IPhone release claim

[jayjay8585]

the new iphone 3g is here. i think im right in saying we all now it

but in the advert it claims to be the first phone to beat the iphone

forgive me if im wrong but doesnt the kaiser still out perform the new iphone

nb. there isnt really a purpose to this thread it just marks as a discussion thread for those who want to compare

[kilrah]

It's all about personal preference and what the users expect from their devices. Some will find one superior, some will prefer the other. Not much more to say, the rest is just marketing crap...

[jayjay8585]

fair nuff. but im sure the iphobne doesnt have a second camera for vid confrencing call

[SH4YD33]

3g iphone is nice. But, i will be getting a touchpro.

[jayjay8585]

i think my kaiser will do for know. its does what everyone elses does and more coz of 3rd party stuff

[kilrah]

im sure the iphobne doesnt have a second camera for vid confrencing call

It doesn't. But even if I've had video call cameras on my phones for 2 years now I think I've used it maybe twice to give it a try at the beginning, same for my friends... so I'd say apple took a good decision not to add one and increase costs for a small percentage of people who actually use it.

iphone does have 3rd party stuff too. With the first one it was unofficial only, now it's official as well.

[jayjay8585]

i bet you that the winmob 3rd party stuff can do a lot more than the iphons

[kilrah]

Certainly. But still, the appstore claims having more than 500 apps for the iphone now at launch time. Already quite a bit, and the offer can only grow more. Of course WM has years of advance.

I still prefer WM for the "geek-friendly" hacks. Doubt we'll find some WMWifiRouter likes on the iphone soon.

[GWelker62]

To use the phrase "out perform" can be misleading. Can we just list what the iPhoney does, that the Kaiser cannot, and vise versa? If one does something "better" than the other, that doesn't count, because "better" can be subjective.

Can the new iPhoney tether, MMS, copy/paste, take movies, Open/Edit Office docs, open RAR/ZIP files, Off line maps&GPS, double as a card reader, and the MOST important to me can you run thousands of third party apps?

Now what can the iPhoney do the Kaiser cannot?

[nighty]

Now what can the iPhoney do the Kaiser cannot?

nothing!!!!

its a new apple toy and thats it!


i love my htc devices... this are the perfect toys for big boys *rofl*

[richabi]

I really don't like apple at all. Their marketing/advertising team brain washes people to believe their products are far superior. its genius but they are just a buncha crooks IMO; You pay extra for the brand now. Don't get me wrong, they make fair products, but like what HTC did to us with the whole 3d driver deal, apple does that every day with all their products b/c they are clever enough to lace pop culture, hipster, fads, style, cliches, ect into their prods so people want to buy them to "fit in" or "complete" themselves. Then they have all the lil accessories to add onto it like its a freaking lego world. I used to paintball a lot and the gun makers would do the same with their "low end/cheap guns that perform like high end/expensive guns." They make a decent gun that will shoot but there are sooo many upgrades and customizations you can do to the gat that its like a hobby of building model cars or something. u keep adding to your collection and sooner or later you spend the same amount on the low end gun than you would have on an expensive one.

3g iphone should have been the very first iphone they launced. its propaganda. they planned it all for profit. now i heard the iphone2 will be something worth spending money on. but then again, it probably wont be 3g so they can release another one a year later to take more of people's money haha

[pazookie]

people talking about the iphone doing video caling..it cant even record video! it cant copy and paste..it cant recieve mms natively..it cant do ALOT that it SHOULD lol

[jayjay8585]

i think they rushed the 3g version

i read somwhere steve jobs didnt want to do a 3g iphone as 3g wasnt that popular (what????), and then lo and behold less than a year later iphone 3g is announced with serious cutbacks

[mikeeey]

god i really hate it when they say things that make it sound like the iphone is NEW TECHNOLOGY or better than anything else. it just sounds like a bunch of kids who dont know anything about technology, but there are supposed to be business people that come up with this stuff?

I'm gonna say anything and everything is better than the iphone, because it has NO BUTTONS. (dont even bother say "but there's a back button!")

youve probably seen all the different things it can run, it's speed, but without buttons it's basicly worthless. why would you wanna play quake 3 on the iphone if there is no way to play?

i just really hate the way they market the iphone, why does apple have to make such a big deal out of their products? i would much rather everytime a phone came out they claimed it was the best phone. either i would like it if NO PHONES were commercialized at all, or ALL OF THEM were commercialized like the iphone. and that is another thing i hate, i hate comparing things to the iphone, as if it is the almighty. why is it all about comparing to the iphone now? why cant you compare it to...the X51v lol. but serious, i hate it!!

[GWelker62]

nothing!!!!

its a new apple toy and thats it!


i love my htc devices... this are the perfect toys for big boys *rofl*

Oh, there is one thing the iPhoney does and the Kaiser cannot. That is multi touch screen. So zooming in/out is really slick. I have to admit that is one nice feature, but I'm not converting just for that. ;)

[zoltexuk]

Possibly a Youtube section should be put up as a challenge to the Iphone...

[jahrami]

the new iphone has 3g but data no vid calls :confused:
what kind of 3g is this a 2.9g??

[kilrah]

the new iphone has 3g but data no vid calls :confused:
what kind of 3g is this a 2.9g??

As far as I know the 3G iphone HAS video call, but as there's no front camera it's either you watch the other one on the screen while he sees the landscape behind or he sees you while the screen is facing away from you...
The AT&T Tilt has no front cam either...

