[Q] Rooting Advantages and Disadvantages

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

I have been reading this forum for some weeks now and wanted to thank you all for the great info here. I got my first Android phone (Vibrant) a few weeks ago.

I found out about rooting just yesterday. Since I really don't want to spend a lot of time troubleshooting the phone, I had a few questions to figure out whether I should root or not:

Will rooting my phone be overall worth it? Will I have to troubleshoot it a lot as a result? It works well now.
How will the updates work in the future? For example, I won't have to worry about Android 2.2 because it will be included in Cyanogen? Will my phone notify me when it's time to update?
This one is important: are there any instructions that tell me how to backup my current phone so that I can restore it to the original condition in case something happens?
Is Cyanogen accepted to be the best for rooting?
Will all my applications become uninstalled? Will anything else change besides my access level? I read some conflicting into on this.
Can you think of any disadvantages to rooting (other than possible voiding of warranty if you can't hide it)?
Do you guys have a list in this forum as to which applications are bloatware and should be removed (and are safe to remove)? I don't know anything about Android, so I have no idea
And finally, is there a thread/list where all the most important/useful applications that should be installed after rooting are listed? I know titanium backup is one. I couldn't understand what BusyBox does. So a list with explanations would be great.

I haven't liked the battery life of this phone and I am hoping that after removing all the bloatware from it that issue might be fixed as well. My phone starts with 160M+ memory. Even though I keep killing open applications, the performance keeps dropping over time until I can't get more memory beyond ~90M. This is when I have to shut down the phone and turn back on. Other than tethering, my main reason for rooting is 1.performance gain and 2.battery life extension.

Thanks for all the help. A lot of talented people on this forum.

s15274n · Aug 12, 2010

There is no reason to not root this phone in my opinion. You can unroot it. You will get OTA updates using the stock ROM. Many of the recommended apps, guides, useful information is in the sticky at the top. Please read that, then ask any more detailed question you may have.

edit: when you root, there will be NO change to your apps/contacts/settings/etc.... you will reboot and be like "well, am I rooted?"... look for the superuser app in your app drawer, there? Good, you were successful.

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

Ok, you got an excellent thread there that pretty much answered all my questions! I will root my phone and get back here if I have any more questions, with a cleaned up list. Thanks.

boodies · Aug 12, 2010

will applying the RyanZA fix stop the OTA update?

mrxela · Aug 12, 2010

A lot of people have this misconception that rooting means modifying their phone. Rooting by itself is not really modifying anything on your phone, all it does is give you super user privileges.

Think of your Mac or Windows PC, you have administrative accounts and you have user accounts. Admins can do anything, user accounts are typically limited.

When you have root access to your phone, you are the admin. You can access features that default account can't.

With that said, once you do have su you step into a whole new world with many different paths. You can can simply stay rooted and use apps that required root access and leave it at that.

Or you can dive into custom ROMs. This is where you step off the manufacturers intended path and follow community developed versions of the operating system.

Alternatively, in between those two extremes above you can do many things in between. You can stay with stock rom but have custom (modules or programs) APKs, or other modifications that change or expand on stock ROM.

Always keep in mind that once you choose to root, what happens to your device is your responsibility. Once again, your responsibility. If you are not willing to accept that, then stay non-rooted/stock and responsibility will be on Samsung to add/remove features, provide updates, fix bugs, etc.

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

Ok, so a few questions:

I bought Autostart and hid the system apps. Now what? I don't know what to disable from this list. There are applications, but they are listed under several categories. For example, "Application Removed." I have no idea what that category is for. Should I just worry about "After Startup"? Please elaborate.
You don't recommend AppKiller. Won't all those open applications just drain the battery? For example, if I have TeleNav open, how can I close it after I am done using it without AKiller?
There is an entire thread of various people posting various things, but I still would like to see just ONE combined list of all the "safe" bloatware to remove and "risky" ones. That thread did not help me at all since various people are reporting various things.
You recommend Root Explorer, which is kind of expensive. Is there any reason why I can't use the uninstall function of Titanium Backup? Is it any less thorough?
Where is the restart function?
How can I disable those annoying power down and power up sounds of the phone? Can this be done without lowering system volume?

Thanks!

s15274n · Aug 12, 2010

Awesome, Glad to hear your root went well.

1. I bought Autostart and hid the system apps. Now what? I don't know what to disable from this list. There are applications, but they are listed under several categories. For example, "Application Removed." I have no idea what that category is for. Should I just worry about "After Startup"? Please elaborate.

I remove almost all non-system apps unless it is logical wht said app would need to function, aka, text received you would not want to block messanger/handcent..... if there is something you are questioning, just let me know.

2. You don't recommend AppKiller. Won't all those open applications just drain the battery? For example, if I have TeleNav open, how can I close it after I am done using it without AKiller?

Now that you have root, remove all of the bloatware and it will not be an issue. These run in the background and very likely are not using ANY of your resources.

3. There is an entire thread of various people posting various things, but I still would like to see just ONE combined list of all the "safe" bloatware to remove and "risky" ones. That thread did not help me at all since various people are reporting various things.

I used that thread because a lot of people posted the apps they removed. Almost all of them can be removed, if there is one you are questioning, let me know.

4. You recommend Root Explorer, which is kind of expensive. Is there any reason why I can't use the uninstall function of Titanium Backup? Is it any less thorough?

I mentioned in the sticky that I do not use TB. I know it allows you to remove apps, but Root Explorer does this and a lot more. For example..... #6

5. Where is the restart function?

Not sure I know what you mean? if you want a reboot option you can get Quick Boot from the market.

6. How can I disable those annoying power down and power up sounds of the phone? Can this be done without lowering system volume?

In the sticky I show where the files are located. With Root Explorer you can navigate to them and delete the files.

}{Alienz}{ · Aug 12, 2010

I agree with a lot on this thread. A master Guide for rooting/unrooting and usage should be made. The FAQ currently stickied is informative for the most part but it focuses on far too many things to be able to go into enough detail on each. Personally I would like a "All things root" guide or something sticked which is comprehensive and focuses JUST on that, with the most common root usage apps and things posted (including safe disabling or removal of bloat, backing up, flashing roms, etc.) so that people who have NO idea whatsoever and it is their first phone or something can just read that and feel at home. I may start working on one if no one else does it, we'll see.

mrxela · Aug 12, 2010

}{Alienz}{ said:
so that people who have NO idea whatsoever and it is their first phone or something can just read that and feel at home.

I'd say that if someone has no idea what they are doing, the last thing they should be attempting is flashing firmware on their phone.

The layer of obscurity and technical difficulty associated with rooting/modding is of benefit in terms of preventing people from doing things they should not be doing without sufficient knowledge base.

There is plenty of info here and online in general to start someone off if they are interested in learning about this in general.

IMHO, creating a trail of bread crumbs for someone who doesn't know what they are doing is more likely to hurt them or community in general rather than help them.

androidaddict23 · Aug 12, 2010

In my experience rooting your could be fun and a nightmare, if not done properly and, you have of time on you're you could become a rom switching addict cyanogen is currently available for the vibrant you can still root, but you will be on stock vibrant rom.till samsung release the source code so no froyo.and the rumor is that they won't release the source code.

Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

s15274n said:
Awesome, Glad to hear your root went well.

1. I bought Autostart and hid the system apps. Now what? I don't know what to disable from this list. There are applications, but they are listed under several categories. For example, "Application Removed." I have no idea what that category is for. Should I just worry about "After Startup"? Please elaborate.

I remove almost all non-system apps unless it is logical wht said app would need to function, aka, text received you would not want to block messanger/handcent..... if there is something you are questioning, just let me know.

2. You don't recommend AppKiller. Won't all those open applications just drain the battery? For example, if I have TeleNav open, how can I close it after I am done using it without AKiller?

Now that you have root, remove all of the bloatware and it will not be an issue. These run in the background and very likely are not using ANY of your resources.

3. There is an entire thread of various people posting various things, but I still would like to see just ONE combined list of all the "safe" bloatware to remove and "risky" ones. That thread did not help me at all since various people are reporting various things.

I used that thread because a lot of people posted the apps they removed. Almost all of them can be removed, if there is one you are questioning, let me know.

4. You recommend Root Explorer, which is kind of expensive. Is there any reason why I can't use the uninstall function of Titanium Backup? Is it any less thorough?

I mentioned in the sticky that I do not use TB. I know it allows you to remove apps, but Root Explorer does this and a lot more. For example..... #6

5. Where is the restart function?

Not sure I know what you mean? if you want a reboot option you can get Quick Boot from the market.

6. How can I disable those annoying power down and power up sounds of the phone? Can this be done without lowering system volume?

In the sticky I show where the files are located. With Root Explorer you can navigate to them and delete the files.

1. What I don't understand is that the category says "New Outgoing Call" and GVoice beneath it. So I should NOT disable it, right? Because it has nothing to do with startup? But if so, then almost every other category has nothing to do with startup either. It is only the first listing that says "After Startup" and it misses A LOT of applications that do start up, like TeleNav. I don't even see TeleNav anywhere in that list. Same is true for "Email," Gallery," "Voice Dialer," and a bunch of other apps that I don't want to start on startup. I don't see any way of killing these other than by ATKiller. Am I missing something here?

2. See the problem is this: right now I have Telenav and I use it sometimes. However, I don't want it to run just whenever. So if I don't want to uninstall it, isn't my only solution ATKiller? There are other programs like this. And I can't disable them from the Autostart menu either since they're not there (Filtered out System files).

3. That site does not list what each of the bloatware does. For example, I am not sure I want to remove Account and Sync because I might need it for my bills. Same thing with "MyFiles." I don't even know what "vvm" is.

4. I am not able to tether the phone. I already tried Barnacle and it said "Running..." after I disabled supplicant, used channel 6, and disable ad-hoc. Then I tried this: http://xdaforums.com/showthread.php?t=739147&highlight=tether, but I am still not able to connect. My laptop detects the phone as "computer-to-computer network," but when I click connect, it keeps trying to connect and then doesn't. I am not sure where to go from here.

Thanks.

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

One more thing I still don't know: how are the updates going to work from now on? Whenever an Android update comes out, like 2.1update or Froyo, do I have to come here and do everything manually? Or is there a way from within the phone to find out with one click? I am assuming whatever update is available for the phone will also be available for custom download (otherwise I could unroot, update, reroot?).

Thanks.

By the way, I also agree about a complete guide. It's not that it will enable the clueless to mess up their phone, but rather the opposite - it will allow the clueless to become cluefull. Such a guide would be very helpful. Meanwhile I am having to jump from thread to thread and then to Google trying to find out about this or that. That's not to say that the guide available isn't very helpful already.

s15274n · Aug 12, 2010

I've already contacted a few people about starting said guide. I have not got much feedback from people willing to help....

^ you've asked a lot man... I can try and answer some, but you need to keep doing some reading. I feel like I've offered up a lot as is.

Just b/c you have root, does not mean you will not receive the OTA updates. If Froyo is released, you can update from the phone, you will lose root though. Most of us, will wait for the developers to have a stock froyo + root that we can flash.

why use telenav? I am not familiar.. just curious why not use google nav?

autostarts, just b/c you have it set to not start an app on boot, does not mean when you click the icon to open it will cause an issue. Really not that big of a deal. If you notice an issue, just set the app back to enabled.

Do not use a task killer.

The thread I linked has plenty of information for what you can remove from the phone, with instructions.... same for the barnacle tether app. If you want, download Wireless Tether, google it... the source code is on google.
http://code.google.com/p/android-wifi-tether/downloads/list

}{Alienz}{ · Aug 12, 2010

androidaddict23 said:
In my experience rooting your could be fun and a nightmare, if not done properly and, you have of time on you're you could become a rom switching addict cyanogen is currently available for the vibrant you can still root, but you will be on stock vibrant rom.till samsung release the source code so no froyo.and the rumor is that they won't release the source code.

Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

Cyanogen is not yet available for the Vibrant. It will soon.
Froyo-cooked ROMS are already out for the Vibrant (alas with some bugs) so I don't think there's a reason to think Cyanogen won't be on Froyo.

Also: Never having done a root/rom flash does not make someone stupid or signify they should never try it. It just means they should READ some documentation and be technically up to the challenge before they do. I don't think having a clear guide on most of the process will hurt anyone who is coming into this but doesn't yet know all the details and steps of what to do.

kboater · Aug 12, 2010

Excelsius said:
Ok, you got an excellent thread there that pretty much answered all my questions! I will root my phone and get back here if I have any more questions, with a cleaned up list. Thanks.

glad the root went well for you. I am wanting to root my phone too, but not sure which root method is easiest and best.
Which root method did you use?

I had a mytouch rooted before the Vibrant, but they are way different and I dont want to screw up

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

s15274n said:
I've already contacted a few people about starting said guide. I have not got much feedback from people willing to help....

^ you've asked a lot man... I can try and answer some, but you need to keep doing some reading. I feel like I've offered up a lot as is.

Just b/c you have root, does not mean you will not receive the OTA updates. If Froyo is released, you can update from the phone, you will lose root though. Most of us, will wait for the developers to have a stock froyo + root that we can flash.

why use telenav? I am not familiar.. just curious why not use google nav?

autostarts, just b/c you have it set to not start an app on boot, does not mean when you click the icon to open it will cause an issue. Really not that big of a deal. If you notice an issue, just set the app back to enabled.

Do not use a task killer.

The thread I linked has plenty of information for what you can remove from the phone, with instructions.... same for the barnacle tether app. If you want, download Wireless Tether, google it... the source code is on google.
http://code.google.com/p/android-wifi-tether/downloads/list

I appreciate all your answers. I don't mean to say that anyone else can't answer as well. I am still unclear on several things I asked and would appreciate if someone could chime in, at least about the exact procedures for using autostart and the reasoning behind not using the task killer. I am new to Android, but I am pretty good at computers, including building them. So when I am learning about doing this or that, I would like to know about the reasoning behind that. I am sure that all of the questions I ask here I can find out on my own, but I was hoping that I could utilize the purpose of the forum and learn something from the veterans rather than reinventing the wheel myself.

I am using Telenav because I have a one month free trial. I discovered Google Nav just yesterday. I just want to compare them myself, even though it is unlikely I will pay $10/month in either case. But remember that Telenav is just one of the applications causing issues.

Thanks for all the answers. Please don't feel pressured to answer all the things I might ask. If I don't get enough answers, I'll just do a quick thread search and if that's not fruitful, I'll create a specific thread for autostart usage.

t0phux · Aug 12, 2010

androidaddict23 said:
till samsung release the source code so no froyo.and the rumor is that they won't release the source code.

Isn't this illegal? I thought the whole point of Android was opensource and under the GPL License, they are required to post the full source code, right? Or I could just be way off base here.

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

kboater said:
glad the root went well for you. I am wanting to root my phone too, but not sure which root method is easiest and best.
Which root method did you use?

I had a mytouch rooted before the Vibrant, but they are way different and I dont want to screw up

I used the first procedure recommended in the sticky: http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=7150299&postcount=1

I am not sure why it said that you have to restart several times. Here are some clarifications on the steps there that I think were not too clear:

1. When you connect your device, you need to pull down the message area, click on the USB, and only then you will see the option to MOUNT your phone. I had to experiment to figure this out.
2. The guide doesn't say, but if your USB debugging mode is on, I would disable it, just to be safe: Settings (this is that leftmost button on your phone when you're at your desktop)-->Applications-->Development-->USB debugging (uncheck). This might be unnecessary, but I did it just to be safe.
3. When you are copying the Update.zip file into your phone, make sure you check the size of the folder. It must be your internal storage - it will be 12GB+ and will have your system files. If you have trouble identifying this, simply remove your SD card!
4. When you are restarting the phone, make sure you press the volume button in the MIDDLE so that it is entirely pressed (up and down). While holding it, press and hold the power. Do not let go of the volume button until your enter the recovery menu.

Anyway, that's what I did and rooted from the first time without any issues.

Excelsius · Aug 12, 2010

t0phux said:
Isn't this illegal? I thought the whole point of Android was opensource and under the GPL License, they are required to post the full source code, right? Or I could just be way off base here.

It could be that Samsung has modified the code for their own phones making the code their property, while the "regular" 2.2 (unmodified) would be available to everyone. I could be wrong, but I think this how it would work.

kboater · Aug 12, 2010

Excelsius said:
I used the first procedure recommended in the sticky: http://xdaforums.com/showpost.php?p=7150299&postcount=1

I am not sure why it said that you have to restart several times. Here are some clarifications on the steps there that I think were not too clear:

1. When you connect your device, you need to pull down the message area, click on the USB, and only then you will see the option to MOUNT your phone. I had to experiment to figure this out.
2. The guide doesn't say, but if your USB debugging mode is on, I would disable it, just to be safe: Settings (this is that leftmost button on your phone when you're at your desktop)-->Applications-->Development-->USB debugging (uncheck). This might be unnecessary, but I did it just to be safe.
3. When you are copying the Update.zip file into your phone, make sure you check the size of the folder. It must be your internal storage - it will be 12GB+ and will have your system files. If you have trouble identifying this, simply remove your SD card!
4. When you are restarting the phone, make sure you press the volume button in the MIDDLE so that it is entirely pressed (up and down). While holding it, press and hold the power. Do not let go of the volume button until your enter the recovery menu.

Anyway, that's what I did and rooted from the first time without any issues.

thanks

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[Q] Rooting Advantages and Disadvantages

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