How to tell if SMS messages have been read?

KingofX · May 21, 2008

Background: I've flashed with DCD's 3.0.4 rom, Verizon XV6800. ArcSoft MMS 5.0.31.11 running.

Question: How can you tell on this if an SMS text you send is read by the recipient? Honestly, I couldn't even figure that out when the phone was stock. I know on this version of ArcSoft MMS there's actually a checkbox for delivery and read reports in the MMS Options...but I only get a delivery report when sending an MMS (not a SMS message) and even THEN I can't tell when it has been read.

Is it just not possible? Older phones show a little D or a checkmark by the message when it's read...how about our flashier PPC's? Anyone know?

gc14 · May 21, 2008

Older phones show a little D or a checkmark by the message when it's read...how about our flashier PPC's? Anyone know?

The D or checkmark does not indicate if the message has been read, rather it indicates if the message was received by the recipient's handset. For example, if the recipient had their phone off, the checkmark would not appear until they turned it on and the message was delivered to their phone.

gbenj · May 21, 2008

gcincotta said:
The D or checkmark does not indicate if the message has been read, rather it indicates if the message was received by the recipient's handset. For example, if the recipient had their phone off, the checkmark would not appear until they turned it on and the message was delivered to their phone.

Any way to get that? or to check somewhere and see if the message has been delivered?

gc14 · May 21, 2008

Any way to get that? or to check somewhere and see if the message has been delivered?

Yes there is a way, but there are cons. It either clutters your inbox, or you are forced to delete a message everytime you send one.

Navigate to HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Inbox\Settings and change DisableSMSDeliveryReceipt to 0 and change SMSDeliveryNotify to 1 and soft reset.

Give it a try, if it annoys you, to go back to normal, just flip flop them.

gbenj · May 22, 2008

gcincotta said:
Yes there is a way, but there are cons. It either clutters your inbox, or you are forced to delete a message everytime you send one.

Navigate to HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Inbox\Settings and change DisableSMSDeliveryReceipt to 0 and change SMSDeliveryNotify to 1 and soft reset.

Give it a try, if it annoys you, to go back to normal, just flip flop them.

if youve got threaded sms, woulndt it store it all on one thread?
I dont actually know how or what it does, but just a thought...

thanks, will give it a try though.

KingofX · May 22, 2008

gcincotta said:
The D or checkmark does not indicate if the message has been read, rather it indicates if the message was received by the recipient's handset. For example, if the recipient had their phone off, the checkmark would not appear until they turned it on and the message was delivered to their phone.

I was going by a friend who has Verizon and a Motorola phone and he claims that when his texts are read by recipients that it places a checkmark on his phone. Your point makes sense though.

Back to the original question however...what about on our XV6800's? Is there any way to tell when an SMS is read?

shield001 · May 22, 2008

gcincotta said:
The D or checkmark does not indicate if the message has been read, rather it indicates if the message was received by the recipient's handset. For example, if the recipient had their phone off, the checkmark would not appear until they turned it on and the message was delivered to their phone.

Actually most phones have a delivered and a read notification. like on my girlfriends u740 it'll have the delivered time and then the read time below it. I used to have a blackberry and it would put a check if it was delivered and a check+D if it was read. I'd love to have this feature but i don't think anyone has found a workaround yet

gc14 · May 22, 2008

Actually most phones have a delivered and a read notification. like on my girlfriends u740 it'll have the delivered time and then the read time below it. I used to have a blackberry and it would put a check if it was delivered and a check+D if it was read. I'd love to have this feature but i don't think anyone has found a workaround yet

Again, these times are NOT when the person actually reads the message. They lead you to believe that that's the case when it is not. In the case of your friend's phone, the delivered time is actually the time that the message was relayed from the network to the recipient, and the read time is the time when the handset actually receives the message. The message could sit in the recipient's Inbox for 3 weeks unread and you would never know the difference. Nevertheless, this feature does not exist on windows mobile devices and the only workaround is getting a message from System Administrator telling you the message was sent successful every time you send one. Messages from System Administrator are NOT threaded.

Example: I turn notify on and send a message but I don't have service. The message looks like it goes through on my end, but until I receive the System Administrator notification, it technically hasn't been received yet. Like I said, this clutters the Inbox with all those messages as they are not threaded, or you can delete the notification after every time you send a message. This is the only way to achieve something like this.

gbenj · May 22, 2008

but even if it is succesfully sent, does that indicate receipt of the message? do you get notification when u have succesfully sent the message, even if the recipient has their phone off?

shield001 · May 23, 2008

gcincotta said:
Again, these times are NOT when the person actually reads the message. They lead you to believe that that's the case when it is not. In the case of your friend's phone, the delivered time is actually the time that the message was relayed from the network to the recipient, and the read time is the time when the handset actually receives the message. The message could sit in the recipient's Inbox for 3 weeks unread and you would never know the difference.

So I tested this and on her u740 she sent me a message and i received it like 10 secs later and it showed delivered at that time. I waited about an hour and opened the message(even though I could read it when it came through) and closed out of my texts which got rid of the notification and it added delivered 10 mins later.

I'm pretty sure this is only a verizon thing and almost every verizon non windows phone is capable of this feature. Also verizon only charges for text messages that are read from the handset if you don't have unlimited texts which is prob why they have this feature.

Maybe it's not a feature available on our phones but It is possible to have.

gc14 · May 23, 2008

So I tested this and on her u740 she sent me a message and i received it like 10 secs later and it showed delivered at that time. I waited about an hour and opened the message(even though I could read it when it came through) and closed out of my texts which got rid of the notification and it added delivered 10 mins later.

