no SE port for it to connect to, so forget that! It must be built in.

[cproaudio]

If you goto pdadb (http://www.pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdamaster) under brand, scroll down to sony erisson and click start. A list of all SE phones will pop up. Under each phone there are feature icons. GPS is not there. If you search for HTC brand, you'll see the GPS icon under Kaiser. Unless SE pulled a Sprint Mogul and disable it until future software upgrade to unlock it.

[Malik05]

the real question is, would the mods make a seperate forum on XDA-Dev for this device when it comes out, and would the chefs cook for it

[budakjb]

i do not care if it was made by HTC or not
i would definely buy it..
as its have all the funtion as my HTC tytn II

[Cavey.co.uk]

the real question is, would the mods make a seperate forum on XDA-Dev for this device when it comes out, and would the chefs cook for it

Is there a WM phone that they don't cover?

And another question....

Kaiser or XPERIA ......... or iPhone?

IMHO, the iPhone is quite cool, but is missing features (3G) and prices itself out of the market. The Kaiser is fine, but it could do with more umph and if the XPERIA has similar features and the missing umph, it could be the next "Best PDA phone".

[nsa666]

Don't forget, that it is manufactured by HTC.

[p3ngwin]

ok i've read one reply here saying it's a qualcomm chip, another posted with links to someone saying it's a an ARM11 based 520mhz chip...

we need hard facts about hardware people !

[Boinng]

ok i've read one reply here saying it's a qualcomm chip, another posted with links to someone saying it's a an ARM11 based 520mhz chip...

As far as I know, both are true - it's a 520mhz ARM11 based chip made by Qualcomm. Closely related to the chip in our Kaiser's, I'll wager.

[forcedalias]

I'd say this phone was probably born in partnership; SE will have created the external design, HTC came up with the internals. Quite possibly the same internals we'll also see in the Tytn III, Vario 4 etc?

Calling it a "Kaiser killer" is missing the point a little - by the time this phone is released, HTC will be killing the Kaiser itself with their own new devices. This kind of spec (WVGA, strong video performance etc) is exactly what you'd expect of the Kaiser's sequel.

Even if HTC release a phone at about the same time with the same guts, I'd still go for the competitor.

I'm ashamed to have HTC's logo on any of my future phones!

[arabbitte]

I was worried about the aGPS thing too until I looked it up on Wikipedia... apparently aGPS is NOT just crappy cell-phone GPS... it's regular GPS that ADDS the ability to receive augementation from data provided via the cellular network. Makes lock times much quicker and improves accuracy. I think this phone is going to have a fully capable GPS like we have in the kaiser.

My favorite feature is the WVGA... I used to have VGA on my axim x50v and it makes SUCH a big difference in screen clarity and web browsing... I'll DEFINITELY be swapping my Tilt for this bad boy... assuming it works fine on AT&T's network.

Let's be very clear. This phone does not have GPS. It may be able to do positioning using cell positioning, etc but it will not be GPS as we know it. As I said in a previous email, if you want GPS, you will have to buy the GPS-headphones as advertised as an (extra cost!) accessory on the Sony site.

Considering it has a "everything including the kitchen sink" specification, this is very surprising.

I wouldn't be considering replacing my Kaiser at this very early stage anyway, so the lack of GPS is not a big deal for me.

[Malik05]

Is there a WM phone that they don't cover?

Absolutely, they dont cover any of Etens products, i-mate products etc.

[the_passenger]

I think that's a re-branded Tytn III hardware part, the software will probably come from SonyEricsson.

[Boinng]

Let's be very clear. This phone does not have GPS.

YES IT DOES! Why is everyone suddenly unable to understand what aGPS means, when most of you have been using an aGPS device for months? Assisted GPS does not mean no GPS, it just means it has GPS plus something else - most likely Quick GPS installed!

It may be able to do positioning using cell positioning, etc but it will not be GPS as we know it.

It's exactly GPS as we know it - it's just like the Kaiser, which is also technically aGPS!

As I said in a previous email, if you want GPS, you will have to buy the GPS-headphones as advertised as an (extra cost!) accessory on the Sony site.

That would be the accessory which SE have been selling for all their other phones for months, which is based on their Fastport connector right? The same Fastport connector which the X1 blatantly DOESN'T HAVE?

Just give it up - that accessory list on the SE site lists a whole load of junk that can't possibly be used with the X1. It's a cock-up, that's all - the planned X1 accessories probably don't exist yet.

Considering it has a "everything including the kitchen sink" specification, this is very surprising.

Yes it is - ludicrously surprising, unbelievable even. With very good reason! :rolleyes:

[~~Tito~~]

YES IT DOES! Why is everyone suddenly unable to understand what aGPS means, when most of you have been using an aGPS device for months? Assisted GPS does not mean no GPS, it just means it has GPS plus something else - most likely Quick GPS installed!



It's exactly GPS as we know it - it's just like the Kaiser, which is also technically aGPS!



That would be the accessory which SE have been selling for all their other phones for months, which is based on their Fastport connector right? The same Fastport connector which the X1 blatantly DOESN'T HAVE?

Just give it up - that accessory list on the SE site lists a whole load of junk that can't possibly be used with the X1. It's a cock-up, that's all - the planned X1 accessories probably don't exist yet.



Yes it is - ludicrously surprising, unbelievable even. With very good reason! :rolleyes:

Yes, finnaly someone who understands to read the specs! SE just said aGPS so reporters and people who know a lot about mobile technologies would understand, when it gets released however, it will most likely say GPS instead of aGPS so there is no confusion or thinking its crap.

[arabbitte]

I'm happy to stand corrected. :o Infact, since I posted this, I saw some an SE rep being interviewed on youtube where he confirmed that this device has GPS.

I have actually spent a little time reading up on agps, know a bit about it and have used it - and seen it's benefits - on my Kaiser; I just never saw anywhere that agps is a superset of gps.

Ok, back on topic. With a screen resolution of 800 X 480 in a screen only marginally bigger than the Kaiser, how legible will existing applications be with the considerably smaller pixel-size. I know wm6 offers a zoom facility, but will this offer enough granularity to work in practice. At the moment my reading eyesight is perfect, but give it a few years (when my Kaiser will be put out to grass) and I'm not so sure ...;)

[ouminan]

From my knowledge of existing WinMo implementations of higher resolution screens, we'll be seeing pixel doubling for the standard interface, giving us what would appear to be 400x240 widescreen instead of the standard 320x240, except everything would appear much much sharper.

