Gotta Let you all in on Scotty's ROM

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adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
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This is with Scott's clean Rom 1.0. Maybe stock gives you the same battery performance. But this Rom is as smooth as butter.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium

Stock is smooth as butter too.

Screenshot_2013-02-12-09-05-12.png
Screenshot_2013-02-12-09-05-26.png


As you can imagine, it is similar battery life if I traded 8 hours for 1.5 hours in screen time.

You guys gotta stop buying into placebos. Zip roms are for features. Performance increases and battery savings will only be seen in a kernel. The rest of the claims are flat out lies.
 
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richii0207

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Stock is smooth as butter too.

Screenshot_2013-02-12-09-05-12.png
Screenshot_2013-02-12-09-05-26.png


As you can imagine, it is similar battery life if I traded 8 hours for 1.5 hours in screen time.

You guys gotta stop buying into placebos. Zip roms are for features. Performance increases and battery savings will only be seen in a kernel. The rest of the claims are flat out lies.

I'm glad someone shares the exact same idea. The sole purpose of rooting my previous phones was for battery %. Now that TW does that, I have no reason to root or unlock.
And to the comment about being smooth as butter....JB has project butter incorporated so it's going to obviously be smooth.

On my previous phones the best battery I've had were on stock roms. Placebos rule the android world with false claims (build.prop edit, init.d scripts, batterysaving apps, etc) that MANY people fall for.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda app-developers app
 

sudermatt

Senior Member
Nov 26, 2003
936
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Huh,

I honestly did not know there was such a "keep it stock" culture. I've been ROMing my phones...well...forever. I've never kept a phone stock for more than 1 week or two, and I go back a LONG way.

Call me Al Gore, but I thought the performance/battery arguement was already decided and the science was clearly in favor of zipROMs. Now I'm freezing my butt off running my CleanROM.

I think there needs to be some definative testing done...real studies!
 

adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
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Huh,

I honestly did not know there was such a "keep it stock" culture. I've been ROMing my phones...well...forever. I've never kept a phone stock for more than 1 week or two, and I go back a LONG way.

Call me Al Gore, but I thought the performance/battery arguement was already decided and the science was clearly in favor of zipROMs. Now I'm freezing my butt off running my CleanROM.

I think there needs to be some definative testing done...real studies!

There is no science clearly in favor of zip ROMs unless you consider placebo a real finding....


I don't care if people stay stock or not. I just rather people understand what a zip ROM is, is not.
 
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richii0207

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Huh,

I honestly did not know there was such a "keep it stock" culture. I've been ROMing my phones...well...forever. I've never kept a phone stock for more than 1 week or two, and I go back a LONG way.

Call me Al Gore, but I thought the performance/battery arguement was already decided and the science was clearly in favor of zipROMs. Now I'm freezing my butt off running my CleanROM.

I think there needs to be some definative testing done...real studies!

There has been tests, just look for them or perform them yourself http://www.jeffmixon.com/examining-build-prop-tweaks-for-android-ics-a-comprehensive-guide-part-1/ is one example. People use a number of those build.prop edits on ICS and claim speed improvements....when they dont even work post GB....

And the debloating obsession is ridiculous. It does not increase speed or battery life, people need to understand how the OS works. Odex vs deoxed is another one. I can go on and on.

If these things really did work, manufacturers would have incorporated them already.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda app-developers app
 
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eraursls1984

Senior Member
Sep 8, 2010
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And the debloating obsession is ridiculous. It does not increase speed or battery life, people need to understand how the OS works.

When all your devices memory is filled with bloat that you never use, and the apps you always use constantly redraw that is a performance issue, and it effects the battery (not much, but it does). When you then freeze or uninstall the bloat and your other apps no longer redraw constantly while you use them you have increased the performance. It's not as much of a problem now, but with older devices with under a gb of ram it was a major problem. I also understand that apps sitting in memory don't (normally) eat up battery or resources, but when its bloat and your other useful apps are never in memory it's a problem, also its a problem when your device starts to lag due to low memory (was only a problem for me on the Droid X and Thunderbolt, every device with 1gb of ram or more has been fine) I had to use a app to reset the ram settings so it wouldn't drop below 90 mb, or it would lag/freeze.
 

adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
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When all your devices memory is filled with bloat that you never use, and the apps you always use constantly redraw that is a performance issue, and it effects the battery (not much, but it does). When you then freeze or uninstall the bloat and your other apps no longer redraw constantly while you use them you have increased the performance. It's not as much of a problem now, but with older devices with under a gb of ram it was a major problem. I also understand that apps sitting in memory don't (normally) eat up battery or resources, but when its bloat and your other useful apps are never in memory it's a problem, also its a problem when your device starts to lag due to low memory (was only a problem for me on the Droid X and Thunderbolt, every device with 1gb of ram or more has been fine) I had to use a app to reset the ram settings so it wouldn't drop below 90 mb, or it would lag/freeze.

Backgrounded processes aren't using resources though. They might be in ram, but they are cleared out as needed, and that model works really well.

