Windows 8 sucks for desktops....

theangi · Feb 23, 2012

In my opinion Metro will be very useful mostly because of the search feature. Now if I want to open any application I just have to press the windows key and type the first 2/3 letters and hit enter, in a nicer view and faster than w7. The fist week it was... unusual, but now after some month of daily use I can say that's very nice. And for those who can't handle it, it could be disabled so it's like using w7 with ribbon interface in every window. ;-)

Sent from my Nokia 3310

deth4uall · Feb 23, 2012

Windows is just trying to be mac again, and look what they did last time they did that? Windows Vista. It is fast and good to use, IF you don't have to use the horrid Metro start menu. If they were to get multi touch trackpads like macbooks I would say that I would definitely look into it further but I tested it out and wasn't impressed like I thought I would be.

link68759 · Feb 23, 2012

I'm apprehensive to keep replying to this thread, because of the blind hatred that is almost always accompanied with a painful amount of ignorance... and any comment I make is quickly buried by more blather. Yet, here I am again. I guess I just can't muster the strength to resist correcting wrongs on the internet. Oh well, maybe I'll learn with time.

I read on one of microsoft's developer blogs that the metro start menu is fullscreen primarily because it allows you to visualize what you have access to. It's also finger friendly, and a whole lot better than 7's start menu that is confined to that little box (XP's was better because it allowed the box to expand across the screen). This makes sense. You should be happy that they are making the start menu more efficient, stop whining.

About tiles; a lot of the people in this thread seem to think that the introduction of tiles equals less user control, or dumbing down the system. Where do you get that idea? Adding a UI layer does not dumb down the whole OS, as it does not change anything about it OS; it is an entirely new UI that doesn't really replace any functionality. If you try to argue that the metro UI as replacing the pinnable area in the 7 start menu, then this is much an improvement: the pins update to give you information without you having to open whatever it launches.

I personally hate widgets; I want to use them because I love the idea of getting information on my desktop, but they cover my wallpaper which I like to have a clear view of. Tiles are perfect; no stupid UI or complex themes, no round edges that don't fit together. Information that's nice and neat, that is a separate UI element from the desktop, so my wallpaper isn't covered. I like it.
I have previously mentioned that the biggest reason people hate live tiles is because they don't know how to use them, or how to properly embrace the system. These would be the people who shut their ears and shout nonsense at the first sign of change. It's incredibly annoying, would you stop?

The only valid arguments against tiles are the ones that point out the inefficient text size. Yes, it could stand to get customizable text sizes and perhaps a few tweaks to accommodate more text information (though I can appreciate that the reasons for the limits; this is supposed to be a preview of content, not the entirety of the content, and we shouldn't start asking for entire articles or books to scroll through tile previews). I believe that these updates are coming, however, on both desktop and WP8, so have patience; there is no reason to spew hate on a work in progress, this is only counter productive. One of the reasons I got WP7 was so that I could follow the development of a new technology. It's quite exciting to see something grow and mature

I know that the 360 has a raging preteen fanboy base, but I really don't want to find out that this also applies to Windows desktop. Go bring your fanboyisms to Mac, or linux if you prefer (though I also like to think the *NIX community is populated by professional bearded developers)

Speaking of the 360, I have not heard any mass complaints over the metro UI overhaul. Contrarily, it seems to be positively received almost universally.

Abuuu · Feb 23, 2012

Windows 7 is good enough, ppl are still using xp and dont want to change.

Strike_Eagle · Feb 23, 2012

link68759 said:
I'm apprehensive to keep replying to this thread, because of the blind hatred that is almost always accompanied with a painful amount of ignorance... and any comment I make is quickly buried by more blather. Yet, here I am again. I guess I just can't muster the strength to resist correcting wrongs on the internet. Oh well, maybe I'll learn with time.

I read on one of microsoft's developer blogs that the metro start menu is fullscreen primarily because it allows you to visualize what you have access to. It's also finger friendly, and a whole lot better than 7's start menu that is confined to that little box (XP's was better because it allowed the box to expand across the screen). This makes sense. You should be happy that they are making the start menu more efficient, stop whining.

About tiles; a lot of the people in this thread seem to think that the introduction of tiles equals less user control, or dumbing down the system. Where do you get that idea? Adding a UI layer does not dumb down the whole OS, as it does not change anything about it OS; it is an entirely new UI that doesn't really replace any functionality. If you try to argue that the metro UI as replacing the pinnable area in the 7 start menu, then this is much an improvement: the pins update to give you information without you having to open whatever it launches.