The higher resolution would come in handy for multi-media... pictures, video, etc would be much more detailed. Also web browsing will allow much more "viewable" area when zoomed out.

This is all speculation of course though. :)

[qualcomm]

It uses HTC-USB and MicroSD, probably it will be a TyTN III

[Brau0303]

I always said when Sony was releasing devices running on Palm (and they were cutting edge *Mostly* in the hardware department) it would really be great if Sony would go with a WinMo device. This is looking very nice but, it they follow their nornal pattern this will use some form of Memory Stick tech. I still like it tho.... :)

Cheers
BR

[p3ngwin]

As far as I know, both are true - it's a 520mhz ARM11 based chip made by Qualcomm. Closely related to the chip in our Kaiser's, I'll wager.

hmmm, i wonder if the Xperia uses Qualcomm's brand new MDMxxxxx chips.

[Menneisyys]

hmmm, i wonder if the Xperia uses Qualcomm's brand new MDMxxxxx chips.

I think it´ll be based on Qualcomm; see my related remarks at http://pocketpcmag.com/blogs/

[Menneisyys]

I always said when Sony was releasing devices running on Palm (and they were cutting edge *Mostly* in the hardware department) it would really be great if Sony would go with a WinMo device. This is looking very nice but, it they follow their nornal pattern this will use some form of Memory Stick tech. I still like it tho.... :)

Cheers
BR

It won´t - it´s microSD-based. Follow my articles at http://pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - I´m at Barcelona and posting a LOT of stuff on XPERIA.

[p3ngwin]

I think it´ll be based on Qualcomm; see my related remarks at http://pocketpcmag.com/blogs/

i don't see any qualcomm references on that page, just a bunch of articles with some comments but nothing about the chipset.

can you link the exact page, or maybe paste the info here ?

[XtreMe_G]

i don't see any qualcomm references on that page, just a bunch of articles with some comments but nothing about the chipset.

can you link the exact page, or maybe paste the info here ?

if u had click the link at the bottom that said "next page" you would have seen this


Qualcomm chipset inside?!

Speaking of the Sony-Ericsson & Microsoft press conference, one of the questions addressed assisted GPS – that is, why the device doesn’t have a GPS chipset not necessarily requiring the help of an Assistance Server for quick locking. The Sony folks have stated they needed to reduce the physical size of the device; this is why they haven’t included a dedicated GPS chip(set) like that of SiRFstar III.

Consequently, it must be the core phone CPU / chipset that already has (assisted) GPS, which may mean it’s based on the well-known Qualcomm MSM7200/7500, as neither the TI OMAP nor the Intel (now, Marvell) Xscale architecture has GPS support built-in, not even in the latest versions (this is why, for example, the Nokia N95/N82, which are both based on the latest and excellent TI OMAP chipset, needed a separate SiRFstar II LP GPS chipset).

[JKingDev]

if u had click the link at the bottom that said "next page" you would have seen thisSo based on that, does it have a gpsOne in the Qualcomm chipset? Because the gpsOne that qualcomm uses is capable of standalone operation. Is this a another case of sony reps that don't know what they are talking about? Does anyone know whether the device will be capable of standalone GPS operation? Because if it is not, I don't think I would get it.

Also, is the MSM7200 capable of running at 520mhz, or is it a different MSM chipset model then?

[p3ngwin]

if u had click the link at the bottom that said "next page" you would have seen this

ah, i understand now, you made a mistake on the URL you provided. i see the comments now.

the Xperia better have full drivers to access the hardware, i can't imagine the headache if this becomes common practice for use users making sure we get what's promised.

[JKingDev]

ah, i understand now, you made a mistake on the URL you provided. i see the comments now.

the Xperia better have full drivers to access the hardware, i can't imagine the headache if this becomes common practice for use users making sure we get what's promised.That is exactly what this is becoming. Now every time a device comes out that says it has some hardware, everybody wants to know does it actually have the drivers to utilize that hardware. According to HTC and Qualcomm, a.)having a chipset does not mean all advertised features of the chipset are supported and b.)the specifications of a chipset are subject to change without notice. It is an outrage. HTCClassAction needs to proceed with a lawsuit because this kind of uncertainty is not fair.

[bapssystupr3m3]

That is exactly what this is becoming. Now every time a device comes out that says it has some hardware, everybody wants to know does it actually have the drivers to utilize that hardware. According to HTC and Qualcomm, a.)having a chipset does not mean all advertised features of the chipset are supported and b.)the specifications of a chipset are subject to change without notice. It is an outrage. HTCClassAction needs to proceed with a lawsuit because this kind of uncertainty is not fair.
thats kinda gay...tats like putting the good shit in the phone and specs and then it turns out that none of them works...then whats the point of having those in the first place if ur gonna put it in a phone thats not gonna support it...but if they fix the problems that the kaiser has...its time to sell my tytn ii xD

[p3ngwin]

That is exactly what this is becoming. Now every time a device comes out that says it has some hardware, everybody wants to know does it actually have the drivers to utilize that hardware. According to HTC and Qualcomm, a.)having a chipset does not mean all advertised features of the chipset are supported and b.)the specifications of a chipset are subject to change without notice. It is an outrage. HTCClassAction needs to proceed with a lawsuit because this kind of uncertainty is not fair.
i agree totally!
it is irrelevant if the specs change between companies supplying each other, or when trading,etc. when the company sells it to the END CUSTOMER, they know EXACTLY what it can and can't do. so they should not be able to legally sell products that differ from their advertised specs!

i repeat the car analogy:
if you bought a car advertised as having aV8 engine, you expect all the cylinders to work.
if the company receives a V8 engine from it's suppliers but doesn't receive the "drivers" to utilize all cylinders, then DON'T ADVERTISE IT AS A REGULAR V8 !!
there is a reason for specifications...they say what it CAN DO.

if the Qualcomm MSM7X00 chipset has the hardware, but not the drivers to perform 100% then it is the company selling the final product (in this case HTC) that has the responsibility to let the user know the chip PERFORMS DIFFERENTLY FROM OTHER IDENTICAL CHIPS.
they need not explain the reason, but they certainly should be legally required to fulfill their stated capabilities.
that means if they say it has a feature or chip, it had better perform that very feature, and have EXACTLY the same performance as that chip anywhere else. if HTC's "implementation" changes anything, TELL THE CUSTOMER!

can you imagine this kind of practice in other areas of retail?
you buy shoes from a shop that sells the EXACT same looking shoe as next door, it is advertised as having all the features and performance, yet the development and inter-company trading meant that the final shoes DOES NOT PERFORM/HAVE ALL THE FEATURES of the same shoe next door.......marketed as the SAME SHOES, BUT ACTUALLY DIFFERENT!

