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[GUIDE]Definitive guide to Windows 8 on ARM

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dazza9075
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RT is OEM only, confirmed
 
xsoliman3
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More on managing WOA (Windows RT) in a corporate environment, even though it can't be domain joined

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...uding-woa.aspx
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xsoliman3 View Post
More on managing WOA (Windows RT) in a corporate environment, even though it can't be domain joined

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...uding-woa.aspx
I have to say im starting to understand the ARM development a bit more after reading that.

I still think x86 is the way to go for a fully functional tablet (at least for me) but if the price is right on these arm units then I think there will be some serious thought going in to buying them
 
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Originally Posted by dazza9075 View Post
I have to say im starting to understand the ARM development a bit more after reading that.

I still think x86 is the way to go for a fully functional tablet (at least for me) but if the price is right on these arm units then I think there will be some serious thought going in to buying them
x86 models would def go for a higher price because you would be able to run all Windows 8 Desktop software unlike on WinRT.

The main difference will be battery life and processing juice.

Anyways, I think Microsoft should give less options for the Windows 8 tablets and provide more support for the hardware.

 
Rakeesh_j
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(Last edited by Rakeesh_j; 1st May 2012 at 06:50 AM.)
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Originally Posted by xsoliman3 View Post
Running x86 apps on Windows ARM – not possible or v unlikely. Microsoft have not definitely confirmed that there wont be any x86 emulator, but unlikely in the limited space available

Maybe we will see a 3rd party Virtual Box or Boschs or similar to emulate x86 and some intercept dll’s to thunk the api calls to the relevant native ARM windows dll’s))
Not gonna happen. x86 is complex instruction set, ARM is reduced instruction set. Emulating ARM on x86 can be done with somewhat reasonable speed if you have a fast processor, but x86 on ARM is probably going to be ridiculously slow. ARM is more efficient, so clock for clock you get better speed with lower power requirements, but emulating CISC from RISC is ****ty.

As far as WINE style API hook intercepting, that is a real crapshoot because many apps do have some bits of assembly in there.

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Originally Posted by xsoliman3 View Post
Will it run WP7 apps ? (Silverlight / processor neutral apps) – unknown, but should be easy to port
http://news.softpedia.com/news/Port-...8-232615.shtml
Anything that runs on the .Net platform should work in win8 ARM assuming that windows 8 includes the .net framework.

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Originally Posted by dazza9075 View Post
I have to say im starting to understand the ARM development a bit more after reading that.

I still think x86 is the way to go for a fully functional tablet (at least for me) but if the price is right on these arm units then I think there will be some serious thought going in to buying them
I disagree, ARM is far more practical for mobile applications due to it's massive energy efficiency advantage over x86.

Besides, as of yet there are no x86 based SoC's, it's all separate IC's, which reduces the energy efficiency even further. Intel has Medfield coming up, but I wouldn't count on that including a decent GPU.
 
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Originally Posted by Rakeesh_j View Post
Anything that runs on the .Net platform should work in win8 ARM assuming that windows 8 includes the .net framework.
Windows Phone uses the .Net Compact Framework, special version of the Silverlight, XNA and some phone-specific assemblies. It won't start on the desktop .Net, because it uses a different set of the assemblies, not saying that it uses a different CLR (especially the garbage collector).
But microsoft can write a special "layer" which will allow to run WP7 apps, but why is it needed? There is lots of crap in the marketplace.
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michiganenginerd
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Originally Posted by Rakeesh_j View Post
Anything that runs on the .Net platform should work in win8 ARM assuming that windows 8 includes the .net framework.
You can write applications in .NET for WinRT, but they don't actually run in the CLR as we think of it today.

Best way to explain is to look at the linked image.
http://i.zdnet.com/blogs/davidburela.png


Think of the Green as what works on WinRT that you can purchase and install. (Things in blue on WinRT, cannot be sideloaded since you can only install from the store which sells Metro apps).

What is happening is the application you write in .NET, instead of going to IL to be run in a .NET CLR, is being sent to WinRT for execution.

Better explanation here:
http://csharperimage.jeremylikness.c...e-and-clr.html

Would it be possible for a light CLR to be written in ARM for .NET apps to execute against, probably. But at this time, your .NET appears to be executed by WinRT. This means you get a subset of .NET that can execute on Windows 8 ARM as a METRO app being interpreted by WINRT.
 
xsoliman3
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Default No sideloading of arm desktop apps

Just to re-iterate a point from the above post

As per the recent complaints by firefox etc, even if you build a standard aka desktop app and compile for ARM, you will not be able to deploy it as not signed
(and no side loading of desktop apps)

Might? be able to pursuade the Microsoft store to host it, as they will host deskop apps for Windows8, but not sure if they will allow desktop apps for WIndows 8 on ARM (Windows RT)

ALso unclear if ENterprise customers can have their own private app store for their corporate apps


Side loading of Metro apps on Windows RT is also unclear
Can get them from the store (signed) but again doesnt seem to be able to side load them ?
to be confirmed
 
xsoliman3
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Default Windows 8 diet exposes Microsoft's weak ARM

Windows 8 diet exposes Microsoft's weak ARM

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/04...age_confusion/

Good article comparing WIndows8 on x86/x64 to Windows RT on ARM
and the enevitable confusion
 
michiganenginerd
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Originally Posted by xsoliman3 View Post
Just to re-iterate a point from the above post
Also unclear if ENterprise customers can have their own private app store for their corporate apps

Side loading of Metro apps on Windows RT is also unclear
Can get them from the store (signed) but again doesnt seem to be able to side load them ?
to be confirmed
These questions are answered here:

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/windowsstore...usinesses.aspx

To Sideload:
  • You need to sign an application with a cert the machine trusts. (Can be your own cert, if you add it to cert store.)
  • Set 'Allow all trusted apps to install' in group policy or registry
  • Then either use a machine that is domain joined, or activate a special product key by using a script on the target machine to enable sideloading.
This will allow you to install via a variety of methods listed in the article.

While no 'private app store' has been listed, creating your own, would just be a quick website, that drops install requests in a queue, that are then executed by sccm or another deployment agent. On x86, you could create a background process to do it if you don't have a domain and a deployment agent.

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