Video call is a feature of 3G thanks to the increased network speeds, but the only important part of a 3G phone is to be able to connect to and communicate with a so-called "3G" UMTS WCDMA network...

[jahrami]

to my knowledge
at&t tilt is made for US region where there is no 3G networks? so this maybe why tilt has no front cam?

i rather use a dual cam for vid calls than flipping the phones over and over :confused:

As far as I know the 3G iphone HAS video call, but as there's no front camera it's either you watch the other one on the screen while he sees the landscape behind or he sees you while the screen is facing away from you...
The AT&T Tilt has no front cam either...

Video call is a feature of 3G thanks to the increased network speeds, but the only important part of a 3G phone is to be able to connect to and communicate with a so-called "3G" UMTS WCDMA network...

[kilrah]

to my knowledge
at&t tilt is made for US region where there is no 3G networks?
The Tilt also has 3G, and there are 3G networks in the US... just read a bit on here of all the Americans talking of it ;)

[jahrami]

respect bro :) you added to my knowledge
but i still think kaiser better
The Tilt also has 3G, and there are 3G networks in the US... just read a bit on here of all the Americans talking of it ;)

[GWelker62]

I hadn't seen it mentioned, does the new iPhoney have a owner replacable battery?

[amkaos]

I hadn't seen it mentioned, does the new iPhoney have a owner replacable battery?
if it did, you wouldda heard about it..
it exactly doesnt

[moegdaog]

um...that app store may claim 500 avaiable apps but are they 3rd party apps or apps that appple has made for this phone from their computer apps....and I srongly doubt it is 500 apps...prolly 100. Compare that to like a million dedicated WM software and apps.

And you have to pay for those right lol...apple store? right

Personally I think its just a pretty lil toy and mainstream phone that finally introduced the rest of the public to touchscreen phones...I remember watching news clips about the iphone when it first came out and they were talking about the iphone and I quote " the first touchscreen " phone...ridiculous...I been using touchscren phones since the treo 600.

[blueridgeflyer]

I have had the 2nd Gen iphone for a couple of days now and have the following observations:

Multi Touch is very nice. Battery life is attrocious as one would expect, so I switch to GSM mode when Im not browsing or using bandwith intensive apps. Itunes store doesnt work on the att network, only wifi (no biggie since i dont plan on using it). Exchange works beautifully however there is no support for tasks. Browsing with Safari is the single best thing about the device, a true joy to use. Very limited on types of supported media. Very intuitive and robust OS fuctionality....not one damn reset of any kind. That saves me time and frustration. No hardware keyboard kind of sucked in the beginning, but i quickly got up to qwerty efficiencies within a day. No A2DP support is very disappointing, but the "genius" in the Apple store didnt seem to know what that was, so therefore I guess we all dont need it. No MS office support (at least natively). God I cant wait until Coreplayer is realesed, because the OS doesnt support popular video formats.

Orb is a saving grace. I can paste my favorite windows media streams into the Audio subsection of ORB and it converts the extentions to mp3 streams which can be played through QT player. All of my favorite XM channels work as well. No native "cut and paste" although there is a poor mans version out there that seems to work.

Ive been with HTC since the Magician, and I intend to stay with the iPhone for now. I am certainly no fan of Apple, but this device does so many of the basic everyday things so well to go back to WM6.X . Hopefully the version 2.0 OS will be jailbroken soon to open up the possibility of 3rd party apps, sim unlocking, tethering etc.

[mistabeo]

the only real improvement is that the new iphone is 3g... yet they're making such a big deal. and the conumsers are following in suit. kinda dumb to me.

[Crazysamz]

Yea I decided to get rid of my slow and bulky tilt for the iphone 3g... I got it on release date in the 16GB model, and so far it's great. I've never been a fan of apple products, including the ipod (which I so dearly HAT! GO ZUNE!), but anyways, yeah, I think they have a good product that is easy to use, I can't wait to see how WM7 is going to be to compete with OSX mobile. (BTW, I've never even owned an Apple product before, I used to despise them (that's the MS fanboy inside of me), but now that I have my iphone, they don't seem so bad.

[landwomble]

the only real improvement is that the new iphone is 3g... yet they're making such a big deal. and the conumsers are following in suit. kinda dumb to me.

faster, with GPS. i've used WM for years as the office sync's so good, but the iphone now has exchange / blackberry support.
the paper specs are one thing, but my WM devices make me want to stamp them into the ground at least a couple of times a week: the iphone has less features, but those it does have are much more polished.

i suggest everyone at least *tries* one before commenting...

[kilrah]

um...that app store may claim 500 avaiable apps but are they 3rd party apps or apps that appple has made for this phone from their computer apps....and I srongly doubt it is 500 apps...prolly 100. And you have to pay for those right lol...apple store? right

Don't you think if they were claiming 500 and as people arrived on there and saw a few things here and there they wouldn't complain?
There are both apple and 3rd party apps, utilities, games,... some of which are free as well.

[prealphageek]

Can the new iPhoney tether, MMS, copy/paste, take movies, Open/Edit Office docs, open RAR/ZIP files, Off line maps&GPS, double as a card reader, and the MOST important to me can you run thousands of third party apps?

Let's not forget user un-replaceable battery...

