The Dangers of Tool Kits and One Click Root Methods + Mini Rant

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El Daddy

Retired Forum Moderator
May 2, 2008
4,261
5,210
Roseville, MN
I don't create threads on xda very often and 95% of my posts are me trying to help people out, but this is something I wanted to get off my chest.

It seems like everyday in this forum there are about 5 new threads of people "stuck in a bootloop" or "stuck on Google screen." The majority of these people don't know the difference between adb and fastboot or bootloader and recovery.

I bought the G1 on launch and there weren't tool kits. We had to use telnet and command prompt to do everything manually. I knew nothing about linux or coding, but I followed instructions and learned what was happening when I entered these commands. Through owning the G1 and then moving on to the Nexus One I don't remember seeing so many threads about people "soft bricking" their device. I think the reason for this is the tool kits and other scripts that make it almost too easy to unlock and root your phone. While I respect the people who write these scripts (and I think they do serve a purpose in some situations) I think it's causing more harm than good.

The people who are using these scripts aren't learning what is actually happening when they press 1 on their keyboard. Boom, their phone is unlocked, su-binaries and cwm recovery installed. Then, they flash a rom without creating a nandroid. What happens if something goes wrong and they didn't place any safety nets to help them? They post a thread saying their phone is bricked. People take time out of their day to help these people out, but since the user doesn't understand what the helper is talking about, they can't fix it.

Just last weekend I spent 30 minutes replying to a PM with step by step instructions how to flash stock images and including links to files and resources. The person replied back. Instead of fixing his phone himself, he said he "claimed his phone as stolen and will be getting sent a new one lol". WTF?! Not only is that morally wrong, it's also insurance fraud. And we wonder why carriers and OEM's are trying as hard as they can to lock down non-nexus phones.

Please, take the time to learn how to get yourself out of a mess before you are in a mess.

Weigh in with your thoughts, criticisms or tl;dr comments.
Thanks.

EDIT 8/9/12: Link to efrant's Android Galaxy Nexus 101 guide. All the info you need to know. http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1812959

EDIT 11/14/12 My Thank you & Goodbye post.
 
Last edited:

phaze one

Senior Member
Jan 27, 2011
949
252
Seattle
I agree that it's lack of research that causes the problems. But don't knock the toolkits, they're designed for ease and they work perfectly with an understanding of what's going on. I can go thru adb and unlock and root because I researched the absolute **** out of it and know how to use adb but I used a toolkit. Like I said, if they don't want to research then bad on them. Gotta learn somehow be it by mistake or research. But the toolkits aren't the enemy.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
 
Last edited:

android01

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2010
311
81
Toronto
There's always a bigger fish. Like little man syndrome , be careful before you develop big man syndrome. " I'm taller than you "
PS even with research, " you can't fix stupid " so just let it go. A poor craftsman blames his tools. Simple as that.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
 

spywhite

Senior Member
Aug 10, 2011
91
6
www.youtube.com
Leaving good enough alone.

It's getting pretty comical when you see a "help me" post and before you even start reading the post you can correctly predict that the post will start something like this: "so I flashed *****'s custom ROM and now my phone's f****d".
 

adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
10,950
6,471
This thread is so full of #winning. The easy way is not always the best way.
 

SL1VR

Member
Nov 2, 2011
33
0
Muskoka
I used the manual methods for my Atrix so now after getting a good feel for Fastboot and ADB, the GNex Toolkit was really painless to use.

I understand what you're saying though. I guess some people just want easy routes to get what they want, completely scrolling past the giant red text that tells them exactly what could (and most likely will) happen.
 

Colemak

Senior Member
Dec 17, 2011
85
15
I agree that it's lack of research that causes the problems. But don't knock the toolkits, they're designed for ease and they work perfectly with an understanding of what's going on. I can go thru adb and unlock and root because I researched the absolute **** out of it and know how to use adb but I used a toolkit. Like I said, if they don't want to research then bad on them. Gotta learn somehow be it by mistake or research. But the toolkits aren't the enemy.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

I'm going to second this, as long as the toolkits are well documented (showing what they did where, and why it was done) they can save people time typing the commands and looking them up if they forget them.

It's very similar to creating a GUI front end for a program. If done properly they're nothing but useful and time saving.
 

mbh87

Senior Member
Jun 16, 2010
6,499
1,027
Idaho
Im guilty of using the wugfresh kit. I could have easily done everything myself, but it contained everything I needed.

I agree with pretty much everything you said though. I see people offering money for them to root their phone over team viewer, etc. Those are the same people that warranty their phone that they, themselves messed up.
 

El Daddy

Retired Forum Moderator
May 2, 2008
4,261
5,210
Roseville, MN
Thanks for your feedback everyone.