HOW THE HELL IS THAT LEGAL??

you buy a PC only to find that although the specs of the chips are identical to another shop's PC, this one you buy doesn't document the fact that it is crippled in some way with less performance & features.......lawsuit waiting to happen.

i say get on with the lawsuit and make companies realize they can not and will not get away with this. the moment they are given and inch in such matters is the beginning of a landslide where they will be able to lie to customers about anything they want and we will have no legal legs to stand on.

hardware is useless without the software to drive it. if you advertise the hardware it is assumed the software comes with it.

DON'T LET THIS BECOME A PRECEDENT !!!

even if Qualcomm "suprised" HTC with their cost of drivers, and HTC weren't willing to pay the extra. that is no excuse to sell hardware with misleading specs.

[Menneisyys]

Just posted a brand new link & some great pics of the XPERIA X1 to http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=mwc_breaking_sony_ericsson_xperia_x1_new&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

[Ayle]

Did they give a release date?

[wilsonzone]

I am keepin my Kaiser.... looks good but I feel with a driver update my phone will meet all my needs. :)

[Menneisyys]

Did they give a release date?

Second half of the year.

[~~Tito~~]

plenty of time to add more stuff and make it better!

[p3ngwin]

plenty of time to add more stuff and make it better!

do you mean EVEN better? :)

it's already got the hardware and features to make one of the BEST...if they can add some unique apps or make an attractive price (unlikely as it's a Sony), then it could be a cracker.

as it is i'd buy it right now as long as it has the software to use the hardware features (HTC i'm looking at YOU!).

if not this Xperia, then maybe i'll get a "snapdragon" based device around the same time later this year....either way there are some amazing devices coming out this year.

[srmz]

Whenever a new device is announced we are all so excited. However when it becomes actually available we get bombarded with bugs and shortcomings.

Just hope Sony Ericsson thoroughly and completely tests the Xperia and irons out at least the most annoying bugs.

[Menneisyys]

Just posted Part II of my MWC New Devices article, fully packed with pics & links: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1983172 . I've THOROUGHLY elaborated on a LOT of new devices – certainly worth a read!

[tombrown1]

Just saw some Xperia's "for sale" and e-mailed this guy about one. Here is the response:

Hi

Thanks for your inquiry regarding the Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 units for sale.

The units are: Brand New, Factory Sealed in OEM Retail box and Never Used

Each Comes with
Full Accessories
Unlocked(works with all networks worldwide)
Receipt
1 Year Warranty
30day return policy
100% money back guarantee
Special Offer: Buy 3 and Get 1 Free.

Price is: US$450 and shipping is free and overnight if in California and $25 to other states.

For Payments we accept Money Gram or Western Union to enable us ship within 12hours upon payment confirmation.

Send your full delivery details if you still intend to place your order.

Thanks
Ken Barton.




From: tombrown1@yahoo.com
Subject: Sony xperia
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 09:05:26 -0500
To: onorangellc@live.com

Do you have this in stock? If so, how did you get it?





Is this a well-known scam that I didn't know about? I also e-mailed another guy who claimed to be selling one - and he said it was in stock too - he said that Sony Ericsson had given him some for "Sample Sales".

[regius]

Just saw some Xperia's "for sale" and e-mailed this guy about one. Here is the response:

Hi

Thanks for your inquiry regarding the Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 units for sale.

The units are: Brand New, Factory Sealed in OEM Retail box and Never Used

Each Comes with
Full Accessories
Unlocked(works with all networks worldwide)
Receipt
1 Year Warranty
30day return policy
100% money back guarantee
Special Offer: Buy 3 and Get 1 Free.

Price is: US$450 and shipping is free and overnight if in California and $25 to other states.

For Payments we accept Money Gram or Western Union to enable us ship within 12hours upon payment confirmation.

Send your full delivery details if you still intend to place your order.

Thanks
Ken Barton.




From: tombrown1@yahoo.com
Subject: Sony xperia
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 09:05:26 -0500
To: onorangellc@live.com

Do you have this in stock? If so, how did you get it?





Is this a well-known scam that I didn't know about? I also e-mailed another guy who claimed to be selling one - and he said it was in stock too - he said that Sony Ericsson had given him some for "Sample Sales".

Friendly advice: do never buy anything from people asking you to pay via western union! they can as well charge your credit card, but then they will be trace-able.

[tombrown1]

Ahhhh...I thought there was something fishy. Thanks for the tip.

[mcva]

Release date.. uuhhh year is 2009, february! Till then, there is no kaiser-killer. :-D
Source: http://semcblog.wordpress.com/2008/02/28/release/ (where you see the difference between the annouce date, and the actual releasing of the phone... or 'computer').

[Boinng]

You'll find that "Ken Barton" is actually some enterprising chap in Nigeria, just waiting for your money transfer. The text of the email is very familiar - if you emailed back asking for their price on a Whoop-de-doo Phonegulator X500 they'd tell you they had that in stock too, and it's $450...

Proceed any further and you'll find their international despatch office (and preferred branch of Western Union) just happens to be in east Africa.

[Boinng]

Release date.. uuhhh year is 2009, february! Till then, there is no kaiser-killer. :-D
Source: http://semcblog.wordpress.com/2008/02/28/release/ (where you see the difference between the annouce date, and the actual releasing of the phone... or 'computer').

If you read around the subject, you'll find that 2009 release date has been confirmed as a mistake on the part of SE's webmaster - the original H2, 2008 release date still stands.