I'm pretty sure this is only a verizon thing and almost every verizon non windows phone is capable of this feature. Also verizon only charges for text messages that are read from the handset if you don't have unlimited texts which is prob why they have this feature.

Maybe it's not a feature available on our phones but It is possible to have.

Ok well I thought we were talking about straight SMS with no EMS application extension (which is the feature you're referring to).

I'll explain a little about the SMS system.

You get the D notification when it is a subscriber within your network (i.e. Verizon to Verizon as you've been testing), it has to do with a specific signature flag that is triggered from within that network and does not cross networks.

The check mark means the cell tower has received and cached the message on the tower server for queuing to be transmitted. Once the SMS message has left queuing and goes to transit, which means it has left the tower's local server and has been sent to the carrier message manager (or out to a different network), then the D appears saying the message has been delivered. This really means "message has been delivered to the network" not necessarily to the recipient's device. Most of the time it happens so fast it usually hits the person's handset roughly within 3-5 seconds which coincidentally is the same time the queue server will send you the D flag to notify you it's been delivered. It's a pretty accurate indicator, but is completely unrelated. This D does not indicate when the message was read. In some instances, the person's handset can be off and you'll still get the D.

The times and updated times you're seeing on the u740 is part of the Enhanced Messaging Service, or EMS, application extension to SMS. The u740 is an EMS capable device, which is why you're seeing these updates. Windows Mobile devices are NOT EMS capable, which is why you'll never see this feature, nor will you see any workaround or fix. The only way you'll be able to get this feature is if you ditch your Titan for an EMS capable non smart phone, or if in the future they decide to make WM EMS capable.

Hopefully this clears up the confusion a little.

GC

KingofX · May 23, 2008

gcincotta said:
Ok well I thought we were talking about straight SMS with no EMS application extension (which is the feature you're referring to).

I'll explain a little about the SMS system.

You get the D notification when it is a subscriber within your network (i.e. Verizon to Verizon as you've been testing), it has to do with a specific signature flag that is triggered from within that network and does not cross networks.

The check mark means the cell tower has received and cached the message on the tower server for queuing to be transmitted. Once the SMS message has left queuing and goes to transit, which means it has left the tower's local server and has been sent to the carrier message manager (or out to a different network), then the D appears saying the message has been delivered. This really means "message has been delivered to the network" not necessarily to the recipient's device. Most of the time it happens so fast it usually hits the person's handset roughly within 3-5 seconds which coincidentally is the same time the queue server will send you the D flag to notify you it's been delivered. It's a pretty accurate indicator, but is completely unrelated. This D does not indicate when the message was read. In some instances, the person's handset can be off and you'll still get the D.

The times and updated times you're seeing on the u740 is part of the Enhanced Messaging Service, or EMS, application extension to SMS. The u740 is an EMS capable device, which is why you're seeing these updates. Windows Mobile devices are NOT EMS capable, which is why you'll never see this feature, nor will you see any workaround or fix. The only way you'll be able to get this feature is if you ditch your Titan for an EMS capable non smart phone, or if in the future they decide to make WM EMS capable.

Hopefully this clears up the confusion a little.

GC

Ok, so in essence you are saying that the ability to know when an SMS message is read does not exist, even with EMS capabilities. Why, on Windows Mobile phones, does the ArcSoft MMS Composer give a checkbox to Allow Read Reports for MMS Messages as if that is a feature that works, yet I haven't even seen that work for MMS messages either? Is that just because Verizon's network doesn't support read reports/receipts? I would think that there would be a way of knowing when a message is read (much like read receipts in Outlook, although the recipient has the option to not send the read receipt, but that's neither here nor there).

shield001 · May 23, 2008

EMS phones have read reports, but apparently we don't have an EMS phone

gc14 · May 23, 2008

EMS phones have read reports, but apparently we don't have an EMS phone

You are correct.

KingofX · May 23, 2008

I was doing a little research on the capabilities of EMS and MMS, and came across something interesting in the wikipedia listing for EMS:

EMS is an intermediate technology, between SMS and MMS, providing some of the features of MMS. EMS is a technology that is designed to work with existing networks, but may ultimately be made obsolete by MMS.

What's perplexing there is that we know EMS is an extension to SMS, and it is saying that EMS is intermediate to MMS...so why doesn't MMS include all SMS and EMS capabilities?

dcd1182 · May 23, 2008

KingofX said:
What's perplexing there is that we know EMS is an extension to SMS, and it is saying that EMS is intermediate to MMS...so why doesn't MMS include all SMS and EMS capabilities?

it does, but the carrier must choose to configure the mms client and mms server to support those capabilities.

michaelk · Dec 29, 2008

gc14 said:
... Windows Mobile devices are NOT EMS capable, which is why you'll never see this feature, nor will you see any workaround or fix. The only way you'll be able to get this feature is if you ditch your Titan for an EMS capable non smart phone, or if in the future they decide to make WM EMS capable.

Hopefully this clears up the confusion a little.

GC

apparently at some point MS and VZ planned on ems in wm- the press releases from the 6700 mention ems:
http://news.vzw.com/news/2006/01/pr2006-01-04b.html

but a bit more current:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa919404.aspx

seems wm 6 has a regedit to allow ems.

anyone made progress getting ems to work with wm6 (or 6.1) on vz?

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How to tell if SMS messages have been read?

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