Why does Bell not consider the Vogue a smartphone?

[Macmee]

Soon it's time for me to get a phone upgrade for one of the two HTC vogues on my contract, so Bell called me and asked me if I thought about it and I told them I was putting the upgrade credit towards an iPhone. They told me I need to upgrade my plan to a data plan. I told them I had a smartphone already and they said the HTC Touch was designed to look and act like a smartphone but Bell doesn't count it as a smartphone:confused:

Now to get my a new phone I have to be on atleast a 500mb a month data plan. 500MB a month?! I don't know but I think I would use that in like a day. I use the internet on my phone quite a bit, I use the last.fm app and push email is on 24/7. To make things worse I can't check how much transfer I use a month now, because Bell's data checker is wrong, it says I only use 15mb, when I've downloaded files larger than 50mb on my phone.

I have no idea what to do:(

[ern88]

Well,
If you like what your phone does. Why not keep it. You can use the latest WinMo builds on it. I don't know. Just my thoughts.

[cybik]

Don't change it. Data charges will go through the roof.

[Macmee]

I'm torn, because the htc dream I'm looking at has tons of nice features, but I don't know how fast I would consume 500mb.

[cybik]

Then i suggest going with the dream but disabling the "cellular network data connection". That way you'll be able to use calendar, email and such (yay for cache-ing data!)... but not google maps. That f'in sucks, i know.

[jamezelle]

well if there data counter s wrong then get the 500mb plan they will only say you used like 40mb right lol:p. j/k

it seems you are in a situation.....

[BJNK]

Download a data monitoring program. Look at what you use after a month and decide if 500mb will suffice.

[Macmee]

Download a data monitoring program. Look at what you use after a month and decide if 500mb will suffice.

That is a brilliant suggestion, but unfortunately the 2 I tried netcounter and rocket data aren't compatible with my vogue:(

I'm not sure what to do, really! I would LOVE to have a larger screen and hardware keyboard, but if I need more than 500mb, well, I need more than 500mb. Ah!

[plemen]

I'm torn, because the htc dream I'm looking at has tons of nice features, but I don't know how fast I would consume 500mb.

Wait - Bell has the HTC Dream??

Ok checked their site mid post and they do not have the HTC dream...

Also for the HTC Vogue - the reason it isn't considered a PDA by Bell (from what I've heard) is more marketing than anything. The wanted to release a PDA with cheap data to get customers in contracts during the just-pre-ipone era.

[skydirt]

I am on Bell and got my Touch on release day. Bell does consider it a smart phone. However, they allow a customer with a Touch to add the Unlimited Mobile Browser which is normally limited to dumbphones with WAP browsers only.
The reason they did this was because Rogers was releasing the iPhone a few days after the Touch release( in Canada ). The Touch, being the closest thing to an iPhone hardware wise at the time ( all screen, no keyboard ). Bell decided to sell the Touch for cheap AND give it a VERY cheap unlimited data plan. 5$. Yes, unlimited data on the Vogue with Bell was 5 $. and it worked. The Touch was sold out all over the place here and there are many, many Bell Touch owners because of this.
It has since been raised to $7 and $10 data plans, depending if you're on contract or not. This was a one time shot and in the 2 years since Bell has done this, they have never done it again with any other smart device.
So, if you get rid of the vogue, you have to go to their new absurd data plans. IMO stick with your vogue, it is still the best phone that BEll carries with a 7$ Unlimited Data Plan; you can't beat that.


Also, in reagrds to the incorrect data usage displaying on your bill; Bell caps each data session at 0.0391MB. So even if you DL 100mb file, it sill still only show 0.0391MB for that session. Why? I don't know, but I'm sure someone much smarter then me can tell you why carriers do this. If you want to track your data usage, use SPB Wireless Monitor as it does work on the Touch.

EDIT: These are the devices that Bell carries that allow the 5, 7 and 10 dollar unlimited data plans.

AUDIOVOX

8930

HTC

Touch

KYOCERA

3245

LG

150, 325, 385, 6200, Bliss, Chocolate, Fusic, Musiq, Reveal / Shimmer, Rumour, Rumour 2, Shine, Vantage, Voyager, Wine, Xenon

MOTOROLA

e815, Hint, KRZR, RAZR v3c, RAZR2 v9m, ROKR Z6m

NOKIA

2730, 2855i, 6350

SAMSUNG

a580 ,a640 ,a900, a920, m230 (Phoenix), m300, m320, m500, m510, m530, m610, m620, r610, r651 (Vice), u740, Cleo, Impact, Instinct, Link, Reclaim

SANYO

2300, 2400, 7000, 7050, 7500, 8300, Katana, Katana LX, Katana Eclipse, Pro 200, Pro 700, S1

[Macmee]

