How does WiFi-Tethering work and how do carriers detect it?

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McDV

Senior Member
May 26, 2008
326
112
Hi!

In german boards there are several speculations about how the N1's WiFi tethering works and how carriers might detect it. But there are no real facts, it seems like there is no one, who really knows about it.

Maybe here are some kind of "cracks", who really know what they are talking about and can provide some real information about it.

How does N1-tethering work? I guess it uses NAT-routing. Is this right? And the probably most important part: How do carriers detect tethering? They officially claim, they could detect it. But the question is, which way do they do this? Can they only detect if you use tethering at all, or do they also have the ability to separate between tethered data and phone's data? Only in that case they would be capable to bill the tethered data (here in Germany some carriers do not prohibit tethering, they can only charge about 50 cent per MB).

Is it possible, that the carrier only detect several devices, that connect to the internet using tethering? I'm a vodafone-customer and I've tried tethering my iPad and my Linux-Netbook several times. Nothing has been charged. Other customers, having the same data-plan, reported, that they habe been charged for tethering within minutes.

Maybe someone can answer my questions. :)
 
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McDV

Senior Member
May 26, 2008
326
112
If it really is like that, then I would just have to use Cisco-VPN on my iPad and they would not be able to read any requests anymore.

But someone in the official German vodafone-board said, the user-agent doesn't matter. And he seemed to be very sure about that. But unfortunately he didn't tell anything else. If you think of Dolphin for Android, which allows you to change the browser-identification, it really looks like this is nothing the carrier could make use of.
 

GldRush98

Senior Member
Jun 3, 2006
2,309
338
Taylorville, IL.
www.GldRush98.com
I dont know how it works but "I would imagine the request headers are what the provider is reading in order to determine the device/browser that is making the request."

http://talk.maemo.org/archive/index.php/t-3757.html

I don't believe this to be accurate as phones are capable of changing their user agent to mimic a desktop browser, so it wouldn't be a reliable way of identifying a tethered connection.
IMO, there is no 100% fool proof way as it sits. The carrier can look at the traffic patterns though and might be able to figure it out though. Remember when you're connected to your carrier everything you do is going through their gateway, so they can see everything you're doing.
I agree that if you're wanting to make 100% sure they don't know, a VPN tunneling traffic would work. Once the traffic is encrypted, they have no way to tell what is happening, aside from the actual amount of data being transferred, which is why a lot of carriers in the USA or switching away from unlimited data plans and offering only limited ones (i.e. a 2gb or 5gb limit on plans).
 

Jack_R1

Senior Member
Aug 9, 2009
4,362
964
It was discussed here a couple of months ago, I remember..
The discussion ended in - if the phone specifically didn't send the carrier any sign that it's tethering, detection of tethering would require heuristic scan patterns on the data that's being transferred - and would violate some "internet openness" rules in the process, and possibly allow a legal case against the carrier.

So, do you by any chance have custom ROM and your friends have official carrier ROMs? That might explain the difference.
 

jcar87

Member
Jun 19, 2009
23
0
People in spain have reported being charged more by vodafone (they charge you more if you tether and your plan doesnt cover it) by simply using an app on the phone that changed the browser's user agent to mimic a desktop one.

I dont know whether it is or it isnt legal to read the 'headers' of HTTP messages. It's more to do with the protocol than with the content, and both ends need to be able to read these things to actually work, some routers may even scoop just to adjust to different QoS patterns or whatever. So it might be legal after all.
 

McDV

Senior Member
May 26, 2008
326
112
Ok, to find out more I've made a little research about how to generally detect Network Address Translation and I've made some tests.

As it seems, the Browser-Identification won't work. Maybe in spain there are some data-plans which only allow browsing with the special phone's browser and only using HTTP-Connections. But that's not suitable for a real data plan, which allows you, to send every data you like from your phone. On the other hand, at least in Germany, I think they wouldn't be allowed to read the data content of TCP-packets.