You use the same amount of battery whether your ram is full or empty. Empty is useless, and full is fine as long as the memory management works, and it does. You would only get redraw if those processes weren't backgrounded, and if they weren't, let me tell you, there would be tremendous battery drain. We would see screenshots of bloat taking up battery usage too.

Debloating is useful for:

1. Saving space on /system and probably internal storage.
2. You don't have to look at those crappy apps you don't use or want in the drawer.
3. You are OCD and have to keep a tight ship.


I fall under number 3 mostly, but I have no preconceptions about it affecting battery life or performance.
 
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1ManWolfePack

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Those *things* you never used are backgrounded and harmless, despite perceptions.

I have never seen a battery use screen shot chock full of apps never used draining the battery. ...

Except Maps. That one is annoying.

I am fully stock still and almost 2d usage with 34 percent left.

I agree with almost everything you've said, I just noticed a minimal increase once I freeze/delete certain things. For example - exchange. That ish constantly runs in the background and has about 3 associated resources with it. I let it run rogue for about a week, then froze everything associated with it. Idle drain seemed better during my typical work shift.

Now I'm not saying 'OMFG my battery tripled!' I'm saying a nominal increase. But I could tell. Same for a few other things, such as the smart alarm clock widget. My phone sleeps better when that monster is frozen.

All in all, I agree with you, dude. I hate battery life threads. One ROM is not going to give you better battery life. Now if that ROMs kernel has some tweaks to it (shut off xyz core(s) while screen off) - then yes, but you already said that.

TL;DR: I think debloating helps, otherwise I agree with about everything Adrynaline said.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
 
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imnuts

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All in all, I agree with you, dude. I hate battery life threads. One ROM is not going to give you better battery life. Now if that ROMs kernel has some tweaks to it (shut off xyz core(s) while screen off) - then yes, but you already said that.

The 2 multi-core kernels I've dealt with so far (GNexus and Note 2), they turn off all but one core by default, and only turn on more cores when needed. So, even the stock kernel does well with this respect, unless the developer is mildly retarded and disabled hot plug. Also, from my own experience, you can't do too much to improve battery life with regards to the kernel either, but it is quite easy to make it worse. I haven't done to much with the Note 2 yet though, so it may be different for the Note 2 compared to the GNex.
 
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Backgrounded processes aren't using resources though. They might be in ram, but they are cleared out as needed, and that model works really well.

You use the same amount of battery whether your ram is full or empty. Empty is useless, and full is fine as long as the memory management works, and it does. You would only get redraw if those processes weren't backgrounded, and if they weren't, let me tell you, there would be tremendous battery drain. We would see screenshots of bloat taking up battery usage too.

Debloating is useful for:

1. Saving space on /system and probably internal storage.
2. You don't have to look at those crappy apps you don't use or want in the drawer.
3. You are OCD and have to keep a tight ship.


I fall under number 3 mostly, but I have no preconceptions about it affecting battery life or performance.

Generally agree, with the exception that all those "bloatware" applications often have broadcast receivers and wake timers and talk to "MotherShip" whether you use them or not, this can easily affect battery life and performance(even if none of them hit the top ten in the battery screen). If it's a simple app with no background service and no receivers then yes they are not affecting performance or battery and it's just about being tidy.

One total exception to this however is the CleanROM avalable for the TF700. The TF700 has some serious Random IO issues on stock ROM, but the Stock Based CleanROM for the TF700 is without question Night and Day superior. That said I won't claim to have insight into what was done to that ROM to make it perform so well, but it's not an AOSP ROM.

I do agree that stock ROM on Note 2 is completely smooth, and i've only removed stuff to tidy up my app list ;)
 
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1ManWolfePack

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Jul 11, 2012
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Battery life is all up to the user, might I add. If you have 37 crappy apps set to sync/push constantly, with brightness all the way up, you never reboot, you leave GPS on, BT on, etc - your battery is going to suck whatever ROM you run.

I also don't under volt ever. Never saw any benefit or need.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
 
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moemoney12

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Jun 23, 2010
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I'm not saying that stock is better than any Rom. Or vice versa. as it pertains to battery life. Scott's Rom is basically stock. I love my phone when it was stock had great battery life and performance. What Scott offers me is better functionally.
I love the multi window app that's included. Before i had to change the script. The same goes for the camera shutter. And the annoying Wi-Fi notification. And I really dislike bloatware.
But it's all based on personal preference. They both run great. I didn't want to start a debate.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
 
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sudermatt

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Nov 26, 2003
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What about benchmarks, like antutu. Isnt that a way of comparing performance between the verious roms?

Are you telling me that doesnt mean anything?
What is the antutu number on a stock rom?
 

adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
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What about benchmarks, like antutu. Isnt that a way of comparing performance between the verious roms?

Are you telling me that doesnt mean anything?
What is the antutu number on a stock rom?

Im telling you benchmarks don't mean a thing in real world performance and again, the rom doesn't so squat, unless they do an sqlite hack. That only inflates and puts your data at risk.

Kernels change performance, zip roms do not!
 
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richii0207

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What about benchmarks, like antutu. Isnt that a way of comparing performance between the verious roms?

Are you telling me that doesnt mean anything?
What is the antutu number on a stock rom?

No it does not mean anything, it can easily be manipulated. I remember when I had my Droid X, there was a script that would TRIPLE the benchmark scores. The script however had ZERO effect on performance.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda app-developers app
 

sudermatt

Senior Member
Nov 26, 2003
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No it does not mean anything, it can easily be manipulated. I remember when I had my Droid X, there was a script that would TRIPLE the benchmark scores. The script however had ZERO effect on performance.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda app-developers app

I know they can be manipulated.

However, let's assume for a second that it's not being manipulated.

Aren't they still the best way to measure performance from one ROM to another?
Aren't the benchmarks the only real way to counter the "placebo" effect argument?

Will someone that is on stock please let me know what their Antutu score is.

Thanks,
Matt
 

eraursls1984

Senior Member
Sep 8, 2010
916
139
Tallahassee, Florida
Backgrounded processes aren't using resources though. They might be in ram, but they are cleared out as needed, and that model works really well.

You use the same amount of battery whether your ram is full or empty. Empty is useless, and full is fine as long as the memory management works, and it does. You would only get redraw if those processes weren't backgrounded, and if they weren't, let me tell you, there would be tremendous battery drain. We would see screenshots of bloat taking up battery usage too.
I mostly agree, I know that background apps don't effect performance (unless there's not enough free ram which I had a problem with on my Droid X and Thunderbolt) or battery life if they aren't running. The problem is some of these bloat apps do run even though we never use them (blockbuster use to eat up a lot of battery on my Droid X even though I didn't use it) or the memory management didn't work well and bloat apps take up memory while the apps I used every day fought for the rest of the ram. Also on the Droid X and Thunderbolt I had performance issues due to not having enough ram, I had to use an app to set the memory parameters so it wouldn't drop to low and cause lag and freezing.
 

SirVilhelm

Senior Member
Dec 17, 2008
509
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I'm not saying that stock is better than any Rom. Or vice versa. as it pertains to battery life. Scott's Rom is basically stock. I love my phone when it was stock had great battery life and performance. What Scott offers me is better functionally.
I love the multi window app that's included. Before i had to change the script. The same goes for the camera shutter. And the annoying Wi-Fi notification. And I really dislike bloatware.
But it's all based on personal preference. They both run great. I didn't want to start a debate.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium

This is exactly why I run his Rom. Nothing to do with performance or battery, simply like the features. You forgot to mention the ability to change the pull down icons:D

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
 

1ManWolfePack

Senior Member
Jul 11, 2012
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This is exactly why I run his Rom. Nothing to do with performance or battery, simply like the features. You forgot to mention the ability to change the pull down icons:D

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium

Scott's my dude, but honestly bro: are you talking about which toggles display? If yes, welcome to lidroid and every custom ROM. Unless, you mean the actual icon. That would be different.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using xda premium
 
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  • 9
    Short of going to AOSP, you cannot significantly change battery life on any ROM compared to what it is based off of. So, if you make a ROM based on Stock TouchWiz, it is going to get approximately the same usage as the Stock ROM. If you have doubts, go do a comparison test. Even undervolting isn't going to do anything significant for you with modern day processors.
    7
    I just wanted to come over to the General forum and let you all know that Scotty's Clean 4.5 is probably the most amazing ROM I have ever seen on any device.

    out of the box Antutu is 17500....I'm running 10.5 hours with 2 hrs screen time and I have 71% battery left.

    seriously folks....it's all day zoom zoom and it looks and feels totally stock.

    If you haven't tried it....for the love of Pete..."DO-IT MAUN!"

    Im at 1d, 10 hours and almost 1.5 hours screen time, I have 56% left....

    Oh and stock.

    Sorry but no zip rom dev will ever improve battery life without coding their own battery saving applications.

    I am sure the rom is great, but don't credit battery life to it ;)
    5
    I knew I wasn't crazy... I've tried all roms under the sun. To me I've not noticed any performance difference. Of course I'm sure I don't use my note 2 as much as most people...

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

    It has always been my belief that you use roms for features, not performance or battery claims.
    4
    You can't magically increase performance of the underlying hardware with a custom ROM based on the stock firmware. Sure, you may be able to get it to look a little smoother, but actual performance won't change. The only way to increase performance would be to install a custom kernel and overclock the CPU/GPU, and at that point, you'll hurt battery life. Sure, you can tweak memory management, but this isn't going to do more than just keep more apps in memory, or force them out sooner.

    On the same token, you can't magically increase battery life just by installing a custom ROM based on the stock firmware. The major bits of the OS can't be removed or changed really, unless you go to AOSP. Sure, you may get 5-10% at most increased battery life, but you aren't going to get an extra hour of screen time, maybe 10-15 min at most, and even that could just be because you've had better signal strength/quality. At this point, undervolting doesn't even do to much to help with battery life as most processors now are spending 95% of their time in lower power draw states. Running AOSP can potentially get you better battery life, but it can be hit or miss, depending on how well proprietary modules play with the system.
    4
    once again placebo pants...the only reason I run beans is for the aosp themeing. it does not offer any performance gains or battery life over stock, nor will clean rom or any other modded stock variant. listen to imnuts and adrynalyne, those two know ther ish!!