I just wanted to clarify I'm not ripping toolkits. They are a great way to get where you want to go quickly. If you know what you are doing by all means use it. But, to me it seems like they are just the cheat sheet to the test. Yeah, you aced the **** out of the test, but when asked to apply what you should have learned from that test in a real life situation; you are screwed.
 

adrynalyne

Inactive Recognized Developer
Dec 13, 2008
10,950
6,471
How to unlock, root, and be done with it.

adb reboot bootloader
fastboot oem unlock
fastboot reboot
adb reboot bootloader
fastboot flash recovery recovery.img (clockwork)
fastboot reboot
adb reboot recovery
flash rom
reboot
profit


Not hard at all.
 

El Daddy

Retired Forum Moderator
May 2, 2008
4,261
5,210
Roseville, MN
How to unlock, root, and be done with it.

adb reboot bootloader
fastboot oem unlock
fastboot reboot
adb reboot bootloader
fastboot flash recovery recovery.img (clockwork)
fastboot reboot
adb reboot recovery
flash rom
reboot
profit


Not hard at all.

Exactly.

Wouldn't it be sweet if there was actually "profit" and the phone started spitting out money?

You're a dev. See what you can cook up. :D
 
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tannor

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2010
235
15
The hardest part is just those drivers, not that I call it hard, just Windows can be a pita.

Once that part is working then using adb and fastboot comands I think is fairly straightforward and don't need the toolkit.
 
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rye&ginger

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2010
622
45
Vancouver
Im hardly experienced with Android or Linux. Ive used both for the past year or so only, and did take time to learn what abd commands there are etc. but also will use the toolkits to save time and headaches.


Anyways, its always like this. iOS hacking forums are similar.

Also, if you can get into recovery why do a nandroid? On SGS I was told by devs its not really needed as long as you dont mix up kernels. Do that, and what help is the nandroid? Cant flash it if you cant get into download mode. If you can, thats what stock images are for? I sync everything I really care about to cloud/PC.
 

youarewrong

Member
Dec 6, 2011
7
1
Toolkits for the nexus is kinda unnecessary because it is so easy to unlock, but there are devices that one the 1%(?) could unlock without a toolkit.

Sent from my HTC Desire HD using XDA App
 

skynet11

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2010
1,935
686
I
How to unlock, root, and be done with it.

adb reboot bootloader
fastboot oem unlock
fastboot reboot
adb reboot bootloader
fastboot flash recovery recovery.img (clockwork)
fastboot reboot
adb reboot recovery
flash rom
reboot
profit


Not hard at all.
One-click rooting on my Fascinate:

I used z4root to root my phone before I flashed my first ROM (back then I just used ROM Manager for everything and didn't even bother looking at the ROM threads on XDA until the late DJ05/DL09 days when I got used to flashing manually in Clockwork Recovery). With z4root I didn't even need to use my PC to root, but it didn't always work when I had to go back to stock.

One-click Odin pitfalls:

My first experience with Odin was using a one-click version to flash a stock Froyo leak on my Captivate when they had just started making custom ROMs for Froyo. I had a bad experience using one-click Odin so I soon learned how to manually use Odin to do much more than simply flash a Froyo leak with one click. I soon discovered that Odin could be used to do much more than simply going back to stock - I could flash different versions of Clockwork Recovery, different Captivate and Fascinate modems, etc.

Learning adb for myself:

When I got my Gnex I used the exact method adrynalyne posted, and I found it more gratifying than any one-click root (I got my Gnex before there even was a 1-click, and I had long gotten used to adb. There's actually a lot more you can do with adb than simply rooting. If you only use it for rooting it's like going to a four-star restaurant and always ordering the hot dog from the kids menu - you're barely scratching the surface of what adb can do. I highly recommend reading up on adb and learning the different commands you can use. For example, it got me out of a bootloop more than once on my Fascinate when I was running AOSP MTD ROMs (long before jt1134 made 3-button recovery work on them).

The tl;dr:

One-click methods actually hinder you from exploring your phone's full potential, and often do more harm than good. Learning to do things manually for yourself lets you discover other possibilities you never would have found with the one-clicks.

Terminators run on Android :cool:
 
Last edited:

hotleadsingerguy

Senior Member
Jan 12, 2010
925
173
There's always a bigger fish. Like little man syndrome , be careful before you develop big man syndrome. " I'm taller than you "
PS even with research, " you can't fix stupid " so just let it go. A poor craftsman blames his tools. Simple as that.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

You just used 5 rhetorical sayings that make very little sense, in the context of this topic. Be helpful or don't post, maybe?

OP, I couldn't agree more. Too many people post here (and other places) about being stuck in a bootloop even though they should already know how to fix it, if they knew anything about the process they had gone through. It's utterly insane that people are making heavy modifications to a device that costs $650+ without knowing *what* they're doing.

