I think wm is dead, let's get android! or is it just me

[kaalgoosy]

just returned my iphone, its like a pretty blonde; hot on the outside but nothing on the inside. i think wm is pretty much dead though; android will usher in a new era. i think we should just dismiss the last gen roms and look forward. Its obvious from apple releasing sdks for their tight ass phone that android has a little more than something up their sleeve; cant wait to see what htc devices deliver

[Lordsmiff]

Yep, it's just you.

[tonyb15re]

I beg to differ, if you put WM in the hands of a decent development house you could come up with a very nice looking device


http://www.sonyericsson.com/x1/default.aspx?cc=gb&lc=en

[penguin20000]

I beg to differ, if you put WM in the hands of a decent development house you could come up with a very nice looking device


http://www.sonyericsson.com/x1/default.aspx?cc=gb&lc=en

*drools* i can't wait for this to be released

[Fallen Spartan]

I think windows mobile is gonna be around for a while yet until something else more stable & reliable comes along. Going by the phone in link above, WM is here to stay for quite some time!!

[jompao]

just returned my iphone, its like a pretty blonde; hot on the outside but nothing on the inside. i think wm is pretty much dead though; android will usher in a new era. i think we should just dismiss the last gen roms and look forward. Its obvious from apple releasing sdks for their tight ass phone that android has a little more than something up their sleeve; cant wait to see what htc devices deliver


You can jailbreak an iphone and install a ton of useful apps today already...

I'm waiting for the next iphone with 3G and hopefully built in GPS.

[jwy2k2]

Blonde jailbait? :D

[C Brown]

The xperia is the sickest device I've seen in sometime

[BigBen]

The xperia is the sickest device I've seen in sometime

ROFL, hey Charlie, the "sickest" device?

[sacwoo]

*drools* i can't wait for this to be released

Looks Great, probably going to be $399 at least. The film (Commercial) is pretty stupid, doesn't show any features of the phone, just a bunch of paper airplanes.

Anyone know a release date on this baby?

[unicorn78]

The xperia is the sickest device I've seen in sometime

See its specification, if the price is as rumors around 700$ the Xperia X1 will be a killer of all other WM devices. I wonder why HTC doesn´t have any revolution model up coming. I prefer the high resolution display and small smart design.

[jamal1782]

Like to see this one when it comes out.
details look good.

http://www.elite-electronix.com/smartphones-213/meizu-255/meizu-m8-minione-16gb-unlocked-1379.html

[BBowermaster]

Blonde jailbait? :D

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6954/1188994406433346a87dgi3.jpg

[naveen]

Looks Great, probably going to be $399 at least. The film (Commercial) is pretty stupid, doesn't show any features of the phone, just a bunch of paper airplanes.

Anyone know a release date on this baby?


$399----wow, that is a low estimate. if the tytn i is still going for 400 i think the the x1 will be around 800-1000 when it first comes out.

[tonyb15re]

Like to see this one when it comes out.
details look good.

http://www.elite-electronix.com/smartphones-213/meizu-255/meizu-m8-minione-16gb-unlocked-1379.html

Hmmm an iphone with WM on it, what a bad combination!!!! Oh and worst of all no keyboard, no use whatsoever as a business device... Nice toy if you like poking your screen with a stylus or smearing it with fingerprints... :D

[Fallen Spartan]

I believe the expected release date for the xperia 1 is early 2009

[tonyb15re]

I phoned the Sony Shop in the UK they said mid year.

[Fallen Spartan]

excellent, I'm due a new phone bout then!

[noivaj]

Windows mobile will die. Have you guys ever really thought about this operating system we're running on our hand helds. back inthe day you had desktops pushing 166mhz and running full installs of windows 95 and in some cases I've even seen 98 on that processor. And those system ran applicatiosn and did so with not much problems.

in 2008 many years in the future we have our handsets pushing 400mhz processors (hermes) and yet it lags when you chcange screen orientation. It lags to answer a phone call if your in landscape orientation.

That is utter rubbish. Microsoft got windows mobile code wrong the firstst ime it was bloated. The reason why it'll never improve exponentially is because microsoft does not like to do things over they will forever build up ontop of a bloated operating system.

