For those who are having signal issues, Samsung is deliberately crippling the devices

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scottusa2008

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2008
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CarolinaGirl81 said:
I have a question that may have been answered. Would rooting and installing a custom rom help with the signals on note 10 plus? I have a note 10 plus and notice these same issues. My old iPhone 6s gets better wifi and cell signal on the same network as my note 10 plus. Is there a way to bypass their restrictions with a rom? Sorry if this has been answered before.
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No, based on personal past experiences if your having signal issues with the phone now you will have signal issues if you root and install a custom rom. The only things that made a difference was the cell provider coverage and technology. For example Verizon does much better coverage wise then Sprint for me. Verizon also flat out dominates over AT&T, T-Mobile for overall coverage. I get full bars on my note 10+, once in a blue moon would see any signal from sprint, at&t and T-mobile would show 1 maybe 2 bars but wouldn't be a stable connection.

Rooting any of my phones (Motorola, Samsung, LG or jailbreaking an iPhone) would not (and did not after rooting/jailbreaking) have changed anything. Sprint has extremely few towers by me, AT&T didn't work well in buildings or on some roads (still well within the coverage area and same town), T-Mobile was a combination of not enough towers and how they were aimed (spoke to engineers quite a few times on this).


Any custom rom will be built using basically the same building blocks as what is already installed, so it would be bound by the same regulations for the phone's TX power. Also I'm pretty sure hardware power constraints also are present as well.

Now that's not to say little tweaks here and there couldn't be made to make things a little faster, but mostly it was geared towards customizations like theme, boot logos, system sounds, vram, cpu speed/throttle/governor/scheduling/etc, changing/removing system apps. None of the tweaks had never increased signal power from the tower to the phone (or from the phone to the tower).

You might be able to decrease the polling speed for wifi so that it scans more often, but that would only make it connect faster and not farther.

You also might be able to make little adjustments to tcp buffer, mtu sizes to make the data transfer a bit more efficent... you might be able to have more control over band enabling/disabling/preference and maybe fine tune when the phone changes to a different band... but neither of these would not change the cell tower TX power nor your phone's TX power.

If rooted or using a custom rom one could change the way the signal bars are displayed too.. it won't do anything for TX power from the phone or cell tower, but it would make it look like the signal is stronger. I know it sounds weird, but maybe for some is the signal is present (like 1 or 2 bars) but the formula set by the carrier to determine signal strength just needs a little tweak.
 
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King-V

Senior Member
Apr 16, 2013
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Been using the Note 10+ for over half a year. Only time I can't use data is when I'm in-between cities which I expect to happen with any phone (drops to E), and then also while hiking in mountains far away from any city or tower (no data at all, calls & messaging still possible). As for completely losing signal, I don't recall a time when that's happened. However, I have the Exynos variant, maybe that's a factor as Exynos doesn't fall under the FCC's purview?
 
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winol

winol

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Jan 18, 2010
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COATZACOALCOS
Due to pure ignorance, many people think that the icon bars show the actual exact precise strenght of the signal, which is not the case, the bars just show an aproximate for you to see where signal is good, poor or inexistent, sometimes zero bars let you conect calls , some other times full bars give you bad quality conections, it is a lot more complicated than just judging by just looking the signal bars
 
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scottusa2008

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2008
550
168
King-V said:
Been using the Note 10+ for over half a year. Only time I can't use data is when I'm in-between cities which I expect to happen with any phone (drops to E), and then also while hiking in mountains far away from any city or tower (no data at all, calls & messaging still possible). As for completely losing signal, I don't recall a time when that's happened. However, I have the Exynos variant, maybe that's a factor as Exynos doesn't fall under the FCC's purview?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I would tend to think some form of regulation is in play, not sure what entity would be involved within regards to your location/region...

IMHO the cell providers in your area may just have adequate enough towers to provide good coverage over the area. About the only way you would find out anything a bit more definitive is to gather data. You would need to ask around if anyone else you know that uses the same provider as you and see if they have any issues or problems. It would help to get information from those who don't have the same phone as you also (different manufacturer).

The more data you gather it will become easier to narrow down if it's a one off thing, specific to your phone or specific to the provider in the area, etc.
 
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Nickitt

Nickitt

Senior Member
Dec 21, 2011
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I lol'd myself all the way to the 5th page to write; this is BOGUS.
Swap your phone out with another or do your ##update# and enjoy the damn phone. We have Wi-Fi pretty much anywhere. It isn't Samsung, or any company, unless they specifically say.
 