[findus]

Yea I decided to get rid of my slow and bulky tilt for the iphone 3g... I got it on release date in the 16GB model, and so far it's great. I've never been a fan of apple products, including the ipod (which I so dearly HAT! GO ZUNE!), but anyways, yeah, I think they have a good product that is easy to use, I can't wait to see how WM7 is going to be to compete with OSX mobile. (BTW, I've never even owned an Apple product before, I used to despise them (that's the MS fanboy inside of me), but now that I have my iphone, they don't seem so bad.

Lol got my iphone friday too, have had WM devices for so long (with a brief Symbian affair a couple of years ago) and I still hate Apple as much as I hate Microsoft, but you can't deny the new iphone is a reliable piece of kit. It annoys me that it can't copy/paste or MMS (I've never used video calling) but I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over it. It doesn't surprise me that most people are bashing the iphone without trying it - this is the XDA forum after all, although it's a shame that people get so militant and narrow minded about these things (it's a phone, not a religion!)

In short, I am really happy with my new iphone, but am sad that I won't have a reason to check this forum any more (it's been four years!) Keep up the good work folks!

Fin

[greenbrd]

Yay. Yet another "let's all piss on the iPhone" thread.

Do you realize how insecure you sound about your choice of phone?

"Hi fellow Kaiser owners, we sure are smarter than iPhone owners, aren't we?"

"We sure are, fellow Kaiser owner."

Seriously.

[spzero]

Oh, there is one thing the iPhoney does and the Kaiser cannot. That is multi touch screen. So zooming in/out is really slick. I have to admit that is one nice feature, but I'm not converting just for that. ;)

Yeah but opera 9.5 now has zoom which is just fine why else do you need zoom etc

[naplesbill]

My two cents....

I have used BB, WM and several other types of phones over the years. I think BB wins for simplicity, WM for expandability and the other regular type phones generally win in battery performance. The iPhone kind of bridges the gap between a Smartphone and a normal phone that has media capability.

I would not consider an iPhone for my only phone for several reasons.

First of all, I will not support any device that is closed. I should be able to install programs or add storage without restriction(within reason people). The iPhone is another example of Apples idea of forcing you to come back to them for any repair or replacement. Of course you can get around this but the average person will not do it. In this day and age open standards and open source are the preferred options. I'm not saying that WM is open source so lets not go there. The point is that with ALL the other phones I have had I can replace the battery in 2.3 seconds and since the advent of transflash I can add my own storage. Why would I want to go back to being restricted to what the phone comes with.

Second of all, I prefer a few hard buttons on my phone. I am not keen on always have to use the screen to perform every function.

Last and most importantly, I will not buy any phone that requires a proprietary connector for data. This is what turns me off on the BJ1 and BJ2. It is ridiculous to force this on the end user. USB standards are quite robust and easy to follow.

Before anyone tells me I should try one before making these comments, I have messed around with one of my techs gen1 and on Friday I spent a couple hours messing with his brand new gen2 iPhone. I will admit it has a great screen and great browsing experience. For me it fails as a media player because it doesn't have enough storage. I have 40gb of music and I do not want to have to pick and choose what I have available for listening. The fact that you can't add additional storage further demonstrates the devices shortcomings in this regard.

Yes I do have an iPod because it's the only device that offers full integration with my car stereo. Of course the newer Classic, iTouch and iPhone devices don't work because Apple decided to require an IC chip in order to connect through an external device. So, my 60gb iPod will be my last iPod purchase.

I also owned a MacBook Pro for a couple months but I sold it for many of the same reasons. I have absolutely no use for Apple or their products. They have shown their true intentions as of late and it's a complete turn-off for me.

[mriebeling]

I have a Tilt, this is my 5th WM device.
My wife has an iphone, just updated to 2.0.

I like my Tilt better, but the thing I am jealous over my wife's Iphone is that it works smoothly everytime.

I have thought of selling my Tilt and moving to a 3g iphone, but not ready to give up on it yet, I do like all of the software.

I still prefer WM, I wish it worked as smoothly as the Iphone, but that is what MS seems to do, release beta software and call it final.

No need to bash iphone, for us geeks WM is probably better, for people like my wife iphone is great.

[beret9987]

I like both devices as well. Web Surfing and multimedia tasks are far superior to our Kaisers but I personally can't stand the keyboard though. A slide-out iPhone would have my money.

[moegdaog]

Lol got my iphone friday too, have had WM devices for so long (with a brief Symbian affair a couple of years ago) and I still hate Apple as much as I hate Microsoft, but you can't deny the new iphone is a reliable piece of kit. It annoys me that it can't copy/paste or MMS (I've never used video calling) but I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over it. It doesn't surprise me that most people are bashing the iphone without trying it - this is the XDA forum after all, although it's a shame that people get so militant and narrow minded about these things (it's a phone, not a religion!)

In short, I am really happy with my new iphone, but am sad that I won't have a reason to check this forum any more (it's been four years!) Keep up the good work folks!