I am on Bell and got my Touch on release day. Bell does consider it a smart phone. However, they allow a customer with a Touch to add the Unlimited Mobile Browser which is normally limited to dumbphones with WAP browsers only.
The reason they did this was because Rogers was releasing the iPhone a few days after the Touch release( in Canada ). The Touch, being the closest thing to an iPhone hardware wise at the time ( all screen, no keyboard ). Bell decided to sell the Touch for cheap AND give it a VERY cheap unlimited data plan. 5$. Yes, unlimited data on the Vogue with Bell was 5 $. and it worked. The Touch was sold out all over the place here and there are many, many Bell Touch owners because of this.
It has since been raised to $7 and $10 data plans, depending if you're on contract or not. This was a one time shot and in the 2 years since Bell has done this, they have never done it again with any other smart device.
So, if you get rid of the vogue, you have to go to their new absurd data plans. IMO stick with your vogue, it is still the best phone that BEll carries with a 7$ Unlimited Data Plan; you can't beat that.


Also, in reagrds to the incorrect data usage displaying on your bill; Bell caps each data session at 0.0391MB. So even if you DL 100mb file, it sill still only show 0.0391MB for that session. Why? I don't know, but I'm sure someone much smarter then me can tell you why carriers do this. If you want to track your data usage, use SPB Wireless Monitor as it does work on the Touch.

EDIT: These are the devices that Bell carries that allow the 5, 7 and 10 dollar unlimited data plans.

AUDIOVOX

8930

HTC

Touch

KYOCERA

3245

LG

150, 325, 385, 6200, Bliss, Chocolate, Fusic, Musiq, Reveal / Shimmer, Rumour, Rumour 2, Shine, Vantage, Voyager, Wine, Xenon

MOTOROLA

e815, Hint, KRZR, RAZR v3c, RAZR2 v9m, ROKR Z6m

NOKIA

2730, 2855i, 6350

SAMSUNG

a580 ,a640 ,a900, a920, m230 (Phoenix), m300, m320, m500, m510, m530, m610, m620, r610, r651 (Vice), u740, Cleo, Impact, Instinct, Link, Reclaim

SANYO

2300, 2400, 7000, 7050, 7500, 8300, Katana, Katana LX, Katana Eclipse, Pro 200, Pro 700, S1

Wow, thanks for telling me this :) If I am doing something, such as having background data (with google sync) would that be affected by the maximum session rule? I don't know what exactly a session is :P

Wait - Bell has the HTC Dream??

Ok checked their site mid post and they do not have the HTC dream...

Also for the HTC Vogue - the reason it isn't considered a PDA by Bell (from what I've heard) is more marketing than anything. The wanted to release a PDA with cheap data to get customers in contracts during the just-pre-ipone era.

No, I got the device from ebay :)

[skydirt]

There is no actual data limit per session or a "maximum session rule". It's just how its recorded by the system and displayed backto you. Even if you call TCARE or text TCARE it will show this deflated value. Session is when your phone dials #777 to connect to data. Under WinMo you can see this by clicking on your data icon on the status bar. It will show you that you're connected and the current session time. Now, don't be fooled thinking that the system does not fully register your total usage and expect to get away with tehering etc ( on a non safe ROM ) cause you will indeed be billed for actual usage.

[Macmee]

There is no actual data limit per session or a "maximum session rule". It's just how its recorded by the system and displayed backto you. Even if you call TCARE or text TCARE it will show this deflated value. Session is when your phone dials #777 to connect to data. Under WinMo you can see this by clicking on your data icon on the status bar. It will show you that you're connected and the current session time. Now, don't be fooled thinking that the system does not fully register your total usage and expect to get away with tehering etc ( on a non safe ROM ) cause you will indeed be billed for actual usage.

But I mean, if I have background data in Android running, with the gmail sync, is that going to eat up my 500mb:p

[skydirt]

Yes it will.

[Macmee]

argh, I have no idea what I'm going to do then.

I think I need to hear what other people do with android and how much data they consume:(

[BJNK]

But I mean, if I have background data in Android running, with the gmail sync, is that going to eat up my 500mb:p

If you are asking will just background data and emails and casually surfing the net eat up 500mb, then no not even close.

But if your a "power user" and your downloading MP3's watching youtube and streaming lastfm, then yes you will definitely go over.

As well the original reason for the Vogue to be non smartphone was because it did not have a keyboard. The Vogue was the first phone in NA (I believe) to be an entirely touch interface with no physical keyboard/dialpad. It was this reasoning that they did not believe it to be a true smart phone, and honestly given one WinMo 6.0 they were pretty much right lol

The iPhone was not available until July 11 2008 from Rogers, the touch has been out since July 2007 and was released to Bell sometime in the fall of 2007.

[Macmee]

If you are asking will just background data and emails and casually surfing the net eat up 500mb, then no not even close.

But if your a "power user" and your downloading MP3's watching youtube and streaming lastfm, then yes you will definitely go over.