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coilbio

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2011
224
54
Would you all be more open to the idea if title didn't say Samsung was intentionally crippling?

Maybe they just don't know any better, cause the fact of the matter is people have other devices that do have better signal, audio, etc, all while having the same rules from FCC and even the same chipsets, etc. It comes down to their code and antenna designs, remember Applegate?

There's days my note10+ will take multiple tries to make a simple call, while my pixel 4 right next to it will work every time under the same conditions.
This phone literally stays stuck on the dialing screen for half a minute lol. I'll get a text from people saying they've been calling before I get any incoming call. Don't get me started on backed up texts, those timestamps I can at least prove lol.

I literally carry 3 phones, each for a different line purpose and I love some features of my note 10, but I know not to rely on it for real communication purposes. I can't afford to.
I mean, can't force anyone to see it differently until they've experienced that need for reliable communication and have it fail.
 
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ptko15

Senior Member
Aug 15, 2011
135
27
Samsung Galaxy Note 10+
Samsung Galaxy Note 20 Ultra
coilbio said:
Would you all be more open to the idea if title didn't say Samsung was intentionally crippling?

Maybe they just don't know any better, cause the fact of the matter is people have other devices that do have better signal, audio, etc, all while having the same rules from FCC and even the same chipsets, etc. It comes down to their code and antenna designs, remember Applegate?

There's days my note10+ will take multiple tries to make a simple call, while my pixel 4 right next to it will work every time under the same conditions.
This phone literally stays stuck on the dialing screen for half a minute lol. I'll get a text from people saying they've been calling before I get any incoming call. Don't get me started on backed up texts, those timestamps I can at least prove lol.

I literally carry 3 phones, each for a different line purpose and I love some features of my note 10, but I know not to rely on it for real communication purposes. I can't afford to.
I mean, can't force anyone to see it differently until they've experienced that need for reliable communication and have it fail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

You need some actual proof to say they are crippling the device. Are all 3 devices on the same network, do they have the same priority, etc. Samsung has some of the best antennas in the industry. I would recommend either definitely getting another phone and stop filling up forums of accusations that haven't been quantified, or try and quantify what is happening. And give actual results.
 
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coilbio

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2011
224
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ptko15 said:
You need some actual proof to say they are crippling the device. Are all 3 devices on the same network, do they have the same priority, etc. Samsung has some of the best antennas in the industry. I would recommend either definitely getting another phone and stop filling up forums of accusations that haven't been quantified, or try and quantify what is happening. And give actual results.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

All on the same network and everything, no cases, all my phones are naked. Everyone already posed signal strength apps as being inacurate on this thread. I mean what else is there left?


Frankly I already have the proof, what's more proof than everyday use. Maybe you guys just don't want to accept any other input.

But here's a quick comparison with my Xperia which is unlocked and doesn't even support TMobiles best bands in the radio.
Lower decible is better, and the note does this weird thing where it doesn't even pick the better tower available.

Xperia
IMG_20200627_163852.jpg

Note 10+
View attachment 5049207
 
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ptko15

Senior Member
Aug 15, 2011
135
27
Samsung Galaxy Note 10+
Samsung Galaxy Note 20 Ultra
coilbio said:
All on the same network and everything, no cases, all my phones are naked. Everyone already posed signal strength apps as being inacurate on this thread. I mean what else is there left?


Frankly I already have the proof, what's more proof than everyday use. Maybe you guys just don't want to accept any other input.

But here's a quick comparison with my Xperia which is unlocked and doesn't even support TMobiles best bands in the radio.
Lower decible is better, and the note does this weird thing where it doesn't even pick the better tower available.

Xperia


Note 10+
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Then sell your phone or request an exchange. Etc. Sounds like you may have a lemon. Mine works great. Personally I find tmobile's network to be problematic on multiple devices. But that's just my experience.
 
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coilbio

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2011
224
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ptko15 said:
Then sell your phone or request an exchange. Etc. Sounds like you may have a lemon. Mine works great. Personally I find tmobile's network to be problematic on multiple devices. But that's just my experience.
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So the solution is to sell my phone instead of talking about it..
That's what's wrong with this thread.
 
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coilbio

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2011
224
54
ptko15 said:
If you're unhappy with the response go somewhere else. No one is forcing you to be on here. Obviously others don't have your issues. Solutions are simple. I also said you could go to the manufacturer and exchange it.
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Click to collapse

Or if you dont have issues with it, don't participate .
Obviously you're fine, why try to discredit others because you're fine with what you're given?