Then I've used a packet sniffer to find out, how different devices (N1, iPad and Kubuntu10.04) handle things like outgoing ports and packet IDs.
Both won't be very likely to use by the carrier, because Android doesn't increment them, but uses it by shuffle. The iPad also shuffles the packet IDs, but increments the ports. I think this will not matter, because the NAT will redirect the ports anyway. Only Kubuntu increments packet IDs and as they normally aren't changed by NAT, carriers could detect that. In general, all of the devices used outgoing ports between 35,000 and 55,000.

Possibly they could look at the time to live of the packets. The interesting question is, how the N1's NAT handels the TTL. Normally, a router decrements the TTL by 1. But it doesn't have to.
All of my tested devices use a TTL of 64 for outgoing packets (no one will wonder about that, because all those system are based on UNIX or Linux). So, if the NAT decrements the TTL, the carrier could detect tethered packets quite easily. Normal packets would reach the carrier's gateway with TTL 64, tethered packets with TTL 63. Maybe, the NAT doesn't decrement the TTL. Then the carrier wouldn't be able to detect it this way, except of this: As I read, Windows-Systems use a TTL of 128, so the carrier ould detect this immediately, no matter if it's decremented or not. This would explain why some people tell they could tether other phones without being billed, but getting charged when tethering their PC. This could only be covered, if the NAT would rewrite the TTL with 64. It don't think it does.

Maybe someone, who has a rooted phone (mine is not rooted, it's a normal FRF91), could install packet sniffer from the market and then catch some packets while tethering. Then we could have a look at the packet's headers and maybe find out, what the NAT does with the TTL.
 

dan1431

Senior Member
Nov 25, 2006
252
28
My understanding is that tethering (WiFi/USB) can be accomplished in two different fashions.

1) The phone (in this case the Nexus One) acts as the modem and router and re-requests whatever the tethered device requested. Thus, the mobile operator sees the Nexus One as using the DATA rather than the actual device requesting the DATA.

2) The phone simply passes the requests to mobile operator along with some identifying info about the requesting device. (the preferred method by the mobile operators)

I have no idea which method the Nexus One (FroYo) employs, but I have a suspicion that it is method 1.

Dan
 

mofoliar

Senior Member
Jun 5, 2007
265
11
Paradise,CA
i Will say it does work as a wifi hotspot, so i connected using my ipad up to the ssid the nexus made, and connected fine, but un sure if charges will appear, i will keep a eye out on my next bill.. but they dont detect then that saves me $25/mon for the 3g data, if i can just use my phone $30 unlimited..
 

unknownrebelx

Senior Member
Feb 23, 2008
174
7
Long Beach
I was wondering about this as well. I have the current $25/mo 2gb plan and I sometimes need to use my laptop to check things that I need a larger screen for (Mostly graphic design attachments like illustrator and photoshop files). Would AT&T detect my using the Nexus One as a hotspot, and if so, would they charge?

I think the whole tethering thing is kind of ridiculous on AT&T. You're paying an extra $20+ per month to use the data you're already paying for except on your computer. They've been dealing with Apple for far too long...:mad:
 
Feb 13, 2010
35
0
Ascot
In UK 3 know I'm tethering...

On using my Laptop tethered I get a 3 splash screen on first opening up a browser (IE or Firefox). There don't seem to be any other issues (everything else then works fine & dandy) ... yet...

Can't be that long before some carrier decides to clamp down on tethering some more...

Lodger
 

Jack_R1

Senior Member
Aug 9, 2009
4,362
964
In UK 3 know I'm tethering...

On using my Laptop tethered I get a 3 splash screen on first opening up a browser (IE or Firefox). There don't seem to be any other issues (everything else then works fine & dandy) ... yet...

Can't be that long before some carrier decides to clamp down on tethering some more...