[JKingDev]

Release date.. uuhhh year is 2009, february! Till then, there is no kaiser-killer. :-D
Source: http://semcblog.wordpress.com/2008/02/28/release/ (where you see the difference between the annouce date, and the actual releasing of the phone... or 'computer').Nope.
http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/03/sony-ericsson-says-xperia-x1-is-still-on-track-for-this-year/

[mcva]

Nope.
http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/03/sony-ericsson-says-xperia-x1-is-still-on-track-for-this-year/

I see, you're right. Luckily, there's a forum to straighten these things :-)

[Bronx31]

Just wanted to bump this with new info:)

http://developer.sonyericsson.com/getDocument.do?docId=100340

[p3ngwin]

Just wanted to bump this with new info:)

http://developer.sonyericsson.com/getDocument.do?docId=100340

some solid info there.
thanks dude!

this affirms more and more for me that this is indeed a great phone.

i've been looking closely at the video hardware acceleration feature since the HTCclassaction.org incident and wanted to make sure this SE phone had FULL hardware AND software acceleration. seems it does.

the other thing i find important is video recording.
i want at least VGA @ 30fps.
seems this phone can do it in more than one format as a bonus.


curiously, if you live i the USA, the device will be restricted to QVGA @24fps.
Quote from the white paper.PDF:
----------------------------------------
• MPEG-4: 30fps @ VGA*
• H.263: 30fps @ VGA*
• H.264: 15fps @ VGA*
*US model supports MPEG4, H.263 24fps encoding @QVGA only and not H.264
------------------------------------------
a Hollywood restriction enforced on mobile devices?
wouldn't be surprised.

i've been wondering why mobiles that long had the processing resources to record video at their screen's full resolution at 30fps, yet software restricted to QVGA@15fps.

[Bronx31]

QVGA[/COLOR] @24fps.
Quote from the white paper.PDF:
----------------------------------------
• MPEG-4: 30fps @ VGA*
• H.263: 30fps @ VGA*
• H.264: 15fps @ VGA*
*US model supports MPEG4, H.263 24fps encoding @QVGA only and not H.264
------------------------------------------
a Hollywood restriction enforced on mobile devices

wouldn't be surprised, as i've been wondering why mobiles have long had the processing resources to record video at their screen's full resolution at 30fps, yet software restricted to QVGA@15fps.

This is why I will be buying an unbranded version. Hollywood, bah humbug:mad:.. Land of the free, hmmm

[JKingDev]

Hollywood restriction? Umm, I seriously doubt that. Probably due to the different US version of the MSM7200A to get around the IP issue.

Keep in mind this is an early version. The phone is not released yet so don't start judging it by the whitepaper yet. Things like the omission of the 1700 3G band (:eek:) may be mistakes or something that will change later.

[Haxxxess]

Seems like a must get phone. Should I sell my kaiser now ? It should come out in what, 3 months?

[Sleuth255]

Interestingly, the "Today screen" in the center of the group in the promo clip shows something that looks just like HTC homeplug...

now, how could that be I ask you ;)

[p3ngwin]

Hollywood restriction? Umm, I seriously doubt that. Probably due to the different US version of the MSM7200A to get around the IP issue.
...

i don't understand.
what IP infringement are you meaning?

also, how does restricting the video recording output avoid any IP dispute?

surely if there is an IP dispute it will be about the inclusion of hardware, and if the hardware is still in this phone then how does limiting the quality of it's use avoid IP problems??

[XtreMe_G]

relax boys.....like JKingDev said, the phone is not released yet, and if there really is that restriction on the video recording on the US version.......we always have xda devs to "fix" that for us dont we :D

[JKingDev]

i don't understand.
what IP infringement are you meaning?

also, how does restricting the video recording output avoid any IP dispute?

surely if there is an IP dispute it will be about the inclusion of hardware, and if the hardware is still in this phone then how does limiting the quality of it's use avoid IP problems??I am not suggesting that they are simply restricting the output. I mean to say the US version of the processor is not as capable as the international version. The Qualcomm MSM7*00 chipset infringed on Broadcomm technologies inluding "video compression for mobile phones, walkie-talkie style wireless technology, and simultaneous communication between different types of networks." Qualcomm was required to create a separate version of all MSM7*00 chipsets to sell in the US (part of the reason for the delay in the imate ultimates that used the MSM chipsets). So I am guessing that the version with the infringing technologies removed does not perform as well for video. It was just a speculation when I posted before, but after googling what the infringing technologies are, it seems that it is most likely the reason. I guess Qualcomm can't do video without a little help from their competitor. :)

Source:
http://www.intomobile.com/2007/08/17/qualcomm-in-more-legal-trouble-with-broadcom-broadcom-wants-cross-licensing-deal.html

[p3ngwin]

I am not suggesting that they are simply restricting the output. I mean to say the US version of the processor is not as capable as the international version. The Qualcomm MSM7*00 chipset infringed on Broadcomm technologies inluding "video compression for mobile phones, walkie-talkie style wireless technology, and simultaneous communication between different types of networks." Qualcomm was required to create a separate version of all MSM7*00 chipsets to sell in the US (part of the reason for the delay in the imate ultimates that used the MSM chipsets). So I am guessing that the version with the infringing technologies removed does not perform as well for video. It was just a speculation when I posted before, but after googling what the infringing technologies are, it seems that it is most likely the reason. I guess Qualcomm can't do video without a little help from their competitor. :)

Source:
http://www.intomobile.com/2007/08/17/qualcomm-in-more-legal-trouble-with-broadcom-broadcom-wants-cross-licensing-deal.html

excellent information, i appreciate your time & energy!

After reading that info i believe as you do.
that the device will have different chips for different regions. it's the most probable reason.

the USA will have the legally pleasing "redesigned/crippled" chip. the rest of the world gets the better performing "litigious chip" :)

i've been dying for recording VGA@30fps, so unless some devices with performance and features like qualcomm's "snapdragon" appear by the end of the year, i'm looking at getting this SE device.

[aksd]

Seems like the whitepaper was posted earlier, I seem to have missed it. Anyway heres the download for the whitepaper.