Fin

O dont worry...once the SE Xperia 1 come out and the touch pro..you'll be back LOL, youll prolly be one of the thousands of dedicated WM users who will regret their purchase once you really see how much depth youve lost in your phone experience from switching from wm to the iphone...yea the safari experience willl wow you but the simple fact of functionality will draw you back, especially with these two high end phones coming out along with the coming of WM7...the perfect OS which will blow the iphones osx out the water. You wont be able to comprehend the power of what WM7 is going to bring to the table and with all htc phones shipping with touchflo 3D now, the touching experience of WM devices and iphone wont be a differece anymore, both devices touch finger gesturing are flawless. Once you realize that youve just bought a pretty little phone that just looks good and has no debt, its like putting lipstick on a pig...believe it except the web browser safari, which i cant argue shit about, apple just set the bar higher with mobile phone browsers, and believe u me microsoft will respond to the browser effieciently..and if they dont, Opera or Skyfire will (you all know skyfire is the first browser with flash embeded..something safari wont come close too).. so, you'll still be back to WM one way or another..watch!, and just as Apple disapppointed with all its flaws and upgrade glitches this weekend with bricking everyones phones all weekend..even though they KNEW that the error was going to happen and still let the release date continue is the first of many disappointments apple will surely promise on and lose costumers with. Get real guys....you think Bill gates and the new fresh faces and new CEO's in the higher crust of microsoft are just going to sit around and not counter act tbe iphone? come on now...they've dominated the PPC/PDA market for years and now with the emergence of a competitor like the iphone..there actually gonna start "trying" now lol, with their OS's...believe that. The answer to the iphone will be a completely revamping the windows mobile OS..with HTC and other WM device makers making their phones just as amazing as the new OS's...so
see you in the fall for the Xperia and touch pro..and hopefull see you again in early 2009 for Windows Mobile 7.

P.S Theres a reason the Tilt/kaiser is 499.99 at ATT and the iphone is 299....the tilt came out fall of last year...it was the fist WM6 device that ran on 3g speeds and with built in GPS, Wifi and bluetooth..all the rescources needed in a WM phone..while the iphone 1.0 was just eye candy and came with edge LOL..and now the iphone 2.0 can try and actually compete with the tilt on a grander scale but it needed to "UPGRADE" to a whole new device to have built in GPS and 3G, and another useless hype and long lines for a phone that was bricked for the first 3 days to begin with...you'll never see that happen with a WM device because the only thing you need to upgrade is your OS...and that will not brick your phone to upgrade OS's the way it did and has for apple. Hell on some forums and blog tech sites i was on like Cnet and zdnet..because apple and att allowed the selling of the 3G iphone knowing that their costumers would brick once the user docked or upgraded too the new firmware, some people actually returned the phone, said to hell with it and went back to their blacberries and posted their comments about it immediately Lol..geewiz....well lets see what the future holds for Microsoft and WM...and lets see what the future holds for queer apple fanboys like cris pirrillo who bashed the iphone when it first came out and gave a top 20 reasons why he wasnt getin one and then a month later said he got the iphone 1.0 as a "present" and now thinks the iphone is the holy grail of mobile devices even though he was a dedicated WM user (chris pirillo is a techy geek bloger and techy tv host)...and whener he gets a caller that says to him a million reasons why WM devices edge out on the iphone not only in features but pure strength he turns it around and says "o just wait till the SDK comes out and the iphone will be flawless and perfect"...its like 1) pirillo the iphone doesnt have a2dp support for bluetooth or bluetooth syncing period..pirillo:
" o wait till the SDK" 2) but dood the iphone doesnt even have copy and paste, pirillo: " o wait till the SDK" 3) but dood the iphone cant sync to exchange which is critical to business users, pirillo: " o wait till the SDK" 4) but dood the iphone barely has any if any 3rd party apps pirillo: " o wait till the SDK"..

with that being said..the tilt is a very solid device and theirs very little u can complain about it when it comes to functionality. And other then the driver issue..performance and feature wise theirs no comparing it to the iphone, the tlt just takes the cake. Look at how many tweaks and apps there are out their for it, not to mention the built in GPS and other resources...its basically a mini labtop.

I mean its ridiculous I could go on forever but im tired..so later..hate on me if u want..but it is true.

[Boinng]

I've spent the last week or so seriously considering the Iphone - there's no doubt that what it does, it does exceptionally well. But you know what? It's not ready yet.

I can forgive the frippery like missing picture messaging, but how can you promise full Exchange sync support, without having a Task or To-do list? I live by Tasks set in Outlook or on my kaiser, that failing alone is enough to drive me away. Then there's copy and paste, or rather none of it (I'm going to sign up to an expensive 18 month contract so I can copy numbers in messages onto a bit of paper before retyping them into my contacts? I don't think so).

The Iphone has GPS - great - but days after its release and the opening of the App Store, we're still getting conflicting messages on whether software like TomTom will ever be available for it. I have TomTom on my Kaiser now, I'll have it immediately on any new WM handset I buy, am I going to wait and see if Apple deign to allow it on the Iphone? Forget that.

Document editing - at best it'll be an optional (and possibly expensive) upgrade for the Iphone, at worst it may be delayed or even not come at all because of limitations with the Iphone's file system, we're now hearing from Apple themselves. So this advanced OS of their's again, where is it?

The inescapable conclusion is that the Iphone would be a significant downgrade to my nine month old Kaiser, let alone one of the many newer WM alternatives.

[webPragmatist]

O dont worry...once the SE Xperia 1 come out and the touch pro.. ... I mean its ridiculous I could go on forever but im tired..so later..hate on me if u want..but it is true.

:eek: May I quote the above (not sure who) "it's a phone not a religion". The fact is that this is Apples first attempt to create a mobile device, they aren't going to have everything working/developed right off the bat and really who cares which phone Chris Pirillo uses.