It's like someone going outside to change the oil on their car without knowing a thing about it and following the most basic instructions from some random person on the internet, then freaking out when someone tells them they poured the oil into the power steering reservoir.
 

case0

Senior Member
Feb 5, 2010
721
124
No-ones forcing you to help people who have screwed up their phone so I don't see the need to be all holier than thou about it. Why should people have to understand everything that goes on when they use a one-click method? People should just make sure they read the instructions so they don't screw things up. That's the problem, not the tools they use.
 

xyzulu

Senior Member
Jun 18, 2009
504
104
Sydney
xyzuluhosting.com
As has been stated before in this thread.. you can't stop the stupid, or protect people from their own stupidity.

After far too many years helping out "stupid" users (here and on other forums), unfortunately, I find it far better to pick and choose who I want to help these days. Then, if I get frustrated, I only have myself to blame.. for even responding in the first place.
 

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    I don't create threads on xda very often and 95% of my posts are me trying to help people out, but this is something I wanted to get off my chest.

    It seems like everyday in this forum there are about 5 new threads of people "stuck in a bootloop" or "stuck on Google screen." The majority of these people don't know the difference between adb and fastboot or bootloader and recovery.

    I bought the G1 on launch and there weren't tool kits. We had to use telnet and command prompt to do everything manually. I knew nothing about linux or coding, but I followed instructions and learned what was happening when I entered these commands. Through owning the G1 and then moving on to the Nexus One I don't remember seeing so many threads about people "soft bricking" their device. I think the reason for this is the tool kits and other scripts that make it almost too easy to unlock and root your phone. While I respect the people who write these scripts (and I think they do serve a purpose in some situations) I think it's causing more harm than good.

    The people who are using these scripts aren't learning what is actually happening when they press 1 on their keyboard. Boom, their phone is unlocked, su-binaries and cwm recovery installed. Then, they flash a rom without creating a nandroid. What happens if something goes wrong and they didn't place any safety nets to help them? They post a thread saying their phone is bricked. People take time out of their day to help these people out, but since the user doesn't understand what the helper is talking about, they can't fix it.

    Just last weekend I spent 30 minutes replying to a PM with step by step instructions how to flash stock images and including links to files and resources. The person replied back. Instead of fixing his phone himself, he said he "claimed his phone as stolen and will be getting sent a new one lol". WTF?! Not only is that morally wrong, it's also insurance fraud. And we wonder why carriers and OEM's are trying as hard as they can to lock down non-nexus phones.

    Please, take the time to learn how to get yourself out of a mess before you are in a mess.

    Weigh in with your thoughts, criticisms or tl;dr comments.
    Thanks.

    EDIT 8/9/12: Link to efrant's Android Galaxy Nexus 101 guide. All the info you need to know. http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=1812959

    EDIT 11/14/12 My Thank you & Goodbye post.
    19
    How to unlock, root, and be done with it.

    adb reboot bootloader
    fastboot oem unlock
    fastboot reboot
    adb reboot bootloader
    fastboot flash recovery recovery.img (clockwork)
    fastboot reboot
    adb reboot recovery
    flash rom
    reboot
    profit


    Not hard at all.
    18
    I agree that it's lack of research that causes the problems. But don't knock the toolkits, they're designed for ease and they work perfectly with an understanding of what's going on. I can go thru adb and unlock and root because I researched the absolute **** out of it and know how to use adb but I used a toolkit. Like I said, if they don't want to research then bad on them. Gotta learn somehow be it by mistake or research. But the toolkits aren't the enemy.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
    17
    Thank You!

    Hey Everyone,

    I'll be leaving the Galaxy Nexus forum in a few days when my Nexus 4 arrives. I just wanted to thank everyone for their continued support. Since writing this post I have seen a growing number of people try to nudge others to use the "manual" method of unlocking and tinkering with their phone. I've seen a vast improvement around here with more people using ADB/Fastboot instead of the Toolkits, less OMG ITZ BRIK'D! posts, and generally more people willing to help others in need. Frankly, it puts a smile on my face. :D

    I'm sure most of you, like myself, will be leaving here soon when you get a new device. I'd just like to ask you to show others there are alternatives to the simple methods like Toolkits and that there are safer, better, more educational ways to go about things. Link to this thread and some of the great guides eftant and Jubakuba have put together. I will be doing the same in the Nexus 4 forums. It will make XDA much better in the long run!

    Thanks again,

    El Daddy
    12
    Thanks for your feedback everyone.

    I just wanted to clarify I'm not ripping toolkits. They are a great way to get where you want to go quickly. If you know what you are doing by all means use it. But, to me it seems like they are just the cheat sheet to the test. Yeah, you aced the **** out of the test, but when asked to apply what you should have learned from that test in a real life situation; you are screwed.