[naveen]

I'd say this phone was probably born in partnership; SE will have created the external design, HTC came up with the internals. Quite possibly the same internals we'll also see in the Tytn III, Vario 4 etc?

Calling it a "Kaiser killer" is missing the point a little - by the time this phone is released, HTC will be killing the Kaiser itself with their own new devices. This kind of spec (WVGA, strong video performance etc) is exactly what you'd expect of the Kaiser's sequel.

that is what i was thinking. the kaiser is now a year old. the x1 verses the tytn iii is something we should be talking about when more info comes out.:D a win win situtation for customers i think!

[Bronx31]

Guess I'll start saving now.. This is going to be 1 expensive to for me:o I will be getting the non USA version:D

[Digitaltigre]

Iphone killer this, Kaiser Killer that...

The NVIDIA APX 2500 chip platform is going to DESTROY all smartphones/PDAs! I posted about it on another thread. Here is the info:

A lot of people have been clamoring about the Sony Xperia X1. I personally don't get it - I mean it adds VGA right and looks better than the TyTNII. But it's really just a baby step above the TyTNII and the press says it will be the best winmo phone ever. Honestly I'm upset enough about my Kaiser that I've been thinking about getting an X1 myself. I will not be fooled again though and I ABSOLUTELY NEED to know if it has hardware acceleration before I get it. I've been looking into it and searching for a definitive answer to no avail. The worry here stems from the fact that it uses the same damn chipset as the TyTNII and is also being built by HTC. Apparently when pressed on the 3d hardware question, Sony-Ericsson is not exactly boosting anyones confidence...
"When I’ve asked them about the 3D acceleration, they have stated they try to implement it, but nothing is for sure. (Read: it’s in no way guaranteed the device will have hardware 3D acceleration – that is, the official spec may not become fully implemented.)" (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=mwc_more_s_e_xperia_x1_info_aamp_photos&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1)

Bottom line is if this thing doesn't fully use the chips architecture, forget about it. They are setting themselves up for a fall because the software vs hardware issue is already well known.

Now, why am I so excited? Because I found in my searches that NVIDIA is producing chips for moble phones. I read about it earlier and didn't really think about it all that much - but I just saw a video of a concept UI on a prototype device that gave me chills. You've heard of NVIDIA right? They are set to forever change the mobile device market! Our GD little cat and mouse game with this BS company HTC is going to be a big joke when NVIDIA chipped phones come out. Just take a quick glance at these specs:

* ARM11 MPCore
* HD AVP (High Definition Audio Video Processor) 720p H.264, MPEG-4, and VC-1/WMV9 Decode
* 720p H.264 and MPEG-4 Encode
* Supports multi-standard audio formats including AAC, AMR, WMA, and MP3
* JPEG encode and decode acceleration
* ULP (Ultra Low Power) GeForce GPU
* OpenGL ES 2.0
* D3D Mobile
* Programmable pixel shader
* Programmable vertex and lighting
* CSAA support
* Advanced 2D graphics
* Up to 12Mpixel camera sensor support
* Advanced imaging features
* True dual display support
* 720p (1280×720) HDMI 1.2 support
* SXGA (1280×1024) LCD and CRT support
* Composite and S-Video TV output
source w/video links (http://www.intomobile.com/2008/02/16/nvidia-go-large-at-mwc.html)
Official NVIDIA site w/chip info (http://www.nvidia.com/object/apx_2500.html)

Also, this chip is supposedly so optimized that it will do 10 hours of HD video playback or 100 hours of audio on a normal cellphone battery.

I'm telling you HTC is not going to nickel and dime me to death while I continue hoping they will come through as expected. No more baby steps for me. I'm waiting for an APX 2500 chip phone. Then I'm going to smash my TyTNNII into little pieces with a big hammer.

And then HTC can officially stick this right up their ass...
""HTC believes the overall value of its devices based on their combination of functionality and connectivity exceeds their ability to play or render high-resolution video. These devices do still provide a rich multimedia experience comparable to that of most smartphones and enable a variety of audio and video file formats," reads the official response, in part. Furthermore, the company has officially confirmed that Imageon drivers are not in use on the affected devices, but that it "plans to include video acceleration hardware in future video-centric devices that will enable high-resolution video support.""

[Insaneboy]

18 months away though... :(
For now Xperia will have to do, and who knows what X2 and X3 might be. :P

[Rudegar]

"The NVIDIA APX 2500 chip platform is going to DESTROY all smartphones/PDAs!"

sure apart from the business segment and the casual non gaming user who dident pick their phone to play quake best ;)

[fb.knight]

"The NVIDIA APX 2500 chip platform is going to DESTROY all smartphones/PDAs!"

sure apart from the business segment and the casual non gaming user who dident pick their phone to play quake best ;)


burn! :D i can see what he means though any advancment is excighting

[Digitaltigre]

"The NVIDIA APX 2500 chip platform is going to DESTROY all smartphones/PDAs!"

sure apart from the business segment and the casual non gaming user who dident pick their phone to play quake best ;)

I hadn't thought about that but I don't understand exactly. If you pick this up in a winmo flavor what do you suppose it will be missing? That UI they are showing off is just a prototype and I'd bet the devices will offer the option of the winmo standard front end.

[otheruser]

"The NVIDIA APX 2500 chip platform is going to DESTROY all smartphones/PDAs!"

sure apart from the business segment and the casual non gaming user who dident pick their phone to play quake best ;)

iPhone Sales, 2008 Q1 (in millions): 2315
iPhone Sales, 2007 Q4 (in millions): 1119

There's clearly a market for high-end non-corporate phones...

[Rudegar]

sure i would get one myself if it dont suck the battery dry too fast :)

[4Site]

I took an oath to never buy another HTC product again, and i'm sticking to it, regardless of it being label HTC or otherwise.

Can't quite fathom why everyone is getting so excited over the X1 what does it offer the Tytn II? It fits in perfectly with HTCs policy of drip feeding us minisclue upgrades year on year, even if this means purposely cripling a device by disabling something it is capable of. HTC has just about admitted with its press release in the wake of Drivergate that it's aim is to get us to upgrade our device year on year without giving us much value for our money in terms of Technological advancement. Just look at what nvidia's platform is promising versus the X1. YaY i'm gonna get an X1!! It offers a small memory boost and a long overdue screen resolution upgrade, and (get this part) MAYBE, thats right, MAYBE hardware accellerated graphics (no confirmation so far) over my current device.