I hope that WM will at one point work as sleek and reliably as the iPhone as you are stating but I don't see it catching up at the rate Apple is going. I vote for Android on Kaiser :)

[rajmagi]

I have a Tilt, this is my 5th WM device.
My wife has an iphone, just updated to 2.0.

I like my Tilt better, but the thing I am jealous over my wife's Iphone is that it works smoothly everytime.

I have thought of selling my Tilt and moving to a 3g iphone, but not ready to give up on it yet, I do like all of the software.

I still prefer WM, I wish it worked as smoothly as the Iphone, but that is what MS seems to do, release beta software and call it final.

No need to bash iphone, for us geeks WM is probably better, for people like my wife iphone is great.

Im sorry, but what "but that is what MS seems to do, release beta software and call it final." means????
sorry just noob, so wm 6.1 official is beta??

[naplesbill]

:eek: May I quote the above (not sure who) "it's a phone not a religion". The fact is that this is Apples first attempt to create a mobile device, they aren't going to have everything working/developed right off the bat and really who cares which phone Chris Pirillo uses.

I hope that WM will at one point work as sleek and reliably as the iPhone as you are stating but I don't see it catching up at the rate Apple is going. I vote for Android on Kaiser :)

Actually this is their second attempt. So, they add 3g(which should have been in the first version) and GPS. The 3g is good but the GPS is not all that useful when you look at it's functionality(or lack thereof). IMO, as a smartphone it fails, as a media device it is ok(with several shortcomings) but as a web device it is successful. Hardly compelling enough for me to recommend one to anybody.

[Boinng]

I hope that WM will at one point work as sleek and reliably as the iPhone as you are stating but I don't see it catching up at the rate Apple is going. I vote for Android on Kaiser :)

A few weeks ago I might have agreed with that, but I'm not so sure now. It seems to me that while Apple may have the UI right, even that's incomplete (no copy & paste, an essential) and the cracks are starting to show elsewhere, too. Whisper it, but there are bugs being reported in Iphone OS 2.0, and in many of the new apps as well. Meanwhile, basic features like document editing, the aforementioned copy and paste, useful GPS apps and so much else are all still AWOL, with no clear idea of when or even if they'll appear.

All Windows Mobile needs to do, by contrast, is get pretty. If they can make the UI a little sexier, all the nuts and bolts underneath are already there. WM7 could be a real breakthrough.

[naplesbill]

Im sorry, but what "but that is what MS seems to do, release beta software and call it final." means????
sorry just noob, so wm 6.1 official is beta??

It is just sarcasm. Everyone thinks that whenever there is a bug in a Microsoft product, it's because it wasn't thoroughly tested so it's like a beta software. Of course, this is absolutely not true. One benefit of Apple's controlled approach to their products is they are controlling both the hardware and software. This makes it much easier to test and debug. Of course, this also limits you to one company and leads to higher costs for the products. Microsoft has to function on many different hardware configurations and that leads to problems that were not seen or debugged during development and testing.

I'll take a customizable system over a closed system any day of the week.

[findus]

Just to lighten things up a bit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLxq90xmYUs&feature=user

Will it blend?!

[JimmyMcGee]

Here's this for fun.

http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=a93c8e66-fec4-4f36-93e2-9f47ed05f2cf

When I first saw the Original Apple iPhone 2.0 Commercial. I laughed.

However, I get to play with at least 4. People at work are Buying them against my (the IT Departments) suggestion. But they'll need me to should them how to do things. Yay Me! :rolleyes:

[kilrah]

Here's this for fun.
http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?i=a93c8e66-fec4-4f36-93e2-9f47ed05f2cf


Awesome! :D

So, they add 3g(which should have been in the first version) and GPS. The 3g is good but the GPS is not all that useful when you look at it's functionality(or lack thereof).
The 3G isn't even that good anymore knowing that in many places with the number of iphones sold and people using them the networks can't cope, and speeds go down to match EDGE again... :rolleyes:

[mriebeling]

Im sorry, but what "but that is what MS seems to do, release beta software and call it final." means????
sorry just noob, so wm 6.1 official is beta??

In My opinion it SEEMS like beta software. A clean release of software, i don't mean just WM 6.1, does not have so many bugs. The official releases have tons of bugs. I have better stability with roms cooked on this site. Microsoft seems to do this often with OS's across all platforms.
Again my opinion.
I guess I shouldn't bash to much, without all of these problems microsoft helps to create I wouldn't have a job doing what I do.

[slovoflud]

To use the phrase "out perform" can be misleading. Can we just list what the iPhoney does, that the Kaiser cannot, and vise versa? If one does something "better" than the other, that doesn't count, because "better" can be subjective.

Can the new iPhoney tether, MMS, copy/paste, take movies, Open/Edit Office docs, open RAR/ZIP files, Off line maps&GPS, double as a card reader, and the MOST important to me can you run thousands of third party apps?

Now what can the iPhoney do the Kaiser cannot?

"If one does something "better" than the other, that doesn't count, because "better" can be subjective."
where is the logic in that? If it does something better, it counts. Simple. Your 10 year old nokia types SMS, right? still you prefer Querty.

To answer the original question - Yes. It does out perform Kaiser. It can even out perform the PSP. Kaiser with it's lack of you know what sucks balls.

However I agree that it's 100% personal preference.