We see the same thing happening in the desktop counteer part of their operating system. If android can drop a proper user interface to make users comfortable with using the device Then i see no reason why it wouldn't superceed windows mobile

hardware vendors would be more than happy if this was the case as licensing for windows mobile cost an arm and a leg.

but really think about it
166mhz ran a whole computers operating system with various application 400mhz can barely run the windows mobile operating system properly.

Thats just disgusting.

[Fallen Spartan]

WM is already changing due to other operators including Apple, and they need to as people expect reliable, functional operating systems.
Yes I agree, microsoft are lazy, but with the introduction of android, apple etc, I think (hope) they are actually starting to sit up and take action.
If they come back with another unreliable WM then, people will start to look elsewhere and microsoft will be in trouble. Lets just hope they take note and sort it out now

[frod.mrv]

I've heard the rumors, that Sony-Ericson outsourced X1 to HTC. so it is HTC inside with Sony Ericson logo outside...

[Fallen Spartan]

Where you hear that?

[zim2dive]

WM is already changing due to other operators including Apple, and they need to as people expect reliable, functional operating systems.
Yes I agree, microsoft are lazy, but with the introduction of android, apple etc, I think (hope) they are actually starting to sit up and take action.
If they come back with another unreliable WM then, people will start to look elsewhere and microsoft will be in trouble. Lets just hope they take note and sort it out now

Sure, but the question is can do they enough, soon enough?

My main goal is to get higher resolution.. which I think is WM7 at the earliest, which is what, sometime next year?? so if I find an Android-based handset, esp with my expected ability to do what I want with it (software-wise.. ooh perl scripts on my handheld :D ).. I'll do that in a heartbeat (and assuming some kind of sync ability). else I will wait and evaluate what I can do with the iPhone SDK and go that way when their 3G version comes out.

320x240 web surfing on my 8525 simply blows chunks (very blocky looking chunks).. and while the Tilt may be a nice step up in speed and RAM, it still has a QVGA screen :( The iPhone is 480x320 (twice the pixels I have now) and I'm hoping Android will spur some better-than-QVGA devices as well.

fingers-crossed anyway.

MS owned the market that Palm lost due to complacency. Looks like history may repeat itself... just not sure who will own it next...

[Lordsmiff]

The resolution is nothing to do with the OS. WM5 could support at least VGA and more than that I think.

HTC Universal is VGA 640x480 - KMA iphone ;-) and there's a tosh WM device that's 800xsomething I think.

The limit here is the screens that HTC et al are fitting to their devices. But hey, let's just have an unjustified pop at MS anyway. After all, it is in vogue these days.

Smiffy.

[tonyb15re]

Nobody has as yet mentioned the limited amount of internal storage these devices have on board, how much disk space do you need to install windows 3.1/95/98 and then on top of that the RAM you would need to drive it...

Some of you expect far too much from what should in theory be a general use business device, if you want graphics and other nice apps buy a laptop, if I want to watch movies whilst on the move I use my PSP, if I want to do large emails I use my laptops, for general short work related work I use the TyTn.

[Fallen Spartan]

Nobody has as yet mentioned the limited amount of internal storage these devices have on board, how much disk space do you need to install windows 3.1/95/98 and then on top of that the RAM you would need to drive it...

Some of you expect far too much from what should in theory be a general use business device, if you want graphics and other nice apps buy a laptop, if I want to watch movies whilst on the move I use my PSP, if I want to do large emails I use my laptops, for general short work related work I use the TyTn.

Your forgetting that generally speaking everyone wants everything on the one device!!

We are getting closer to this, but its still a long way off, and you'll never make everyone happy no matter what you do

[tonyb15re]

I have to say Android looks good, just had a quick look at the vids, not sure how long it will stay Open Source for and of course you need someone to build the base OS for the devices which will probably not be free.

[bigsteve]

$399----wow, that is a low estimate. if the tytn i is still going for 400 i think the the x1 will be around 800-1000 when it first comes out.

A few UK site a taking Pre-orders for around £500.00

[mmick]

Though WM is more powerfull than Symbian, I currently own a

- HTC TYTN (WM 6.0 Schaps + 400MHz Samsung + almost nothing running and default phone/OS apps)

- Nokia N82 (S60 v3 + 333MHz)

My N82 is FAR faster than my TYTN! Despite N82´s slower CPU and not being a PDA, it´s fast on everything but emulators!