I suggest we have a lockdown. i'm sure 11,000 signatures vowing to never buy a HTC product ever again might get more attention from HTC than 11,000 kindly requesting they provide drivers for a device we already departed with our cash for (how messed up does that last bit sound)

[laakness]

I took an oath to never buy another HTC product again, and i'm sticking to it, regardless of it being label HTC or otherwise.

Can't quite fathom why everyone is getting so excited over the X1 what does it offer the Tytn II? It fits in perfectly with HTCs policy of drip feeding us minisclue upgrades year on year, even if this means purposely cripling a device by disabling something it is capable of. HTC has just about admitted with its press release in the wake of Drivergate that it's aim is to get us to upgrade our device year on year without giving us much value for our money in terms of Technological advancement. Just look at what nvidia's platform is promising versus the X1. YaY i'm gonna get an X1!! It offers a small memory boost and a long overdue screen resolution upgrade, and (get this part) MAYBE, thats right, MAYBE hardware accellerated graphics (no confirmation so far) over my current device.

I suggest we have a lockdown. i'm sure 11,000 signatures vowing to never buy a HTC product ever again might get more attention from HTC than 11,000 kindly requesting they provide drivers for a device we already departed with our cash for (how messed up does that last bit sound)

Yeah, sadly as much as I love tinkering with all the awesome work the other members of this site do I can't see myself sticking with HTC for my next phone. Nvidia has my interest peaked but they will just sell the graphics chip. I'll be sticking with the Tilt the rest of this year and then I'll have to see what's coming.

[Digitaltigre]

Yeah, sadly as much as I love tinkering with all the awesome work the other members of this site do I can't see myself sticking with HTC for my next phone. Nvidia has my interest peaked but they will just sell the graphics chip. I'll be sticking with the Tilt the rest of this year and then I'll have to see what's coming.

NVIDIA will just sell the chip yes, and it will be up to a device manufacturer to bring the chips power and abilities to fruition. We'll be watching closely for that. Don't count on HTC to be the one though because they would likely secretively disable some hardware portion and use a software workaround if it means more money in their pockets.

[JKingDev]

I took an oath to never buy another HTC product again, and i'm sticking to it, regardless of it being label HTC or otherwise.

Can't quite fathom why everyone is getting so excited over the X1 what does it offer the Tytn II? It fits in perfectly with HTCs policy of drip feeding us minisclue upgrades year on year, even if this means purposely cripling a device by disabling something it is capable of. HTC has just about admitted with its press release in the wake of Drivergate that it's aim is to get us to upgrade our device year on year without giving us much value for our money in terms of Technological advancement. Just look at what nvidia's platform is promising versus the X1. YaY i'm gonna get an X1!! It offers a small memory boost and a long overdue screen resolution upgrade, and (get this part) MAYBE, thats right, MAYBE hardware accellerated graphics (no confirmation so far) over my current device.

I suggest we have a lockdown. i'm sure 11,000 signatures vowing to never buy a HTC product ever again might get more attention from HTC than 11,000 kindly requesting they provide drivers for a device we already departed with our cash for (how messed up does that last bit sound)What does it offer? Are you kidding? WVGA (not just VGA), 128MB (a HUGE benifit for those who know what it is like to use WM6 with only 64; not a benefit over the Tytn II though, I know), optical dpad in addition to 4 way key, 3.5mm jack, 3.2mp camera (and SONY cameras are actually good), great keyboard, good looking, 528mhz processor, MSM7200A (which uses 65nm technology=much better battery life). It has a TON of benefits. This is filling a void where the best devices should be. VGA+128mb RAM. That alone is the selling point. You can run from HTC all you want, but they are the only manufacturer out there making devices worth buying (imates are nice, but X1 is better). If this device was spec'd like the imate 9502, i would agree that it is a minimal upgrade. But it is worlds better. I was pissed by the driver issue too (I have a mogul which is affected) but what are you gonna do? The X1 is an awesome device. Admit it. You want it :). There is no alternative. At least SE is developing it, and they won't let HTC screw it up. And HTC can't completely f*ck the graphics acceleration again. They and SE know that.

[prealphageek]

But a good try... No GPS on the Sony. How could they leave that out?

http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1117&id2=733

[Rudegar]

http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/products/mobilephones/specifications/x1?cc=dk&lc=eng
look for the aGps part

also it have 512MB flash storage

[~~Tito~~]

Whats wrong with HTC manufacturing it? They don't make the design or anything, they just build them, and SE does the rest. I have been reading and some people don't understand that. . . .:confused::confused:

[magius]

I apologize if this bit was posted before, but before we all celebrate:

From an update on PocketPC Mag:
"Hardware specification-wise, they haven’t told me anything not present in the leaflet. The latter also contains the currently known configuration. When I’ve asked them about the 3D acceleration, they have stated they try to implement it, but nothing is for sure. (Read: it’s in no way guaranteed the device will have hardware 3D acceleration – that is, the official spec may not become fully implemented.)"

http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=mwc_more_s_e_xperia_x1_info_aamp_photos&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

I am hoping one of you guys have seen an update to this. :(
The whitepaper just says 3D, that can mean anything.

[4Site]

What does it offer? Are you kidding? WVGA (not just VGA), 128MB (a HUGE benifit for those who know what it is like to use WM6 with only 64; not a benefit over the Tytn II though, I know), optical dpad in addition to 4 way key, 3.5mm jack, 3.2mp camera (and SONY cameras areh actually good), great keyboard, good looking, 528mhz processor, MSM7200A (which uses 65nm technology=much better battery life). It has a TON of benefits. This is filling a void where the best devices should be. VGA+128mb RAM. That alone is the selling point. You can run from HTC all you want, but they are the only manufacturer out there making devices worth buying (imates are nice, but X1 is better). If this device was spec'd like the imate 9502, i would agree that it is a minimal upgrade. But it is worlds better. I was pissed by the driver issue too (I have a mogul which is affected) but what are you gonna do? The X1 is an awesome device. Admit it. You want it :). There is no alternative. At least SE is developing it, and they won't let HTC screw it up. And HTC can't completely f*ck the graphics acceleration again. They and SE know that.