I personally hate widgets; I want to use them because I love the idea of getting information on my desktop, but they cover my wallpaper which I like to have a clear view of. Tiles are perfect; no stupid UI or complex themes, no round edges that don't fit together. Information that's nice and neat, that is a separate UI element from the desktop, so my wallpaper isn't covered. I like it.
I have previously mentioned that the biggest reason people hate live tiles is because they don't know how to use them, or how to properly embrace the system. These would be the people who shut their ears and shout nonsense at the first sign of change. It's incredibly annoying, would you stop?

The only valid arguments against tiles are the ones that point out the inefficient text size. Yes, it could stand to get customizable text sizes and perhaps a few tweaks to accommodate more text information (though I can appreciate that the reasons for the limits; this is supposed to be a preview of content, not the entirety of the content, and we shouldn't start asking for entire articles or books to scroll through tile previews). I believe that these updates are coming, however, on both desktop and WP8, so have patience; there is no reason to spew hate on a work in progress, this is only counter productive. One of the reasons I got WP7 was so that I could follow the development of a new technology. It's quite exciting to see something grow and mature

I know that the 360 has a raging preteen fanboy base, but I really don't want to find out that this also applies to Windows desktop. Go bring your fanboyisms to Mac, or linux if you prefer (though I also like to think the *NIX community is populated by professional bearded developers)

Speaking of the 360, I have not heard any mass complaints over the metro UI overhaul. Contrarily, it seems to be positively received almost universally.

Well said. Cover pretty much what i think about Windows 8 and Metro.
Also have a good point on pointing abou the idea bout using the widgets without having them covered up our wallpaper, i have never thought about it.

Seketh · Feb 23, 2012

Strike_Eagle said:
Well said. Cover pretty much what i think about Windows 8 and Metro.
Also have a good point on pointing abou the idea bout using the widgets without having them covered up our wallpaper, i have never thought about it.

I usually use that argument against Android. If they want to have even half the information a Windows Phone user gets, they have to fill their screen with widgets, which ends up becoming a wallpaper with random stuff on top.

On Metro, you have the information right there, and the different tiles are your "wallpaper".

telep · Feb 24, 2012

I tought that we are talking about pc os not phones, so i dont understand why you bring android. My desktop looks like this and i dont need stupid blocks on my desktop to show me twitter and facebook updates. They could make some pop up window for notifications like on osx not to take my whole screen, plus u dont use pc for same stuff like phones, because pc is for doing serious stuff, i think that biggiest fail of win8 is that is dummbed down to look like phone os.

Strike_Eagle · Feb 24, 2012

telep said:
I have to say that i fu....g hate metro UI, its fugly. Its fugly on phones, its fugly on tablets its fugly on whatever you put it on.

Because this is what you said. And No, it could be your taste is different, but Sale of Windows Phone is going up.

ohgood · Feb 24, 2012

Strike_Eagle said:
Because this is what you said. And No, it could be your taste is different, but Sale of Windows Phone is going up.

Were there sales numbers released by microsoft ?

I've seen percentages of growth claimed, but never a number of units from an official source. Please link !

Strike_Eagle · Feb 24, 2012

ohgood said:
Were there sales numbers released by microsoft ?

I've seen percentages of growth claimed, but never a number of units from an official source. Please link !

They never actually release a chart.
But they announced that both during MIX 2012 (last year) and During CES Also.
There is an article that Nokia makes a jump in Finland after Lumia was released.

Award Tour · Feb 24, 2012

I fully expect two things to happen between now and the retail release:

1. Touchpad gestures, think edge swiping for app switching, etc.

2. A avalanche of touch enabled mouses like the Microsoft Touch Mouse. If you ever used it, you know that it could handle a lot of the gestures in W8 really well.

I of course ball so I got three displays, two 1080p's stacked vertically, Envy 17" 3D (SB i7, 16GB, 120 SSD + 1TB HDD) display on top and the bottom one being a 23" touch display plus a 24" 1920x1200 to the side titled in portrait used mostly for design purposes. A slim keyboard on a sliding tray with a MS touch mouse next to it, plus a Wacom pen/multi-touch tablet next to the touch screen. I'm ready for Windows 8. I have an overkill of input devices but I bet 1 of them would seal a great W8 desktop experience.

link68759 · Feb 24, 2012

Seketh said:
I usually use that argument against Android. If they want to have even half the information a Windows Phone user gets, they have to fill their screen with widgets, which ends up becoming a wallpaper with random stuff on top.

On Metro, you have the information right there, and the different tiles are your "wallpaper".

Well on windows phone, the untampered "wallpaper" is the lockscreen picture

Arguably available on android as well, though not vanilla and probably not stock, I forget if sense brought over that feature from WinMo.

telep said:
I tought that we are talking about pc os not phones, so i dont understand why you bring android. My desktop looks like this and i dont need stupid blocks on my desktop to show me twitter and facebook updates. They could make some pop up window for notifications like on osx not to take my whole screen, plus u dont use pc for same stuff like phones, because pc is for doing serious stuff, i think that biggiest fail of win8 is that is dummbed down to look like phone os.