As well the original reason for the Vogue to be non smartphone was because it did not have a keyboard. The Vogue was the first phone in NA (I believe) to be an entirely touch interface with no physical keyboard/dialpad. It was this reasoning that they did not believe it to be a true smart phone, and honestly given one WinMo 6.0 they were pretty much right lol

The iPhone was not available until July 11 2008 from Rogers, the touch has been out since July 2007 and was released to Bell sometime in the fall of 2007.

I think I could give up last.fm for the larger screen and hardware keyboard:p

Thanks for your reply:)

Now I just have to figure out how to make the dream work with Bell software wise, I think I have to make it dial 777 or something

[stickus]

As far as I know, Bell now has a full GSM network... no extra config should be needed to get a GPRS/EGDE/HSPA connection... should just work outta the box with a Bell SIM card

[skydirt]

As far as I know, Bell now has a full GSM network... no extra config should be needed to get a GPRS/EGDE/HSPA connection... should just work outta the box with a Bell SIM card

Bell does have a new network, however it is not GSM. It does however use sim cards. The new network is HSPA+/UMTS and only supports dual band of 850/1900. This is different then the GSM/GPRS/EDGE Quad-band (850/900/1800/1900 MHz) and any devices that use these bands will not work on the new Telus and Bell network.
Example:
A GSM (850/1900 MHz) device will not work on Bell/Telus
A HSPA/UMTS (850/1900 MHz) will work on Bell/Telus.

The NA version of the HTC Dream that rogers carries happens to support HSDPA/UMTS dual-band (850/1900 MHZ) and will work on Bell and Telus' new network. However, popping a bell sim card into a Rogers HTC dream will not make it work. You will need to have the device unlocked and then you will need to contact Bell and give them the ESN to activate on your account, or do it online though your account services. Bell will unlock a device for you for a $75 charge. I suggest doing it yourself for free by looking up how to get your unlock code and how to unlock your device, in the usual places.

[criminalogic]

Bell does have a new network, however it is not GSM. It does however use sim cards. The new network is HSPA+/UMTS and only supports dual band of 850/1900. This is different then the GSM/GPRS/EDGE Quad-band (850/900/1800/1900 MHz) and any devices that use these bands will not work on the new Telus and Bell network.
Example:
A GSM (850/1900 MHz) device will not work on Bell/Telus
A HSPA/UMTS (850/1900 MHz) will work on Bell/Telus.

The NA version of the HTC Dream that rogers carries happens to support HSDPA/UMTS dual-band (850/1900 MHZ) and will work on Bell and Telus' new network. However, popping a bell sim card into a Rogers HTC dream will not make it work. You will need to have the device unlocked and then you will need to contact Bell and give them the ESN to activate on your account, or do it online though your account services. Bell will unlock a device for you for a $75 charge. I suggest doing it yourself for free by looking up how to get your unlock code and how to unlock your device, in the usual places.

True, except tha dream "and any GSM only device" uses an IMEI number not ESN.. "besides phones like tha touch pro2 for telus witch has an ESN & IMEI as it suppots CDMA & GSM" im shure bell wouldnt need tha IMEI or even be able use it for that matter as they can not have every IMEI in there data base, only with one of there devices would you be able to register tha IMEI on your account.. allthough like skydirt said if its unlocked and support NA HSPA bands it should work.. most new devices may auto configure your carrier settings (for data) but you may need to get settings from bell for some phones to work - at least that how it works with rogers/fido "were i am a beloved customer service Rep" :)

PS: im in tha same boat as tha creator of this thread and it sucks! im kicking my own ass for not upgrading my phone wen they still offered unlimited data, sms, calldisplay, voicemail etc for $45 a month.. i no i would go well over even with 1GB on any other device... i did put tha wife on tha $45 unlimited plan while it was still offered though,,, now if i can just get her to switch accounts with me :D lol i have herd bell will allow you to keep old data plans switching to there HSPA network? ?

[criminalogic]

Now I just have to figure out how to make the dream work with Bell software wise, I think I have to make it dial 777 or something
Im not shure about all devices but all tha WM phones iv used dial #777 to access tha data network.. on HSPA (Not 100% shure) but dont think it would use dialup access..? you would need tha APN, username & password, aswell as compatible phone & SIM to access GSM data...
with fido its basically APN:http://internet.fido.ca Username&password both fido ....

Dont meen to hyjack tha thread but i have a question on bells HSPA+ network...
Does anyone no if touch HD T8285 version with Only NA HSPA Band 850
and not 1900 band would still work? is it certin areas that use diff bands? do they broadcast both bands ? or what? i totaly want tha HD.. dont think i want tha capasitive HD2 "wen its launched for NA in 2010" as its way to exspensive, and i like using a stylus.. i want an HTC "dont think i could use anyother now" Need a big screen.. dont want a keyboard, and dont think i could leave winmo.. tha HD is what i need.. lol

Edit: i have had confirmation on howardsforum from a member that uses it with rogers 3G and allso has omnia2 on bell.. he tested and stated it works fine... still any input would be welcom before i shell that kinda loot on a device :)
Thanks xda