[Q] i717R + CM9 + Fido = no VOIP!!!

esokolov · Aug 16, 2012

Folks, please give me a hand!

I have the Note from Rogers Canada, upgraded to CM9 release, my provider is Fido, and I'm struggling with getting VoIP work over 3G.

1. Native ICS client. It's OK on WiFi, and on 3G the call is being established in and out, but no sound either direction. I heard 3G calling was blocked in GB client, and there was even a method tweaking the APK to make it work, but obviously something is very different in ICS - that tweak is not applicable - I can't find proper file in this APK.

2. cSipSimple - does not work at all, makes the phone acting weird. Well, last update was in 2011, maybe not compatible with ICS at all.

3. SipDroid - crashes.

4. Dell Voice - crashes.

My provider is freephoneline.ca, and I'm testing VoIP with it without success. I'm a network engineer with rich VoIP experience, and run at home a sophisticated FreePBX setup accessible from Internet. I've tried to register my Note on my home PBX as an extension, and I see same behavior - phones ring, calls establish, but no sound.

I don't understand where's the trouble exactly. Is it the Note, or CM9, or my provider is allowing SIP but blocking RTP? I see that all three Fido's APNs are doing NAT, because the phone shows the registered IP that is different from what I see in whatismyip. Could it be the problem? Problems with NATting RTP usually result in no inbound voice, but outbound should be OK...

I wonder if there's a packet sniffer for Android so I could check the traces, LOL.

Whoever has some success doing SIP calling over Rogers/Fido 3G, please help me out.

Thanks!

esokolov · Aug 18, 2012

Shameless self-bump.

Guys, I wonder if nobody knows, or nobody cares? I know it's most likely wrong forum to ask, please push me in right direction...

thunderzhao · Aug 18, 2012

esokolov said:
Folks, please give me a hand!

I have the Note from Rogers Canada, upgraded to CM9 release, my provider is Fido, and I'm struggling with getting VoIP work over 3G.

1. Native ICS client. It's OK on WiFi, and on 3G the call is being established in and out, but no sound either direction. I heard 3G calling was blocked in GB client, and there was even a method tweaking the APK to make it work, but obviously something is very different in ICS - that tweak is not applicable - I can't find proper file in this APK.

2. cSipSimple - does not work at all, makes the phone acting weird. Well, last update was in 2011, maybe not compatible with ICS at all.

3. SipDroid - crashes.

4. Dell Voice - crashes.

My provider is freephoneline.ca, and I'm testing VoIP with it without success. I'm a network engineer with rich VoIP experience, and run at home a sophisticated FreePBX setup accessible from Internet. I've tried to register my Note on my home PBX as an extension, and I see same behavior - phones ring, calls establish, but no sound.

I don't understand where's the trouble exactly. Is it the Note, or CM9, or my provider is allowing SIP but blocking RTP? I see that all three Fido's APNs are doing NAT, because the phone shows the registered IP that is different from what I see in whatismyip. Could it be the problem? Problems with NATting RTP usually result in no inbound voice, but outbound should be OK...

I wonder if there's a packet sniffer for Android so I could check the traces, LOL.

Whoever has some success doing SIP calling over Rogers/Fido 3G, please help

Thanks!

I had a similar setup on Telus, and everything works alright. And then I tried Rogers 3G, there is only one way audio, I can't hear anything. But the other side can hear me. And also, my phone can't receive incoming either.

It's probably a problem/restriction with Rogers.

esokolov · Aug 19, 2012

thunderzhao said:
I had a similar setup on Telus, and everything works alright. And then I tried Rogers 3G, there is only one way audio, I can't hear anything. But the other side can hear me. And also, my phone can't receive incoming either.

It's probably a problem/restriction with Rogers.

Confirmed, with latest CSipSimple nightly build (Jeez, they didn't release since 2011!!!) I was able to make calls, now with one way audio (out), outbound but not incoming calls, and if the remote party hangs, the phone does not detect it.

Those symptoms are familiar - NAT can't properly handle UDP inwards. Both SIP and RTP are affected. Enabling STUN did not help either.

Well, I'm going to buy data only SIM from Bell, stay tuned...

thunderzhao · Aug 19, 2012

esokolov said:
Confirmed, with latest CSipSimple nightly build (Jeez, they didn't release since 2011!!!) I was able to make calls, now with one way audio (out), outbound but not incoming calls, and if the remote party hangs, the phone does not detect it.

Those symptoms are familiar - NAT can't properly handle UDP inwards. Both SIP and RTP are affected. Enabling STUN did not help either.

Well, I'm going to buy data only SIM from Bell, stay tuned...

bell will definitely work, their 3G network is just not as good as rogers'

Linphone can receive incoming, but one way audio too

esokolov · Aug 19, 2012

thunderzhao said:
bell will definitely work, their 3G network is just not as good as rogers'

Linphone can receive incoming, but one way audio too

Well, recently I've been at Rock Point (Lake Eerie), and both my personal Note (Fido) and business Blackberry (Rogers) had no signal on 3G and even GSM, while my friend was chattering and browsing on his Bell connected phone... Maybe Bell's 3G coverage is spotty, but so is Rogers. I've seen too many times that Rogers drops to GSM with no apparent reason, and that means no decent data for VoIP.

We'll see. I'm aiming at LTE anyways, and Bell's LTE spot is WAY bigger according to their official coverage maps.

Someone has to be a guinea pig for new technologies.

I hate the idea of paying $70 for CityFido + data, while I could pay $25-$35 for Bell's flex plus $0 for FreePhoneLine.

thunderzhao · Aug 20, 2012

esokolov said:
Well, recently I've been at Rock Point (Lake Eerie), and both my personal Note (Fido) and business Blackberry (Rogers) had no signal on 3G and even GSM, while my friend was chattering and browsing on his Bell connected phone... Maybe Bell's 3G coverage is spotty, but so is Rogers. I've seen too many times that Rogers drops to GSM with no apparent reason, and that means no decent data for VoIP.

We'll see. I'm aiming at LTE anyways, and Bell's LTE spot is WAY bigger according to their official coverage maps.

Someone has to be a guinea pig for new technologies. I hate the idea of paying $70 for CityFido + data, while I could pay $25-$35 for Bell's flex plus $0 for FreePhoneLine.

finally got it working on rogers 3g with pbxes.org, and then add freephoneline as a truck, csipsimple works fine

esokolov · Aug 21, 2012

thunderzhao said:
finally got it working on rogers 3g with pbxes.org, and then add freephoneline as a truck, csipsimple works fine

Hmmm, I wonder how you did it, can't make it work.

Okay, now I'm on Bell 3G (no LTE yet).

1. Registering with FPL directly gives me outbound calls OK, inbound call get voicemail (on 3G), STUN has no effect. WiFi calling is fine.
2. Registering through PBXes and FPL - outbound calls even to VM gives me "488 / Not acceptable here" on 3G, works OK on WiFi. Incoming calls make my cell ring, but when I pick up the call I'm getting same 488 on 3G. What's wrong here?

Will try it on Fido 3G...

thunderzhao · Aug 21, 2012

esokolov said:
Hmmm, I wonder how you did it, can't make it work.

Okay, now I'm on Bell 3G (no LTE yet).

1. Registering with FPL directly gives me outbound calls OK, inbound call get voicemail (on 3G), STUN has no effect. WiFi calling is fine.
2. Registering through PBXes and FPL - outbound calls even to VM gives me "488 / Not acceptable here" on 3G, works OK on WiFi. Incoming calls make my cell ring, but when I pick up the call I'm getting same 488 on 3G. What's wrong here?

Will try it on Fido 3G...

488 means incompatible codec, pbxes only accept ilbc,
Are you using csipsimple?

esokolov · Aug 21, 2012

thunderzhao said:
488 means incompatible codec, pbxes only accept ilbc,
Are you using csipsimple?

Yes, and it was a CSipSimple glitch.

By default it has SILK + PCMU + PCMA. I've left only PCMU and it stopped working on 3G only (WiFi was OK). Resetting CSipSimple to defaults resolved it. Weird...

BTW I doubt that PBXes only accepts ILBC, there's quite a number of codecs mentioned in their online help.

esokolov · Aug 21, 2012

thunderzhao said:
finally got it working on rogers 3g with pbxes.org, and then add freephoneline as a truck, csipsimple works fine

I've managed to recreate this eventually. I don't know what's so special about PBXes, but yes it works fine with both Fido and Bell 3G. Thanks for the clue! Looks like I'm going to eliminate my home FreePBX and switch to PBXes.

However, sound is choppy like hell on both, barely usable. And I'm still struggling to get LTE on Bell's SIM, hope it will improve things.

One more question - phonebook in my Android has all the numbers in international format - +1-xxx-xxx-xxxx, +7-xxx-xxx-xxxx etc. When I dial directly from my address book into CSipSiple->PBXes->FPL, FPL rejects the call saying it's not covered by my plan. I believe I need substitute +1 with 1, +7 with 0117 and so on, but how do I do this? PBXes is based on FreePBX, and its rules use + as a special character for adding prefixes I believe...

thunderzhao · Aug 22, 2012

esokolov said:
Yes, and it was a CSipSimple glitch.

By default it has SILK + PCMU + PCMA. I've left only PCMU and it stopped working on 3G only (WiFi was OK). Resetting CSipSimple to defaults resolved it. Weird...

BTW I doubt that PBXes only accepts ILBC, there's quite a number of codecs mentioned in their online help.

you are right, pbxes accept pcmu as well, but i thought it's too heavy for 3g, they allow g729a "PASSTHU" only to paid users.

for the choppiness, sip require packets loss way lower than 1%, i'm still trying to figure out what to do about that

thunderzhao · Aug 22, 2012

esokolov said:
I've managed to recreate this eventually. I don't know what's so special about PBXes, but yes it works fine with both Fido and Bell 3G. Thanks for the clue! Looks like I'm going to eliminate my home FreePBX and switch to PBXes.

However, sound is choppy like hell on both, barely usable. And I'm still struggling to get LTE on Bell's SIM, hope it will improve things.

One more question - phonebook in my Android has all the numbers in international format - +1-xxx-xxx-xxxx, +7-xxx-xxx-xxxx etc. When I dial directly from my address book into CSipSiple->PBXes->FPL, FPL rejects the call saying it's not covered by my plan. I believe I need substitute +1 with 1, +7 with 0117 and so on, but how do I do this? PBXes is based on FreePBX, and its rules use + as a special character for adding prefixes I believe...

for the number formats, since i have all numbers stored on google voice, i went there and deleted all "+" and "-"
in csipsimple, there's an option called filter, i think you can reformat there

a few more tweaks for the choppiness, I disabled echo cancelling since sound from ear piece is not likely to reach microphone.
I also have trouble with the new csipsimple, when i use ilbc, it will freeze after about 30 seconds.
if you directly connect to freephoneline.ca, you need to use PCMU in order to receive phone call over 3G, somehow freephoneline disabled g729a on incoming calls.

so much for today's tweaking. good luck, let me know what you find out

esokolov · Aug 23, 2012

thunderzhao said:
you are right, pbxes accept pcmu as well, but i thought it's too heavy for 3g, they allow g729a "PASSTHU" only to paid users.

for the choppiness, sip require packets loss way lower than 1%, i'm still trying to figure out what to do about that

SIP as signalling protocol is doing fine. RTP transport for audio is a problem.

I believe nothing can be done over 3G. I'm trying to make it work over LTE - it's supposed to be much better.

However I figured out that unlocked I717R (Rogers) does not connect to Bell's LTE cloud however it should.

I'm going to flash the Bell's radio and try again. I wonder if there's just Bell's baseband for ICS I can download and burn with Odin. I have only found full stock ICS for Bell, and that's a long and messy update path.

thunderzhao · Aug 25, 2012

esokolov said:
SIP as signalling protocol is doing fine. RTP transport for audio is a problem.

I believe nothing can be done over 3G. I'm trying to make it work over LTE - it's supposed to be much better.

However I figured out that unlocked I717R (Rogers) does not connect to Bell's LTE cloud however it should.

I'm going to flash the Bell's radio and try again. I wonder if there's just Bell's baseband for ICS I can download and burn with Odin. I have only found full stock ICS for Bell, and that's a long and messy update path.

not very experienced with radio band and stuff, but have you tried getril? heard it's a very easy app to do this

esokolov · Aug 25, 2012

Galaxy Note not supported yet.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using Tapatalk 2

esokolov · Sep 4, 2012

thunderzhao said:
good luck, let me know what you find out

Ok, another report.

1. After upgrading radio from Rogers to Bell, Bell LTE is pretty solid and stable while I'm in GTA.

2. Generally, VoIP over 3G is crap, both Bell and Fido/Rogers. VoIP over LTE is mostly OK. No surprise.

3. CSipSimple cannot properly handle Bluetooth handover. By some reason, the call always starts on speakerphone, then has to be routed manually either to BT or earpiece.

4. SIP keepalives are draining battery really fast, no matter if it's Wifi, 3G, or LTE.

5. PBXes.org is GROSS... I've stopped and dismissed my home FreePBX.

Fido has just started offering LTE. Tonight will try and upgrade my SIM card. I wonder though if I need to flash my radio back to Rogers to make it work...

General conclusion - VoIP over cell data is not ready yet for general use. However, geeks like me can save a few cents...

A few questions:

1. Is it possible to block voice cellular calls in and out? My Bell SIM card 'for tablets' still allows voice calls, and every time I'm hitting the wrong button I'm making 40 cents pay-per-minute charge. Customer service says it cannot be blocked on their side.

2. Is there any way to route SMS messages to VoIP and vice versa?

3. Is there a number portability between cell networks and VoIP operators (Canada and US, just to see a big picture)?

I believe this discussion is off-topic here. Can someone suggest a proper forum?

thunderzhao · Dec 24, 2012

if you use csipsimple, you can disable mobile, if you use stock phone app, you can set use internet call only.

fongo supports sms now, i use google voice, with simonics

canadian numbers can port to fongo, US number can port to google voice

esokolov said:
Ok, another report.

1. After upgrading radio from Rogers to Bell, Bell LTE is pretty solid and stable while I'm in GTA.

2. Generally, VoIP over 3G is crap, both Bell and Fido/Rogers. VoIP over LTE is mostly OK. No surprise.

3. CSipSimple cannot properly handle Bluetooth handover. By some reason, the call always starts on speakerphone, then has to be routed manually either to BT or earpiece.

4. SIP keepalives are draining battery really fast, no matter if it's Wifi, 3G, or LTE.

5. PBXes.org is GROSS... I've stopped and dismissed my home FreePBX.

Fido has just started offering LTE. Tonight will try and upgrade my SIM card. I wonder though if I need to flash my radio back to Rogers to make it work...

General conclusion - VoIP over cell data is not ready yet for general use. However, geeks like me can save a few cents...

A few questions:

1. Is it possible to block voice cellular calls in and out? My Bell SIM card 'for tablets' still allows voice calls, and every time I'm hitting the wrong button I'm making 40 cents pay-per-minute charge. Customer service says it cannot be blocked on their side.

2. Is there any way to route SMS messages to VoIP and vice versa?

3. Is there a number portability between cell networks and VoIP operators (Canada and US, just to see a big picture)?

I believe this discussion is off-topic here. Can someone suggest a proper forum?

esokolov · Dec 31, 2012

thunderzhao said:
if you use csipsimple, you can disable mobile, if you use stock phone app, you can set use internet call only.

fongo supports sms now, i use google voice, with simonics

canadian numbers can port to fongo, US number can port to google voice

Thanks thunderzhao!

At the moment I decided to stop my VoIP over cellular experiments, this is not productive.

First, Fido has just offered unlimited national calling + 2Gb of data + convenience pack, all for $56, and it's a killer.

Second, new mobile version of Skype, however not SIP based, is soooo much simpler to deal with than SIP solutions. It has a super clear voice Skype-to-Skype (and video too), works seamlessly over firewalls and NAT, and has a decent quality over both HSPA and LTE.

Third, VoLTE is on the horizon (so I believe), and it will completely change the landscape of mobile services, plans, and prices.

Switching to waiting mode.

stgeorge88 · Dec 31, 2012

Fongo crashes on cm but works fine for me on cm10 and most touchwiz ICS ROMs.

[Q] i717R + CM9 + Fido = no VOIP!!!

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