FYI, i don't own an iPhone, I own a Kaiser.

[slovoflud]

I hadn't seen it mentioned, does the new iPhoney have a owner replacable battery?
How many times have you bought and replaced your battery? I never had a phone long enough for its battery to deplete to the point it needed to be replaced. Should be at least a couple of years right? Anyway, I know why you can change batteries in Kaiser. because they suck. :) 1 day! 2 max - are we in the early nineties?

OHH NOO!!!!! "BUGS" in an iPhone??? Noooo Waay! ... man, lucky us, WM doesn't have any!

[GWelker62]

If it does something better, it counts. Simple. .

You need to re-read my post. I was looking at making a list of what one does, that the other don't. So, if one phone does something better than the other, then it doesn't count for that kind of list. Simple?

[GWelker62]

How many times have you bought and replaced your battery? I never had a phone long enough for its battery to deplete to the point it needed to be replaced. Should be at least a couple of years right? Anyway, I know why you can change batteries in Kaiser. because they suck. :) 1 day! 2 max - are we in the early nineties?

OHH NOO!!!!! "BUGS" in an iPhone??? Noooo Waay! ... man, lucky us, WM doesn't have any!

Who pee'd in your Cheerios this morning?

[slovoflud]

Who pee'd in your Cheerios this morning?
:D

yeah... i know.. i'm kinda angry right now, and another 'iPhoney' thread is just what i needed to let the steam out :) :)

still - it's not a bad device. yes? :rolleyes:

[GWelker62]

still - it's not a bad device. yes? :rolleyes:

Not ever owning one, but have played with a few, my opinion is yes I think it's a nice phone. But for me, there are some features I need and want in a mobile phone, and the iPhoney can't meet them. Now for someone like my wife, who's need is half communication and half entertainment, the iPhone would be perfect for her. I may even buy one for her, but not having MMS may be a deal killer.
As for the replaceable battery question, there are situations I get in where having a spare charged up battery would come in handy. Like on a long flight watching movies, or in a long meeting and I forgot to bring a charger. It's nice knowing I have multiple ways of powering back up.

[kilrah]

Anyway, I know why you can change batteries in Kaiser. because they suck. :) 1 day! 2 max - are we in the early nineties?

The thing is, the one in the 3G iphone also seems to suck - but at least on the Kaiser you can change it ;)

I bought my Kaiser 2nd hand with 3 batteries and keep a spare one in my bag but have only needed it once or twice so far.

[GWelker62]

Oh, one other thing...

The iPhone is not what I dislike, it's the pompas ass owners of the phone I can't stand. They are so bought into the hype and think the iPhone is all that and a bag of chips. Bunch of fan boyz....

[slovoflud]

:)

I'll get on with my "Android waiting" thing then....

[Boinng]

The thing is, the Iphone can be a better browser, a better user experience, a better games machine, a better music and (much) better video player, but still it comes back to the nuts and bolts. With the "better" Iphone I still can't copy and paste from a note, I can't check or update my tasks on the move, I can't update a spreadsheet, I can't stick it in the car and use TomTom, I can't sync my work's Exchange calendar and contacts to my Outlook at home, I can't send a picture, I can't record a video (however poor quality)..

It comes down to a choice between doing some things better, and doing many things adequately. With the kaiser I can do everything an Iphone user can, although in many cases not quite as well, or at least easily. I'll take that over not being able to do many other things at all.

[slovoflud]

The thing is, the Iphone can be a better browser, a better user experience, a better games machine, a better music and (much) better video player, but still it comes back to the nuts and bolts. With the "better" Iphone I still can't copy and paste from a note, I can't check or update my tasks on the move, I can't update a spreadsheet, I can't stick it in the car and use TomTom, I can't sync my work's Exchange calendar and contacts to my Outlook at home, I can't send a picture, I can't record a video (however poor quality)..

all of this, looks like this: "The iPhone is not what I dislike, it's the pompas ass owners of the phone I can't stand." -GWelker62 . Only Vise versa.
I realy wouldn't stress too much on the Copy/Paste issue as the main iPhone problem. Because sooner or later it'll have that, and what are you gonna say then?
I'm really interested in what people are gonna say when next iPhone arrives, and it will have HSPDA, copy/paste, mms, and full sync computability. These are not hard to add, really. Apple is making a fortune each iteration, they're adding just enough to sell, and it works.

[Boinng]

all of this, looks like this: "The iPhone is not what I dislike, it's the pompas ass owners of the phone I can't stand." -GWelker62 . Only Vise versa.

No, not really. The funny thing is I really want to like the Iphone, a week or so ago I was all set to get one after my kaiser contract is up in November, and hell - I still might, depending on what changes in the meantime. But the harsh reality is still there. No matter how much I like the "better" about the Iphone, I know I'd still miss the hell out of everything else.

I realy wouldn't stress too much on the Copy/Paste issue as the main iPhone problem. Because sooner or later it'll have that, and what are you gonna say then?

Well I'm probably going to say "fantastic, almost there!" - and if they deal with the task support as well, I'd might buy one.

I'm really interested in what people are gonna say when next iPhone arrives, and it will have HSPDA, copy/paste, mms, and full sync computability. These are not hard to add, really. Apple is making a fortune each iteration, they're adding just enough to sell, and it works.