What a massive heap of hot air...
Please check the Tytn II's specs and then tell me apart from the screen resolution what exactly does the X1 have over the Tytn II?

[Insaneboy]

According to this, its coming in August 2008. *yay*

http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/9017.html

[mchapman007]

What a massive heap of hot air...
Please check the Tytn II's specs and then tell me apart from the screen resolution what exactly does the X1 have over the Tytn II?

Massive doses of eye candy for one...... :)

[JKingDev]

What a massive heap of hot air...
Please check the Tytn II's specs and then tell me apart from the screen resolution what exactly does the X1 have over the Tytn II?Try actually reading my post smart guy.

[Noam23]

From an update on PocketPC Mag:
"Hardware specification-wise, they haven’t told me anything not present in the leaflet. The latter also contains the currently known configuration. When I’ve asked them about the 3D acceleration, they have stated they try to implement it, but nothing is for sure. (Read: it’s in no way guaranteed the device will have hardware 3D acceleration – that is, the official spec may not become fully implemented.)"

We all saw the Youtube clips of the Xperia, there is no way that the windows flow so smoothly without 3D acceleration. NO WAY.

[Insaneboy]

We all saw the Youtube clips of the Xperia, there is no way that the windows flow so smoothly without 3D acceleration. NO WAY.
On the other hand there was some lag with the UI when they pulled the qwerty.

[Jozer99]

Take a look at PocketCM. With some good programming, or prerendered animations (aka video animations), you can easily make the graphics look way more powerful than they actually are.

[Insaneboy]

About this thread - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=381708
And about this video http://youtube.com/watch?v=Q9C3zUJIi1k
To the people in there saying that the xperia seems sluggish:
The woman there did say that its running on pre-production firmware and that it's a static demo.
I really hope that the real thing isnt like that though :P
And the fish panel is realllyyy nice!

[Boinng]

In all honesty, there is NOTHING in that X1 video that I can't imagine the kaiser running, stutters and lag and all. While you can excuse everything with the pre-production line, you certainly can't use it as evidence that the X1 has the drivers, or indeed any additional speed at all.

The jury's still out.

[Insaneboy]

Here's what wiki says about 3D acceleration:

In order to record 30fps VGA video, the Qualcomm video driver for 3D acceleration was enabled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Ericsson_XPERIA_X1#System_Specifications

Though that's wiki, so it cant be trusted. :p

[Bronx31]

Just stopped by to drop this:

http://www.wmexperts.com/reviews/smartphones/review_first_impressions_of_th.html


Scroll down to UNDER THE HOOD :D:D:D

[Rudegar]

looks alot fatter then on the CAD pictures

[Insaneboy]

What type of chipset--its rumored to be MSM-7xxx(a), which is a 63nm variant.

Qualcomm's MSM7200A CPU, 528Mhz (confirmed and utilizing graphic acceleration drivers)
YAY!
Looks like they have to work out the panels sluggishnessness though.

[iantaylor27]

Intersting will be the V900 from eten, they hopefully will have a M900 by then and it will have DAB/TV etc and has faster samsung chip.

[rx jr.]

figures. sony hasn't made anything good in a while.

[DeepThought]

figures. sony hasn't made anything good in a while.

That's right. And even if they build a proper hardware, the chances are very good that they ruin it with a buggy overloaded software. It will be their first WM phone.....

[rakdoll]

That's right. And even if they build a proper hardware, the chances are very good that they ruin it with a buggy overloaded software. It will be their first WM phone.....

I am SURE that SE has created this phone hand to hand with HTC, since HTC manufactured it. Ring any bells? And chances are that SE can afford a lot better software dev team than HTC, which seems to lean purely on xda devs here. :)

I have read thru 5 different forums about X1, and I'm most disappointed to the coming user base of it. Seems like it's going to be a phone for multihandicapped people. Also, the SE has this image of serving phones for bachelors and machos. :D Which I dislike. Too bad that this phone seems that good, I most likely have to join the multihandicappedblindidiotdipshitmachoclub. :(

[p3ngwin]

there's a guy with a site called BENGALBOY.com (http://www.bengalboy.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=1107&viewmode=flat&order=ASC&start=0&PHPSESSID=1a09d95bb4bbd2afadaf16d8f954d642)

he actually HAS 2 of the xperia's (i believe he has the USA and rest-of-world units).
in his site you can get a lot of info about all the technical and feature stuff, including responsiveness,etc.

i made a bit of a post in another thread HERE (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2323062#post2323062)(penultimate post) about such things as i am very interested in the video recording VGA@30fps.

the diamond seems tobe having trouble doing Qvga@30fps.

an important feature for me is VGA@30fps (or better maybe like the LG Viewty!)
the xperia has the same CPU as the diamond, yet for some reason, obviously software related, the diamond is only spec'd to do Qvga recording.

this annoys me as i was quite happy to get the HTC touch pro (raphael) for a universal replacement. i love my uni's big screen, and would like to have the same kind of size in WVGA. something like a 3.5" screen or something.

until another device will deliver that kind of experience for me, perhapse the "snapdragon based devices from HTC,etc, then i think i will end up with the Xperia.

so i give myself until the Xperia's released (supposedly in September) to hear about any device that will surpass it for me.

if there is nothing better for me by the end of the year, then Sony can happily have my money. then i get a device that will record video and take stills to good standard as well as the wealth of other features the Xperia seems will excell at.