Lodger

Nexus bought from their network? Rooted? What ROM?
 

subvecto

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2008
117
1
The only viable (and probably legal) way for an operator to detech tethering is via looking data consumptions, other methods discussed over here although technically possible, would be administratively expensive even if legally allowed... I suggest if you are on an unlimited data plan and want to be heavy on tethering do it from the start not later on in order not to raise any flags on the operator side.

Cheers, sub

Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
 

noiz7

Senior Member
Jun 4, 2010
52
1
Washington DC
I was wondering about this as well. I have the current $25/mo 2gb plan and I sometimes need to use my laptop to check things that I need a larger screen for (Mostly graphic design attachments like illustrator and photoshop files). Would AT&T detect my using the Nexus One as a hotspot, and if so, would they charge?

I think the whole tethering thing is kind of ridiculous on AT&T. You're paying an extra $20+ per month to use the data you're already paying for except on your computer. They've been dealing with Apple for far too long...:mad:

I've been using my N1 on AT&T to tether a pretty good amount and had no complaints. I even stream netflix movies and haven't heard a word.
 

aaronrockies

New member
May 10, 2011
1
0
obviously our phones send and receive data over wifi. when tethering, the phone is still sending and receiving data over wifi, it's just connecting to another device. not to be rude but it is a pretty easy concept. it is an amazing thing though.

right now i am on a camping trip, and i of course brought my phone and laptop with me so i have been tethering a bit. i just happened to be in an area with fantastic signal strength and speedtest.net shows that i am getting up to 2.5Mbps down, and about 1Mbps or so up. it's working GREAT! it's still not cable or fios fast, but it's fast.
 

luke2020

Member
Nov 8, 2009
16
0
Tethering on Talkmobile

I've recently get an unlimited data Talkmobile contract (UK) and I'm thinking of tethering (it's against T&Cs). Has anyone else done this? If they don't detect it, it's a great deal at only £12 month (though the unlimited deal which I have got is no longer available).
I was thinking, the mentioned methods of detecting tethering, even if they are viable and legal, might not be enough for the operators to prove that I was tethering, and hence they couldn't legally do anything about it. I don't know if this is the case or not (but I think I'll choose to believe that).
If I can tether, it means I can buy the PS Vita WiFi only and have as much connectivity as the 3G version!
 

mattanonymous

Member
May 14, 2010
23
5
Sounds like a good project for this weekend. I'll do some packet sniffing and post if I find anything. TMO in US, though.
 

Peelypeel

Senior Member
Jul 27, 2010
66
2
would the carrier (Three in the uk) be able to detect tethering if i connected my phone to a vpn. because then surely all data would look identical?

HTC Desire, cm7.1
 

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    ive been on 3uk for a couple of months (all you can eat data). mainly tethering and averaging over 1gb download a day (also done a lot of upload for cloud storage). not detected that i know of

    when i was in an o2 store i asked about tethering they they said its [unofficialy] fine to do as they cant detect it

    samsung galaxy s2 (mainly wifi tethering, but also usb tethering)
    windows 7
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    First, doesn't the http request header include o/s information, such as
    User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7; rv:12.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/12.0

    Checking the user-agent request from my phone (prime) i always get some flavor of unix, never mac or windows - matter what user agent i tell my phone's browser to use. Telltale number 1.

    Also, there aren't any systems today that aren't checking in to specific IP's for autoupdate, eg. windows update, ms office update, adobe update, etc etc. These are all ip addresses your cell phone would never go. I would think it would be fairly easy for any carrier to flag these update sites and detect tethering immediately! Telltale number 2.

    I am sure there are a large number of things your windows or mac system does on a regular basis that your phone just won't ever, ever do - and reaching out to those update sites is just one of them. If you have ever setup your firewall to restrict all outgoing connections, you would very quickly start getting blocked messages from a myriad of apps calling home..... and they start adding up pretty quickly. Just turn your desktop or laptop on and let it sit there. It will start connecting to servers all over the place and in pretty rapid succession. Your phone just doesn't do that.