WM is just slow! Horribly SLOW! Even on TELEPHONE tasks (like showing people calls, SMS, etc) TYTN takes lots of time doing everything even after a fresh OS installation.

WM independently of the CPU/RAM/Programs loaded *is* slow! My N82 pure and simple is smooth on everything TYTN should be!

- N82 is faster on web browsing (a lot faster!)
- N82 is faster on flash youtube videos (fluid vs. very choppy )
- N82 is faster on wifi transfers (both at 1m of the router)
- N82 is faster on menus (a lot faster!)
- N82 is A LOT faster on phone commands (showing caller, SMS, etc)
- N82 is faster opening high resolution pictures
- N82 is faster opening office documents, including PDF/Powerpoint
- N82 records VGA 30fps video + TV-OUT + 5MP pictures
- N82 refreshes the main screen very quickly. WM devices seem to take 2-3x more time to update the screen
- N82 has a standby screen (that screen that "screensaves" with a clock + date). WM devices turn off the screen to save battery
- WM 6 has a *VERY* ugly GUI. WM icons/fonts are so ridiculous ugly and old that a 2007-2008 PDA reminds me Windows 3.11 GUI!!!

the question is: WTF is Micro$oft doing?!?! How can a "smartphone" be fast *on everything* a PDA does and on 2008 WM still remembers Windows 3.11???

If a "SE X1"-like PDA comes + S60 v3 + touchscreen I´ll never comeback to WM.

[chunkymonkey]

I'm the first to have a pop at MS when it's warranted - and it oh so often has been since I went from my Amiga to a PC.

However, Windows Mobile, whilst an annoying bugger in a number of ways (hardware aside - nowt to do with them as Lordsmiff points out) is remarkably useful in certain that ways that no other OS is that I've tried is, most particularly in how 'open' it is.

Windows Mobile seems always to have been designed initially by marketing people and then handed over to (no doubt hard-working, underpaid and talented) programmers to realise. But it's drawbacks are also it's benefits, in that it's so 'loosely' designed that even I can get my head around increasingly-detailed and complex parts of how it works and how I might, and indeed do, modify it at low-enough levels to surprise even me.

Other mobile device OSes are, in my experience, much harder to monkey with (no pun intended) beyond installing software. They're not designed to be modified by me of course so that's no criticism of other OSes. Windows Mobile also isn't designed to be modified by me, and yet I, an admittedly dozy tit, can do a lot with it.

[chymmylt]

Where you hear that?

http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/10/no-wonder-sony-ericssons-xperia-x1-is-so-good-htc-makes-it/

[Lordsmiff]

Though WM is more powerfull than Symbian, I currently own a

- HTC TYTN (WM 6.0 Schaps + 400MHz Samsung + almost nothing running and default phone/OS apps)

- Nokia N82 (S60 v3 + 333MHz)

My N82 is FAR faster than my TYTN! Despite N82´s slower CPU and not being a PDA, it´s fast on everything but emulators!

WM is just slow! Horribly SLOW! Even on TELEPHONE tasks (like showing people calls, SMS, etc) TYTN takes lots of time doing everything even after a fresh OS installation.

<snip>

If a "SE X1"-like PDA comes + S60 v3 + touchscreen I´ll never comeback to WM.

I'm not quite sure what the little equation means at the end of your rant but you've answered your own question...

My N82 pure and simple is...That's exactly the point - your N82 is nowhere near as capable as a TyTN or most other PDAs. Aside from the fact that your conclusions are somewhat skewed, the operating system on it has a specific function with some other bits bolted on whereas the WM devices are from the ground up designed to have lots of software installed and work more like a mobile computer.

It would be better to compare the N82 to an ipaq 514 or some other WM smartphone device rather than a tytn where the limitations of both are similar.

The N82 is a phone with some PDA functions bolted on whereas the tytn and it's ilk are PDAs with some phone functions bolted on.

I liek and loathe both Symbian and Wm in equal measure so you take your pick as to what you prefer but spare us the rant (especially on a forum of fans of this particular format).

Though WM is more powerful than Symbianit's like shooting fish...