Here is a prime example of the ignorant hate poster I was talking about. What's dumb about live tiles? Why is a particularly exemplary system considered 'dumb' just because it was on a phone first? Also, read my last post, I think you'll find that rather enlightening.
Also, judging by your picture you wish you had a mac don't you? Go get one, there is plenty of room in the Apple community for people such as yourself.

Rather than attacking your obvious "the world revolves around me" approach to this, I'll address something that will benefit others reading this: you have missed the entire point of tiles. A popup notification demands your attention and distracts you from your current work. You might ignore it and get to it later, but nonetheless it still distracted you for a second; something that is very detrimental to a productive workflow. You might not be able to appreciate the significance of this yet, but trust me, it's important. If you don't check the notification right away, you might forget about it entirely... experiences vary per person obviously, but the fact of the matter is that most people will respond in some way to an active notification, completely forget about them, or be unable to focus on what they were previously working with because the unanswered notification is looming over the back of their mind.

Live tiles on the other hand are rather passive in function. You must consciously choose to look at them; the information is aggregated on one place, spread out in a wide, easily accessible format. The notifications in tiles aren't going anywhere, and you aren't notified the moment they arrive. Thus you may work in peace, uninterrupted. Time permitting, you can then check a whole number of notifications in one slot of time rather than at random points in time in your use of the computer. What I'm trying to get at here is that the human mind is bad at multitasking; it generally detracts from performance, and regular popup notifications divide your concentration. Tiles are an elegant answer to incoming data that doesn't necessarily demand your immediate attention (an instant message would perhaps warrant a regular notification for example, since people expect you to reply in a timely fashion). This is why I love windows phone; I get more done in less time, since I'm not constantly pulling out and putting away my phone for each and every individual notification. Moreover, this practice saves battery life.

This passive system isn't entirely new or unfamiliar; I'm sure users of IRC will appreciate the fact that you don't get notified for every message unless someone explicitly wants you to be notified. I generally prefer IRC because of this... I can segment work and periodically enter conversations, rather than the back and forth demand of regular messaging clients.

benjoid · Feb 24, 2012

Maybe it wouldn't be so butt ugly if they allowed you to have a wallpaper and semi-transparent tiles.

Sent from my SK17i using Tapatalk

Award Tour · Feb 24, 2012

link68759 said:
Well on windows phone, the untampered "wallpaper" is the lockscreen picture
Arguably available on android as well, though not vanilla and probably not stock, I forget if sense brought over that feature from WinMo.

Here is a prime example of the ignorant hate poster I was talking about. What's dumb about live tiles? Why is a particularly exemplary system considered 'dumb' just because it was on a phone first? Also, read my last post, I think you'll find that rather enlightening.
Also, judging by your picture you wish you had a mac don't you? Go get one, there is plenty of room in the Apple community for people such as yourself.

Rather than attacking your obvious "the world revolves around me" approach to this, I'll address something that will benefit others reading this: you have missed the entire point of tiles. A popup notification demands your attention and distracts you from your current work. You might ignore it and get to it later, but nonetheless it still distracted you for a second; something that is very detrimental to a productive workflow. You might not be able to appreciate the significance of this yet, but trust me, it's important. If you don't check the notification right away, you might forget about it entirely... experiences vary per person obviously, but the fact of the matter is that most people will respond in some way to an active notification, completely forget about them, or be unable to focus on what they were previously working with because the unanswered notification is looming over the back of their mind.

Live tiles on the other hand are rather passive in function. You must consciously choose to look at them; the information is aggregated on one place, spread out in a wide, easily accessible format. The notifications in tiles aren't going anywhere, and you aren't notified the moment they arrive. Thus you may work in peace, uninterrupted. Time permitting, you can then check a whole number of notifications in one slot of time rather than at random points in time in your use of the computer. What I'm trying to get at here is that the human mind is bad at multitasking; it generally detracts from performance, and regular popup notifications divide your concentration. Tiles are an elegant answer to incoming data that doesn't necessarily demand your immediate attention (an instant message would perhaps warrant a regular notification for example, since people expect you to reply in a timely fashion). This is why I love windows phone; I get more done in less time, since I'm not constantly pulling out and putting away my phone for each and every individual notification. Moreover, this practice saves battery life.

This passive system isn't entirely new or unfamiliar; I'm sure users of IRC will appreciate the fact that you don't get notified for every message unless someone explicitly wants you to be notified. I generally prefer IRC because of this... I can segment work and periodically enter conversations, rather than the back and forth demand of regular messaging clients.