Honestly no skin off your back but you act like you work for Samsung.
 
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ptko15

Senior Member
Aug 15, 2011
135
27
Samsung Galaxy Note 10+
Samsung Galaxy Note 20 Ultra
coilbio said:
Or if you dont have issues with it, don't participate .
Obviously you're fine, why try to discredit others because you're fine with what your given?

Honestly no skin of your back but you act like you work for Samsung.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

You're right this is no skin off my back. And I posed 2 different solutions for you. Don't try and lash out at me just because you don't like solutions. If you just want to whine and complain about the issue, that's fine. But stop trying to drag down a company and people that are happy with the product.
 
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coilbio

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2011
224
54
ptko15 said:
You're right this is no skin off my back. And I posed 2 different solutions for you. Don't try and lash out at me just because you don't like solutions. If you just want to whine and complain about the issue, that's fine. But stop trying to drag down a company and people that are happy with the product.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse


Dude, it's not your company, and why get another one if I've had a white one and now a black one and also a note 9 as well as the s10 with the same results lol. My first white one I literally exchanged twice for screen defects.
Maybe they do need to be dragged down so they fix it.
I don't understand consumer loyalty like this, if anything stand back and let issues be reported.
It's great your phone works for you, but things can always be better.
My note fits it's purpose, but I'm not going to pretend it's not my third driver because of its signal issues.

You know how I know Samsung has been stuck in a sense of complacency?
The big update to UI 2.1 with all that leftover code from the s20.

You also quoted me first, so..... Who lashed out at whom?
 
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ptko15

Senior Member
Aug 15, 2011
135
27
Samsung Galaxy Note 10+
Samsung Galaxy Note 20 Ultra
coilbio said:
Dude, it's not your company, and why get another one if I've had a white one and now a black one and also a note 9 as well as the s10 with the same results lol. My first white one I literally exchanged twice for screen defects.
Maybe they do need to be dragged down so they fix it.
I don't understand consumer loyalty like this, if anything stand back and let issues be reported.
It's great your phone works for you, but things can always be better.
My note fits it's purpose, but I'm not going to pretend it's not my third driver because of its signal issues.

You know how I know Samsung has been stuck in a sense of complacency?
The big update to UI 2.1 with all that leftover code from the s20.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Alright. Well good luck.
 
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    -BoneZ-
    -BoneZ-
    TLDR:
    --------
    Samsung is crippling the radios and audio in the name of "safety" and "protecting the end user". Sending mine back to Samsung.

    I've seen many posts on here about signal issues, both WiFi and Cell. This post will delve into some specifics. And sorry in advance that this is a long read.

    Background
    -----------------
    Firstly, some background: I bought my first Samsung and first Note, the Note 2 and thoroughly loved the device. I've had every Note except the Note 1, Note 4 (used the Google Nexus 6 which I still have) and the Note 9 (used a OnePlus 7 Pro, which I still have). I absolutely love the Note series with the large beautiful screen, excellent cameras and of course the Pen.

    So after using my Note 8 for a year and a half, I decided to try something different than Samsung because I was tired of the poor cell signal and WiFi signal. I decided to get a OnePlus 7 Pro since that company and phone has been so hyped. Well, the hype is definitely real. The phone is super-fast with little to no lag.

    What I don't like or care for the most about the 7 Pro is the ugly rounded corners (besides the mediocre camera). I've always loved the square(er) corners of the Note. And when I saw the Note 10+ in a store recently and touched it, I had to have one. I got it in 3 days and wow what a sight to behold! The screen is just absolutely heavenly.

    Cell Signal
    ----------------
    I noticed immediately while driving around with the Note 10+, my music was constantly buffering. I thought it had to do with some kind of battery optimization for the app as to why music would stop playing and keep buffering. But I had already taken care of that in the settings.

    Then when I took my Note to work is when it was really noticeable. I work on the second floor offices at my job. My OnePlus has excellent cell signal. Almost always 2-3 bars (and when I'm outside, 4 full bars as the tower is nearby apparently) and easily able to stream music without issue. My Note? Nothing! For at least half the day every day, I had zero signal sitting at my desk in the same spot as I do with my OnePlus 7 Pro. The Note would just say (Emergency Calls Only - No Signal). That was infuriating. Especially with a tower nearby, and my other phone has no signal issues.