[noivaj]

Ya'll can look at it any which way ya'll like. the bottom line is windows mobile performs really shabby. And balmmer like an ass doesn't really seem that he intends to take the google's android seriously. They didn't take the Iphone seriously..

"what a smartphone without a keyboard.. that cant be a business device, and for 600 dollars" eyah thats what balmer was sayin.. however look at the sales. the iphone is doing ridiculously well in sales right now. oh and with the sdk they jsut released things are gonna get way more interesting.

I'm not an apple or google fan boy I am a htc tytn/hermes owner. I just really wish they'ld do thinks properly and cut the sloppy / bloated coding.

[sacwoo]

$399----wow, that is a low estimate. if the tytn i is still going for 400 i think the the x1 will be around 800-1000 when it first comes out.

Not retail but with a contract. I cannot spend over $400 on a phone and be tied down with a 2 year contract.

[tonyb15re]

Ya'll can look at it any which way ya'll like. the bottom line is windows mobile performs really shabby. And balmmer like an ass doesn't really seem that he intends to take the google's android seriously. They didn't take the Iphone seriously..

"what a smartphone without a keyboard.. that cant be a business device, and for 600 dollars" eyah thats what balmer was sayin.. however look at the sales. the iphone is doing ridiculously well in sales right now. oh and with the sdk they jsut released things are gonna get way more interesting.

I'm not an apple or google fan boy I am a htc tytn/hermes owner. I just really wish they'ld do thinks properly and cut the sloppy / bloated coding.

If you're getting that stressed about it why not join in on the Linux Coding discussion... Theres a thread somewhere on the Forum..

[Vision77]

Honestly I think WM7 will probably be the mobile OS that makes or breaks Microsoft...but even then Windows Mobile will be far from dead for the simple fact that its so hackable. Android has a lot of potential but I will save my official judgment for when a Android device is actually released. You also have to give your props to apple for making everyone step their game up.

[zim2dive]

The resolution is nothing to do with the OS. WM5 could support at least VGA and more than that I think.

Why did I have to run the oxvga hack then? (on my Dell x50v VGA WM5 device)?

WM5 would light up all the pixels yes, but made NO use of the extra pixels (without the hack).. instead it just took one pixel of QVGA and made it a block of 4 pixels on VGA. ie. there was 0 resolution improvement without using hack software. That is not "support", at least not in my book.

We'd see many more VGA devices if it were truly supported.

[mmick]

I'm not quite sure what the little equation means at the end of your rant but you've answered your own question...
...your N82 is nowhere near as capable as a TyTN or most other PDAs. Aside from the fact that your conclusions are somewhat skewed
[...] The N82 is a phone with some PDA functions bolted on whereas the tytn and it's ilk are PDAs with some phone functions bolted on.


You have a very biased vision and some of your comments show how little you know about other technologies/OS. N82 *is* more capable then a TyTN in every single way, just lacks touchscreen and built-in qwerty keyboard (as several PDAs).

I could discuss all day long about N82 vs. TyTN but you probably know nothing about N82 capabilities. So I´ll simplify to you about that present S60 and phones like N82 (333MHz + 128Mb RAM + Wifi) can do:
- read/edit/create Office 2007 documents or PDF
- full web browsing with flash (and in a few weeks with flash3 for youtube)
- FTP, network servey, network folders, multimedia server
- photography/video editing
- full POP3/... mail download/read
- 2D/3D games far more advanced than WM without 3D chip (95% of all PDAs)
- advanced PIM
- full PC sync and far easier sync!
- 16 Million color LCD + PAL/NTSC TV-OUT support
- you can add whatever software you want until your microSD card is full (GPS, Office, PIM, games, web browsing, etc etc)

and does all this and more far smoother/faster than my TyTN.

Now...unless a touchscreen determines if a device is a micro-PC or not, I don´t understand your (biased) point!

[!Kernel Panic!]

Video Demo of Android. (http://www.phonemag.com/htc-dream-phone-031838.php)

:D

[noivaj]

Honestly I think WM7 will probably be the mobile OS that makes or breaks Microsoft...but even then Windows Mobile will be far from dead for the simple fact that its so hackable. Android has a lot of potential but I will save my official judgment for when a Android device is actually released. You also have to give your props to apple for making everyone step their game up.

Co-signed. apple definitely did some wizardry to the industry. and i thank them for that. apple is truely a innovator take alook at a few of the new handsets touching the market form reputable hardware vendors and handset providers as well. What do they look like?

samsungs i900 - iphone clone
htc p3479 - very iphonesque
samsung f480 - iphoneesque

[tonyb15re]

apple definitely did some wizardry to the industry.

Yeh they screwed up iTunes so that a huge amount of IPOD users thought their devices were knackered and paid through their noses for replacements/repairs that were not necessary.. good stuff NOT

[vn1977]

Why is this in the Hermes Mobile 6 part of the forum? Could you please restart or move this topic to the general XDA where it belongs?

I'm sick of getting notifications about crap like this when I want to know when there are updates to ROMs.

[leo-chan]

Why is this in the Hermes Mobile 6 part of the forum? Could you please restart or move this topic to the general XDA where it belongs?

I'm sick of getting notifications about crap like this when I want to know when there are updates to ROMs.
absolutely agree with you...

[kaalgoosy]

when i say wm is dead, i mean the next gen os's like android will make our current wm versions look like black and white television. the fact that google has tossed in their hat with the iphone sdk developers shows they're ready for something we're all ready for; a serious wm upgrade!!

[kaalgoosy]

i understand how content most of us are with our wm devices, we have the most flexible devices around; i'm just thinking about the future. come on now; who wouldn't like android running on our hermes?

[froos]

See its specification, if the price is as rumors around 700$ the Xperia X1 will be a killer of all other WM devices. I wonder why HTC doesn´t have any revolution model up coming. I prefer the high resolution display and small smart design.

As I understand it, HTC is the one building this device in license for Sony-Ericsson. If that is the case, they will have a pretty good clue what makes it tick :)

[Lordsmiff]

You have a very biased vision and some of your comments show how little you know about other technologies/OS. N82 *is* more capable then a TyTN in every single way, just lacks touchscreen and built-in qwerty keyboard (as several PDAs).

I could discuss all day long about N82 vs. TyTN but you probably know nothing about N82 capabilities. So I´ll simplify to you about that present S60 and phones like N82 (333MHz + 128Mb RAM + Wifi) can do:
- read/edit/create Office 2007 documents or PDF
- full web browsing with flash (and in a few weeks with flash3 for youtube)
- FTP, network servey, network folders, multimedia server
- photography/video editing
- full POP3/... mail download/read
- 2D/3D games far more advanced than WM without 3D chip (95% of all PDAs)
- advanced PIM
- full PC sync and far easier sync!
- 16 Million color LCD + PAL/NTSC TV-OUT support
- you can add whatever software you want until your microSD card is full (GPS, Office, PIM, games, web browsing, etc etc)

and does all this and more far smoother/faster than my TyTN.

Now...unless a touchscreen determines if a device is a micro-PC or not, I don´t understand your (biased) point!


You are absolutely right - I know nothing about phones\technology\operating systems and I bow to your obviously superior knowledge in this area. Your well thought our argument (I particularly liked your 'advanced PIM' point) has convinced me to sell anything I own that has a plug.

Smiffy.

[kaalgoosy]

all you guys know these new os's that are already up and running on beta phones won't be released until us the consumers are fed up with feeding off of table scraps of these giant corps. schillings, let's bring on the next gen already!!!

[Roobuls]

The thing that I think is wrong with WM is that microsoft make it look very much like their desktop operatiing systems (eg. Win XP).
Same file explorer, same Microsoft Outlook features, same Windows directory structure and sub-directories like "Fonts", "Start Menu", "Profiles", "System", etc.
So many similarities it's not funny. It's like and Elephant trying to act like a Mouse!

I think it's all B#ll Sh#t. Make it a full on mobile (hand-held) operating system. Not a copy of Windows XP.
Then people might start to be happy with it.

Let's face it, if you want a mouse in the palm of your hand you don't want an elephant.

[kaalgoosy]

with all its faults, the Iphone is at least trying to deliver a laptop experience. I got a feeling wm is gonna get a huge push in the ass for the future much quicker than they wanted to and are forced to stop milking this antiquated os!