The funny thing is that his desktop is much uglier than Metro. Plus he'll probably be able to keep the same ugly desktop in Windows 8 if he wants. Metro is just a touch launcher plus a new ecosystem of apps.

telep · Feb 24, 2012

And how do i use touch launcher on my laptop and desktop? You find this nice and beautiful? Where do you see wall here, wall will be cluttered with block, only 30 % is wisible.

Award Tour · Feb 24, 2012

telep said:
And how do i use touch launcher on my laptop and desktop? You find this nice and beautiful? Where do you see wall here, wall will be cluttered with block, only 30 % is wisible.

1. The dockbar only fits a handful of shortcuts. This fits more even in the limited "first look" viewing area. Plus the dock STILL exists.

2. The old startmenu was a maze of non visible sub menus. This is more simple.

3. Desktop can be cluttered and doesn't provide anywhere near as much context as the metro start page.

4. Start keyboard key > type out application name. The fastest way to do things.

link68759 · Feb 24, 2012

benjoid said:
Maybe it wouldn't be so butt ugly if they allowed you to have a wallpaper and semi-transparent tiles.

Sent from my SK17i using Tapatalk

I bet you that'll be the first third party customization metro receives; transparency over your desktop, or maybe set a custom picture and transparency over that. Don't forget Windows operating systems get a LOT of 3rd party customizations and tweaks.

telep said:
And how do i use touch launcher on my laptop and desktop? You find this nice and beautiful? Where do you see wall here, wall will be cluttered with block, only 30 % is wisible.

Have you tried the developer preview yet? I'm starting to think you just looked at a picture and are now talking your mouth off without A) having tried it and B) knowing anything about how it works.

You start out in the metro screen, and you can press the windows key to switch to the regular explorer desktop. This is where your wallpaper is, it is 100% visible... it is the same old desktop from every iteration of windows; that's not going away. I don't think you read my earlier post like I told you to: I explicitly stated that metro is an additional feature that does not replace any previous feature from 7. Since it doesn't replace anything and only *adds* to the operating system, you cannot logically say the system is "dumbed down" since no previous feature has been removed to make for the one you happen to dislike.
So on a laptop or desktop computer, you will spend 90% of your time in the explorer desktop interface, since that is what normal programs use, and what normal programs will continue to use. Now, you can press the windows key at any time to bring up the live tiles, look over them, poke around a few "apps", etc. On a tablet or one of those newfangled touch laptops they showed off on CES, you'll probably be spending more time in the metro interface with the apps instead of on the desktop part with programs because it's touch friendly and the laptop is meant to be portable.

Like Award Tour said, you can just start typing and it will switch to an app list view (which is just the start menu shortcuts, not live tiles), and select/launch whatever you type. This is identical to the behavior of the 7 start menu, so no they did not remove the start menu's search function. Also this is one of the things I was talking about when I said it was easier to visualize what you have installed; in this app list view (again this is where you see the shortcuts of programs installed that get sent to the start menu), the entries are fullscreen, and larger than in 7; you can both see more of them at a time and you can quickly get at the one you want with either a finger or a mouse. I personally hate 7's start menu... they made it so visually cluttered you were forced to use the search feature and it was a hassle to just view what was installed... easier to just go look at the 'add or remove programs'.

Strike_Eagle · Feb 24, 2012

telep said:
And how do i use touch launcher on my laptop and desktop? You find this nice and beautiful? Where do you see wall here, wall will be cluttered with block, only 30 % is wisible.
]

You fail.
What you were looking at, was the Start Menu of Windows 8, don't try to be smart when you haven't actually used it yet.

telep · Feb 24, 2012

No you fail, i know that i can use standard desktop, but he said that metro is touch launcher, so my question is how to use "touch launcher" on desktop and why is that important on desktop pc (i know i can use mouse)?

Im done, because you are a WP7 fan and you defend metro because you like it , on the other hand i dont. For you metro is something good for me it is totally opposit, and i will use classic desktop if they dont lock that option in final build.

Strike_Eagle · Feb 24, 2012

telep said:
No you fail, i know that i can use standard desktop, but he said that metro is touch launcher, so my question is how to use "touch launcher" on desktop and why is that important on desktop pc (i know i can use mouse)?

Im done, because you are a WP7 fan and you defend metro because you like it , on the other hand i dont. For you metro is something good for me it is totally opposit, and i will use classic desktop if they dont lock that option in final build.

I have said that thing like multiple times.
It is your OP, i don't blame it. Everybody has different tastes. But don't think that the world circle around you.
I have my own OP about other OS, but i am not a hater , i don't go to other forums and post bad stuffs about it.

PS: Everyone, Socialite now is usable ( but need to be hacked a little bit)

Windows 8 sucks for desktops....

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