The thing is, people have been saying that things like MMS and copy and paste are just around the corner ever since the launch of the first model. Several new software versions and one major hardware revision later, neither generation Iphone has any of those things natively. The only real software improvement in the 3G is Exchange Sync, and even that sidesteps the original complaint of the first Iphone by still not having any kind of native task or to-do support, despite the fact that Exchange resolutely does.

Something like copy and paste should be an easy thing to add, but then again it should have been one of the first considerations in the UI in the first place, and yet inexplicably we're all still waiting. Likewise, if you're going to put GPS in your new model, then surely you need to have TomTom in the Appstore from day one, especially when TomTom claim to have an app ready? There are just too many question marks about all of this.

[Apex i ITR]

I'm a windows mobile for fan (have been since the motorola MPX200), BUT>....... The iPhone does everything the Tilt can do, and does it better.

I have tried various ROM's, hacks, etc on my tilt and just the simple acto f checking email is way easier on the iPhone (not to mention cooler0. I am by no means a Mac Fan boy....actually I hate Mac's. I don;t buy into their hype at all about their products........but I haveto give credit where credit is due,

I normally swap phones out every 6 months.....the only phone I will be swapping my iPhone out is a 3g one (currently worth it to get it to me).

Now that I can get exchange email on my iphone I have no reason to keep my Tilt around.

I would love for someone to tell me what the Tilt has over the iPhone.

[Apex i ITR]

Let me add the 3 most maddening things about the phone is lack of copy and paste (I don't use that feature all that much), MMS (There is an MMS app that you can use once your phone is "jailbroken"), and video (same as MMS, there is a 3rd party app that allows you to take video).

Lack of bluetooth AD2P is also something I really don't understand about Apple.

As for unlocking it and customizing it....its easier the then Tilt or any other Windows Mobile phone I've ever owned.

[Boinng]

I'm a windows mobile for fan (have been since the motorola MPX200), BUT>....... The iPhone does everything the Tilt can do, and does it better.

No, sadly, it doesn't. If it did I'd have one.

I would love for someone to tell me what the Tilt has over the iPhone.

Well it's been said a few times, but:

Task support (sync'd to Exchange)
Copy & Paste
Availability of decent GPS software like TomTom, and third party software generally (and don't say TomTom is coming, because officially it's not)

That's all off the top of my head, and they're all dealbreakers to some degree.

Then there's all the stuff I hardly use but would still miss, like MMS, video calling (not on the Tilt admittedly, but it's there on my kaiser), video recording, removable battery, etc.

[Flying Kiwi]

Availability of decent GPS software like TomTom, and third party software generallyIt's a pity that the GPS performance with the new Windows Mobile 6.1 Radio/ROMs is no longer up to the same level of performance though. It did perform very well back when the TyTN II was first released but then there were other Radio related problems like music briefly skipping intermittently.

Having wrote that I'm not aware of how the GPS performs on the new iPhone but they wouldn't have to try hard to make it better than the TyTN II currently has :( Of course you never know, HTC could get their act together and actually fix this :eek:

[kilrah]

I would love for someone to tell me what the Tilt has over the iPhone.
- Memory card slot!!
- Copy / paste - I do use it every day, to copy an URL into a note or sms, a phone number or just move files....
- A2DP - daily use for me too.
- MMS - even if I actually don't care, never use those
- GPS software - I use about 4 different apps for both on-road and off-road navigation regularly
- Hardware keyboard and tilting screen! Not really comfortable to browse the web while having a coffee when the device and its screen are laying flat on a table. The Kaiser's screen makes it more like a mini-laptop :) And I don't like soft keyboards. Can do what I want, I'll always do a lot more typos on my friend's iphone than on my kaiser.
- Swappable battery for heavy use or long periods out, even if not needed it's still good to know you have a backup if required.
- Standard USB connector... Fairly stupid, but everywhere you go you'll find a mini-USB cable... I can't count the occasions on which friends were getting pissed off because they had forgotten their iphone cable, so couldn't recharge and had to refrain from using the thing to conserve battery...
- Internet connection sharing.

Regarding WM6.1 and GPS... personally I haven't found a reason to switch to 6.1 yet, it seems all I'm losing is threaded SMS that I could get via 3rd party software IF I cared, which isn't the case... And on the other hand I always get 10-15sec locks with the GPS :)

[findus]

Is this thing still going? ROFL

[gman8966]

I broke down and bought an 8GB iphone. Paid less than $400 total for a broken screen one and all the parts to fix it. So well see how it does, I just get sick of the kaiser's sluggishness sometimes, but it will suck losing GPS, 3G, internet sharing, etc. If I don't like it I can sell it back on ebay for around $500 like all the other ones are going.