[surur]

The thing that I think is wrong with WM is that microsoft make it look very much like their desktop operatiing systems (eg. Win XP).
Same file explorer, same Microsoft Outlook features, same Windows directory structure and sub-directories like "Fonts", "Start Menu", "Profiles", "System", etc.
So many similarities it's not funny.

Actually thats why I like it. Want to add a font to WM? Just copy a TTF to your font directory. Try doing the same in PalmOS.

There are other countless examples. OSX Mobile just hides its OSX base a lot more than WM, and adds sucky restrictions like no multi-tasking for 3rd party apps.

Surur

[Roobuls]

The thing that I think is wrong with WM is that microsoft make it look very much like their desktop operatiing systems (eg. Win XP).
Same file explorer, same Microsoft Outlook features, same Windows directory structure and sub-directories like "Fonts", "Start Menu", "Profiles", "System", etc.
So many similarities it's not funny. It's like an Elephant trying to act like a Mouse!

I think it's all B#ll Sh#t. Make it a full on mobile (hand-held) operating system. Not a copy of Windows XP.
Then people might start to be happy with it.

Let's face it, if you want a mouse in the palm of your hand you don't want an elephant.

So tell me then, why does it have a "Profiles" sub-directory. Can you actually do anything with it?
It's a bit like a dad giving a toy truck to his son and trying to tell him it's just like the real thing !!!

Bit of a joke don't you think...

[Lordsmiff]

The thing about WM trying to look like big windows is exactly the reason it is the way it is.

First off, look at the skins for Wizbar\WAD etc - the most popular ones are ones that make it look and act like vista or XP.

The other thing is, you have to remember the audience that these devices are really aimed at - corporate clowns who sit behind a desk all day and make pivot tables in excel. The WinMo experience is designed to have continuity from the desktop to the phone \ mobile computer \ mobile office.

I work as a senior consultant for the largest IT company in the world and believe me, most of the people who have phones like this don't even install any third party games, they wouldn't know what a profile is and they certainly don't use file explorers for anything more than looking in their my documents folder for that picture of their kids that their wife sent to them by MMS so they can use it for wallpaper.

The people on here are in the minority as far as the people who use these go. Granted, it's an increasing audience and will only carry on doing so and there again, MS have an advantage with devices like these precisely because they look and work the same as their desktops.

People like the familiar - change is never an easy sell - just look at vista...and xp before it...and windows 95...3.1...dos...

Having said that, I think the coolest interface is the iPhone's and if the hardware were better, I'd dump my hermes in an instant...though I might be harder pressed to get rid of my universal :)

Smiffy.

[Macgyvec3]

If HTC doesn't release a driver for my Kaiser, I'm never buying another HTC. That Sony looks nice as much as I hate Sony. But they haven't screwed me over as bad as HTC.

[FCW]

I think wm is great. started to get a little bored with it till i started cooking roms tho. now my mission is to maake the perfect rom to show off knowing that i made it

[truffle1234]

just returned my iphone, its like a pretty blonde; hot on the outside but nothing on the inside. i think wm is pretty much dead though; android will usher in a new era. i think we should just dismiss the last gen roms and look forward. Its obvious from apple releasing sdks for their tight ass phone that android has a little more than something up their sleeve; cant wait to see what htc devices deliver


I think there is no shortage of people like you in this world.... you are the kind who is never satisfied with the best available and always talk about things which are not out yet...

can I ask you one thing... WHAT DO YOU WANT IN A PHONE?????

I can bet my ass you don’t have a clue at all... So I will not waste my effort on you any more...

[kaalgoosy]

how many apps does wm phones offer around the net free? And how many apps are out for the iphone right now? (and get ready to pay cash money for apps that we had on our old razrs). apples iphone is just another medium to sell their products. yea, it's a real pretty device; but what can it really do? a cheap version of google maps? check out anything apple, from their browser, to their itunes; they're not really about innovation, they're about sell sell sell. and if your content with current os's, stay there; we'll evolve without you

[kaalgoosy]

Do you remember the "best available" internet connection back in the early 80's? Or the "best available tv's before HD? The model T ford was also the "best available" motor car before the vw was spawned. Bows and arrows were also the "best available" before gunpowder