[JKingDev]

there's a guy with a site called BENGALBOY.com (http://www.bengalboy.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=1107&viewmode=flat&order=ASC&start=0&PHPSESSID=1a09d95bb4bbd2afadaf16d8f954d642)

he actually HAS 2 of the xperia's (i believe he has the USA and rest-of-world units).
in his site you can get a lot of info about all the technical and feature stuff, including responsiveness,etc.

i made a bit of a post in another thread HERE (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2323062#post2323062)(penultimate post) about such things as i am very interested in the video recording VGA@30fps.

the diamond seems tobe having trouble doing Qvga@30fps.

an important feature for me is VGA@30fps (or better maybe like the LG Viewty!)
the xperia has the same CPU as the diamond, yet for some reason, obviously software related, the diamond is only spec'd to do Qvga recording.

this annoys me as i was quite happy to get the HTC touch pro (raphael) for a universal replacement. i love my uni's big screen, and would like to have the same kind of size in WVGA. something like a 3.5" screen or something.

until another device will deliver that kind of experience for me, perhapse the "snapdragon based devices from HTC,etc, then i think i will end up with the Xperia.

so i give myself until the Xperia's released (supposedly in September) to hear about any device that will surpass it for me.

if there is nothing better for me by the end of the year, then Sony can happily have my money. then i get a device that will record video and take stills to good standard as well as the wealth of other features the Xperia seems will excell at.It is not software. The US version of Qualcomm MSM chipsets is different from the rest of the world. Qualcomm must leave out video encoding technology that infringes on Broadcomm patents. That is why the US version will suck at recording video.

[p3ngwin]

It is not software. The US version of Qualcomm MSM chipsets is different from the rest of the world. Qualcomm must leave out video encoding technology that infringes on Broadcomm patents. That is why the US version will suck at recording video.

do you believe hat there will be a USA and a rest-of-the-world editions of the diamond will offer two different experiences regarding video recording?

for the Diamond, so far all we have seen are psecs regarding QVGA@30fps.
nothing else to suggest that the rest of the world versions will be any different.

the Xperia specs state that it will offer QVGA@30fps in the USA, and the rest get VGA@30fps available in 2 possible video formats.

do you know if/where we can find evidence suggesting the Diamond shares the Xperia's duality in video recording?

[JKingDev]

No, I don't know if there is evidence that there will be a difference for the Diamond. The xperia whitepaper shows that there will be a difference. You can also tell by the processor.

MSM7x00 is the original versions of the MSM chipsets. It contains the IP infringement.

MSM7x01 is the US variant with the infringement removed.

MSM7x0xA is the newer 520mhz 65nm version of the processor.

So for instance, the Kaiser has the MSM7200. It was out the door early enough to avoid the IP issues. The US Xperia has the MSM7201A, the 520mhz 65nm chip with the IP infringement removed.

[p3ngwin]

then it would seem that the diamond is forever crippled, as we have no evidence to suggest that there will be a version WITH the IP allowing it to realize it's potential and match the xperia's video recording ability.

why HTC aren't offering 2 versions ala' Xperia is anyone's guess.
it may also me HTC's loss if they don't.

[greatestkelvin]

I have a question on the Xperia X1 display. I was searching the net and it seems that it comes with QVGA display. the HTC Touch Pro comes with VGA display. Does it mean that the Touch Pro has a sharper screen? Perhaps the experts can comment

[p3ngwin]

the xperia has Wvga (800*480) resolution.
that is MORE than the Diamond's Vga (640*480).

[bapssystupr3m3]

I have a question on the Xperia X1 display. I was searching the net and it seems that it comes with QVGA display. the HTC Touch Pro comes with VGA display. Does it mean that the Touch Pro has a sharper screen? Perhaps the experts can comment
lol where did u get those specs from?? x1 has a WIDEvga

[prealphageek]

I'm pretty sure this will be replacing my Tilt, unless something more enticing is produced by HTC. Also, Android looks very promising. BTW: I don't see the HTC Dream anywhere on PDAdb.

Here are interesting links for you folks to ponder...

Right off the top I would remove iPhone and Touch Diamond for not having hardware keyboards, however I thought they should be included for comparison.

http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1330&id2=1363&id3=1311&id4=733&id5=1117

SizeEasy
http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/15019-iPhone-3G-vs-HTC-Raphael-800-vs-Sony-Ericsson-Xperia-vs-HTC-Kaiser-vs-Pack-Of-Playing-Cards

Some Xperia forum that I discovered.
http://www.Xperia-X1.org


AT&T Tilt
Dutty's WM6.1 Hybrid Cube Enabled
8GB msd, TomTom, SPB Mobile Shell 2

[Boinng]

I'm pretty sure this will be replacing my Tilt, unless something more enticing is produced by HTC.

You've heard about the Touch Pro, right? My betting is it'll be released sooner than the X1, and have a lot less problems too, since it will benefit from all the work done on the Diamond beforehand.

The title of this thread is really ridiculous in retrospect - the Kaiser is nearing the end of its product life in any case, and there's still no sign of the X1's release. Does the X1 really need to "kill" a year old, EOL product?

In reality, the fight will be between the Touch Pro (based on a proven platform, rebadged and sold under every network, likely to be released first) and the X1 (a complete unknown, badged as SE only with a "premium" price tag, long delayed). I know what my money's on.

[ryncppr]

You've heard about the Touch Pro, right? My betting is it'll be released sooner than the X1, and have a lot less problems too, since it will benefit from all the work done on the Diamond beforehand.

The title of this thread is really ridiculous in retrospect - the Kaiser is nearing the end of its product life in any case, and there's still no sign of the X1's release. Does the X1 really need to "kill" a year old, EOL product?

In reality, the fight will be between the Touch Pro (based on a proven platform, rebadged and sold under every network, likely to be released first) and the X1 (a complete unknown, badged as SE only with a "premium" price tag, long delayed). I know what my money's on.


Problem is that all the specs being released on the Touch Pro so far are for CDMA so the average Tilt User is out of luck. I am sure a GSM network Touch Pro is in the works but only here in the states we are seeing CDMA so far

[technillion]

Problem is that all the specs being released on the Touch Pro so far are for CDMA so the average Tilt User is out of luck. I am sure a GSM network Touch Pro is in the works but only here in the states we are seeing CDMA so far

..not sure what you're reading or if you're talking about the same device.
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1306

...but for me the HTC Touch Pro (GSM version) is the reason the Xperia and Omnia are not in my sights...in the states.

T
E
C

[prealphageek]

You've heard about the Touch Pro, right?

I've heard of the Touch Pro, It's essentially identical to the Raphael 800 except that the 800 is GSM and Touch Pro is CDMA.

http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1363&id2=1306

[naveen]

..not sure what you're reading or if you're talking about the same device.
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1306

...but for me the HTC Touch Pro (GSM version) is the reason the Xperia and Omnia are not in my sights...in the states.

T
E
C


850 missing though:mad: