Why the 4.4.2 TouchWiz update doesn't have Tap to Pay.

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gakio12

gakio12

Senior Member
Dec 30, 2011
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Boise
A lot of people are thinking that T-mobile is blocking Tap to Pay on the Note 3 with KitKat. However, it is reported that Tap to Pay works on the T-mobile S4.

T-mobile isn't blocking Tap to Pay; Google simply hasn't integrated the PN-547 chip into Tap to Pay yet. This is why AOSP builds still don't have Tap to Pay. NXP, within the last week, just integrated the PN-547 chip into 4.4, which means it will probably show up in Android 4.4.3.
 
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0ri0n

0ri0n

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2007
129
35
Attleboro, MA
gakio12 said:
A lot of people are thinking that T-mobile is blocking Tap to Pay on the Note 3 with KitKat. However, it is reported that Tap to Pay works on the T-mobile S4.

T-mobile isn't blocking Tap to Pay; Google simply hasn't integrated the PN-547 chip into Tap to Pay yet. This is why AOSP builds still don't have Tap to Pay. NXP, within the last week, just integrated the PN-547 chip into 4.4, which means it will probably show up in Android 4.4.3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Doesnt the sprint note 3 have the same nfc chip?
 
parusia

parusia

Senior Member
Nov 19, 2010
1,046
429
Houston
Matrixk101 said:
I was told in store that u need to update to a differnt kinda sim card for tap and pay I think its called a isis sim card l.

Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app
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That is to use Isis method, what the majority of people want is Google wallet method. What happen with Isis is that works only with certain Credit Cards and not with all of them, I think is only with Wells Fargo, certain chase cards, and Amex.

Sent from my SM-T210R using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
 
0ri0n

0ri0n

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2007
129
35
Attleboro, MA
Matrixk101 said:
I was told in store that u need to update to a differnt kinda sim card for tap and pay I think its called a isis sim card l.

Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
Thats only if you are going to use ISIS as opposed to GWallet. KitKat is supposed to utilize Host Card Emulation so no secure element or secure sim needed. Its built into android, but it seems right now that TMobile and ATT removed that function to force you to use ISIS since that is what they are backing. I could be wrong, but it doesnt make sense that the Sprint Note 3 uses the same NFC controller and can use tap n pay, but the TMobile and ATT variants cant.
 
S

siraltus

Senior Member
Jan 26, 2010
1,997
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0ri0n said:
Doesnt the sprint note 3 have the same nfc chip?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

No it does not. The Sprint variant uses a different NFC controller (NXP P65) that has both a built-in secure element and implements the FeliCa card emulation standard.

This is why Google Wallet works on it on Android 4.3 and on Android 4.4 (using the old SE-based method, not HCE) but not on any of the other variants.

I helped discover this difference. More info here: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2476093

OP is correct - we need to wait for the T-Mobile variant's NFC controller to be supported by KitKat's HCE framework.
 
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cmjkxa

cmjkxa

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May 24, 2011
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San diego
siraltus said:
No it does not. The Sprint variant uses a different NFC controller that has both a built-in secure element and implements the FeliCa card emulation standard.

This is why Google Wallet worked on Android 4.3 on the Sprint variant but not on any of the other variants.

I helped discover this difference. More info here: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2476093

OP is correct - we need to wait for the T-Mobile variant's NFC controller to be supported by KitKat's HCE framework.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I have a question. Will the new S5 have the same NFC chip as the Note 3? This article says it willhttp://nfctimes.com/news/nxp-wins-back-nfc-controller-business-samsung-flagship-misses-embedded-chip. Also the S5 press release said they'd support both Isis and GW here http://www.droid-life.com/2014/02/24/samsung-announces-the-galaxy-s5-coming-this-spring/ I'm just trying to piece this together.
 
S

siraltus

Senior Member
Jan 26, 2010
1,997
1,734
cmjkxa said:
I have a question. Will the new S5 have the same NFC chip as the Note 3? This article says it willhttp://nfctimes.com/news/nxp-wins-back-nfc-controller-business-samsung-flagship-misses-embedded-chip. Also the S5 press release said they'd support both Isis and GW here http://www.droid-life.com/2014/02/24/samsung-announces-the-galaxy-s5-coming-this-spring/ I'm just trying to piece this together.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

No idea, that's up to Samsung. The US variants have the NXP P544 controller, while the international variants have the Broadcom BCM20793 controller (same as used in all the Nexus devices), which is the only chip that KitKat's HCE framework currently supports - this is why phones with the Broadcom chip have Tap-and-Pay while those with the NXP chips don't yet. We need to wait for an update from Google that enables support for the P544 chip in the HCE framework.

The Sprint variant is using the NXP P65, which is a P544 combined with a secure element, which is why Wallet works on it (using the old method, not HCE).
 
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tmoney239sucka

tmoney239sucka

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2010
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10
~Deleted~ Somehow I Miss The First Post Lol

Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app
 
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0ri0n

0ri0n

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2007
129
35
Attleboro, MA
siraltus said:
No it does not. The Sprint variant uses a different NFC controller (NXP P65) that has both a built-in secure element and implements the FeliCa card emulation standard.

This is why Google Wallet works on it on Android 4.3 and on Android 4.4 (using the old SE-based method, not HCE) but not on any of the other variants.

I helped discover this difference. More info here: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2476093

OP is correct - we need to wait for the T-Mobile variant's NFC controller to be supported by KitKat's HCE framework.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Looks like we have some conflicting info here...
http://www.electropages.com/2014/02/nxp-industry-leading-nfc-controller-integrated-googles-latest-version-android-4-4-kitkat/

NXP Semiconductors has announced that its proven, industry-leading NFC controller, PN547, is successfully integrated with Google’s latest version of the Android 4.4 operating system, ‘KitKat’. This significant milestone underscores the popularity and attractiveness of NXP’s PN547 in a wide range of Android-powered mobile devices, says the company.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
 
altimax98

altimax98

Senior Member
Nov 7, 2008
2,227
676
Florida
It's rare to find an excellent informative thread on XDA and the OP nailed it with this one.

Thanks

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk
 
M

MvP77

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2009
697
49
Arlington, TX
I was running a hacked international 4.4.2 touchwiz rom and tap to pay worked on that. It also works on my Nexus 5. So I see no reason why all of the sudden it's not working for T-Mobile on our Note 3.
 
J

jason2nails

New member
Mar 15, 2014
1
0
T-mobile blocking HCE within Kitkat.

Actually if you google the changes that came with Kitkat 4.4.2 from Android itself, one of the changes includes a "tap and pay" option in the Settings under NFC. However this option is not available on the T Mobile note 3 after dating to Kitkat 4.4.2. also if you download the app from the Google Play Store called NFC check you will see that after running the check it there goes that is enabled the Android however HCE is not supported on this device, which it should be with Kitkat update.
 
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    siraltus
    0ri0n said:
    Doesnt the sprint note 3 have the same nfc chip?
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    No it does not. The Sprint variant uses a different NFC controller (NXP P65) that has both a built-in secure element and implements the FeliCa card emulation standard.

    This is why Google Wallet works on it on Android 4.3 and on Android 4.4 (using the old SE-based method, not HCE) but not on any of the other variants.

    I helped discover this difference. More info here: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=2476093

    OP is correct - we need to wait for the T-Mobile variant's NFC controller to be supported by KitKat's HCE framework.
    View
    2
    gakio12
    gakio12
    A lot of people are thinking that T-mobile is blocking Tap to Pay on the Note 3 with KitKat. However, it is reported that Tap to Pay works on the T-mobile S4.

    T-mobile isn't blocking Tap to Pay; Google simply hasn't integrated the PN-547 chip into Tap to Pay yet. This is why AOSP builds still don't have Tap to Pay. NXP, within the last week, just integrated the PN-547 chip into 4.4, which means it will probably show up in Android 4.4.3.
    View
    2
    chuko303
    chuko303
    What bugs? Lol I've been on one rom ever since I upgraded and been beast
    View
    1
    S
    siraltus
    cmjkxa said:
    I have a question. Will the new S5 have the same NFC chip as the Note 3? This article says it willhttp://nfctimes.com/news/nxp-wins-back-nfc-controller-business-samsung-flagship-misses-embedded-chip. Also the S5 press release said they'd support both Isis and GW here http://www.droid-life.com/2014/02/24/samsung-announces-the-galaxy-s5-coming-this-spring/ I'm just trying to piece this together.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    No idea, that's up to Samsung. The US variants have the NXP P544 controller, while the international variants have the Broadcom BCM20793 controller (same as used in all the Nexus devices), which is the only chip that KitKat's HCE framework currently supports - this is why phones with the Broadcom chip have Tap-and-Pay while those with the NXP chips don't yet. We need to wait for an update from Google that enables support for the P544 chip in the HCE framework.

    The Sprint variant is using the NXP P65, which is a P544 combined with a secure element, which is why Wallet works on it (using the old method, not HCE).
    View
    1
    gakio12
    gakio12
    jason2nails said:
    Actually if you google the changes that came with Kitkat 4.4.2 from Android itself, one of the changes includes a "tap and pay" option in the Settings under NFC. However this option is not available on the T Mobile note 3 after dating to Kitkat 4.4.2. also if you download the app from the Google Play Store called NFC check you will see that after running the check it there goes that is enabled the Android however HCE is not supported on this device, which it should be with Kitkat update.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    That is what I am explaining. The HCE framework doesn't yet support the NFC controller in the Note 3. It uses NXP PN547. Google needs to update the framework to include that controller.
    View

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