[kaalgoosy]

Bought a last gen Iphone to replace my hermes to check it out, returned it within a week n got a Tilt and am very pleased with it. But godamn is the Iphone 3g real Perrrty!! Yeehaww!! It's a pot heads dream phone! Apples next gen 3g device has even more software, reception flaws than their initial device; and you gotta love their remote "kill switch". All these cabs, apps n programs we got...Imagine if microsoft decided to arbitrarily remotely wipe them out from our devices..."and the home of the brave". Fuck Apple

[tiltzone]

Im not a apple fan at all and i can agree with the fact that people should give the iphone 3G a try. im a owner and a solid supporter of WM devices but i must say that there are always 2 sides to everything, im a advance user and daily i need access to data such as emails, the web, wifi, connecting a laptop incase i happen to be in a island millions of miles away and i can say so far i have bin using the phone it has the mose user friendly interface, weather, time, email, browser,sms the things that a person or anyone daily would be using most of the time ooh yeah and GPS. Google maps performs about even and in some cases better than msn search live which have to either be installed on flash rom or it dont work at all.
looking for a location or store with the iphone 3G is a blast very fast results, looking up your online banking online is also a blast, i have alot of problems getting this to work on WM, either i get message saying javascript is not enable please upgrade browser from all opera, pocket is, as well as ebay but it works on ebay most of the time. the weater is dam cool and fast as well, world clock is fast as well, the ability to get feeds is also fast however if your looking for a solid apps its not going to be free. the apple boys did alot of things right this time. the only bad thing i can say i really hate about the phone is cut copy pase is a no no, minimize apps is also a no no unless apple have that app to do suck, forget about 3rd party applications chances are they will all close once you hit home button unless its a really powerfull and needed application, as for the mms messages, i dont even use it at all so it dont bother me if the phone dont have it, hey emailing is faster than mms and more reliable than it as well but then again to each there own thats my opinion, 3G networks tend to drop alot even for no reason at all, the iphone has good potential and will gradually improve over time as for now its still a good phone, the touch keyboard cuts alot of weight on the phone and takes some getting use to but once you get use to it you tend to like it cause it works.
Guys my thing is this and i believe in stuff that works, WM works and it works best still but a new WM phone still have alot of bulk in the apps that it comes on as is, the iphone on the other hand comes with stuff that really works, and that you use everyday. modding for WM is a must but most of the people today dont want to go through all the hassle of flashing flashing flashing but will have to at some point in the USA the iphone has its place, outside of the USA i dont really think so since WM phones carry much higher network access speeds. the iphone has a long way to go but its on a good start, for now, cheers theres a ton more on the good side of this phone but it still needs more applications to fill in the gaps.

[Boinng]

I might as well admit, I posted three or four times in this thread about how the Iphone wasn't for me, since it didn't have feature X, Y and Z of the Kaiser, but you know what? I've totally caved.

The thing about the Kaiser, and WM in general, is that yes - it has a feature list as long as your arm, much of which isn't replicated by the Iphone - but let's be absolutely honest here. Very little of it is actually done well, and very little of that (that the Iphone doesn't also do) is actually unliveable without.

I'll be getting an Iphone next month, because actually I'm willing to sacrifice a few features in order to get a great experience from my phone. No more lags, no more dissapointing video, no more UI inconsistincies, no more rubbish browsing (and even the latest Opera on my Kaiser is generally pretty uncomfortable to use). In return for the best browsing, the best screen (in terms of daylight readability as well as resolution and size), the best gaming, the most elegant and useable interface... actually, I can, and will, live without things like tasks and copy/paste. And the vast majority of other features are things I either never used, or never worked well on the Kaiser anyway.

I'll keep the Kaiser for TomTom in the car, until or unless something equivalent becomes available for the Iphone... but that's it. After a year of trying to get the best out of the Kaiser, it mostly leaves me feeling irritable these days. I'm looking forward to using a more elegant device that just works.

[funem]

I still prefer the ZX spectrum, oh sorry wrong thread, it just seems so deja vu....

Buy the OS that has the functions you need, Get the model you are comftable with. Stay within buget.

everything else is irrelevant,

Move along nothing ( new ) to be seen here.

[nufsaid]

iPhone 3G is amazing, the only reason I don't have one is that I txt and e-mail from my Kaiser way too much to not have a physical keyboard. We are developing software apps at my office for the 3G, we have 2 EDGE and 2 3G's and they are not only beautiful but preform amazingly well out of the box where as the Kaiser needed to be heavily modified before running 'smoothly'. While I might not ever own an iPhone (htc HD plz) you have to admit that they are the most popular/easy to use/and powerful smart phones on the market.

[cyjeff]

I will agree that the iPhone is great out of the box is all you want to do with it is the stuff it comes with out of the box.

Yes... yes... I know there are a bunch of 3rd party apps now, but there are a bunch of 3rd party apps for the Mac, too. Just a fraction of those available for the windows environment.

The iphone is a show pony. I needed a workhorse. Sure, the workhorse is sometimes tougher to work with, but, when I get her working, I make the show pony look like a toy.

[rajc78]

my 2 cents on why kaiser > iphone

1. I can modify today screen to look like kaiser today, iphone tomorrow, HTC diamond the day after....and may be install Android in the future.
2. Run 10 applications at the same time and switch between them at will.
3. Take the phone to the golf course and use it as a golf caddy.
4. Take it to a golf driving range and use it to record my golf swing.
5. Take a long drive to a remote area with no signal and not worry about getting lost (I have tomtom).
6. Use it for Geocaching
7. While traveling, connect it to a laptop and access the internet.
8. Use it as a web cam.
9. Never miss a Twins or Vikings game (I have Sling media player).
...and many more.

Agreed that iphone is a superior internet browsing device and has TV OUT option (I really wish kaiser had TV OUT). But I am not willing to sacrifice all the features of Kaiser for the TV OUT (I hope AT&T brings Touch HD and Touch Pro).

[LunaC]

My solution was to get a 2G ipod touch and use the kaiser as the wireless access point when WiFi isnt a option. Of course if I need to travellean, I can have the kaiser on me and not have any concerns plus still have it to tether with.