    WiFI Signal
    -----------------
    The second place I notice signal issues is with WiFi. I keep my WiFi strength turned down to keep the RF exposure low, and to keep from broadcasting my WiFi across the whole neighborhood. With my OnePlus 7 Pro, I get 2-3 bars of WiFi in my garage and the WiFi takes about 10-seconds to connect. With the Note 10+, it literally takes minutes to connect to my WiFi in the garage, barely getting 1-bar, once in a while jumping up to 2 bars then back to 1. And I realize that "number of bars don't matter", but they actually do. It's just a cop-out, and proven that they do have some significance.

    Comparison
    -----------------
    Now I want to make something clear for those who don't know. Both the OnePlus 7 Pro and the Note 10+ use the same exact Snapdragon 855 SoC. As you'll see in the image HERE, the Snapdragon SoC has (among other things) the Cell radio and the BT/WiFi radios all built into the chip. And if one would look at the spec sheets for the 855 and earlier Qualcomm chips, you'd see that the radios get more powerful year after year.

    I was blown away going from the garbage radios on the Note 8 to the amazing radios on the OnePlus 7 Pro. Absolutely never any cell or WiFi issues, ever. I figured that since the radios on the Qualcomm chips get more powerful every year, that the Note 10+ would be a giant step up from the radios on the Note 8. Boy was I wrong.

    Samsung Crippling the Radios
    --------------------------------------------
    That brings me to Samsung deliberately crippling these devices. The FCC has specific regulations regarding exposure to RF radiation from phones. So Samsung is turning down the power of the Cell and WiFi radios so much to keep well below the guidelines and the RF radiation lower. But this is also crippling the device. It's keeping the device from doing it's number one job: being a phone!

    Samsung Crippling the Audio
    ------------------------------------------
    Samsung has also chosen to cripple listening to music also. Just even touching the EQ one tick above the -0- line and the volume is literally cut in half. Good luck trying to listen to headphones with any kind of volume. If you go just one tick below the -0- line, then the volume gets cut about a quarter. So half of the half. Samsung does this to "protect your hearing" so that you don't listen to music too loudly.

    My OnePlus 7 is not like that with the same EQ and same Dolby Atmos. The volume barely wavers at all while adjusting the EQ, and the sound is loud and it actually sounds significantly better than my Note 10.

    Conclusion
    ----------------
    I have two devices with virtually identical hardware. One works as it should with excellent Cell and WiFi signal and great EQ sound, while the other is being crippled to protect the user from too much RF radiation or too loud of sound.

    Samsung has become like Apple: restricting or constricting how you use your devices. Now if you live in a large city where you are surrounded by cell towers and WiFi everywhere, then you'll likely not notice much of the cell signal or WiFi issue. Those of us who live in smaller cities or towns where the coverage is more sparse, we need that extra radio power that Qualcomm already provides so that our devices do what they are first and foremost intended to do: be a working phone.

    I am very upset and disappointed to see Samsung has crippled these devices all in the name of "protecting the end user". So as much as I would love to have that gorgeous screen with me all the time, I'm going to have to settle for my 7 Pro: a device that actually works and isn't being crippled. That also teaches me to never buy a Samsung device again for the foreseeable future, if ever again.

    I'd love to see a class-action lawsuit against Samsung for crippling their devices. These things are the most expensive Android devices on the planet. They should not have anything crippled on them for that price.
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    scottusa2008
    coilbio said:
    And some people will defend that brand and try to speak louder than the ones with issues.

    OP made many more references than just the radios, which look at the Samsung threads about people trying to flash CSC to try and get better signal and radio integration..
    The writing is all over the walls. I probably have more Samsung phones and tablets than most people will have in their lifetime, just not stock.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse


    Take your blinders off for a few and see what is going on... I am not addressing your personal grievances from past experiences with Samsung devices.


    No one defending Samsung here in this thread.. People trying to explain to someone how the understanding they derived is problematic (and why) does not mean defense of Samsung. The only one who is talking loudly is you and it is clear you have some personal issues with Samsung.

    What I am doing is trying to get into a discussion with someone over a claim they made on signal crippling. The post made pertains to signal crippling, audio crippling via the EQ (i.e. OP stating that changing the setting by one notch up audio get cuts in half), and WiFi issues.

    If I found it then that means someone else can just as easily spot it... After all if someone is going to make a bold claim of intentional sabotage by (and even suggest a class action lawsuit against) a manufacturer then it is better to get it right the first time... Do you not agree?


    Also the different threads over CSC's... I see a lot of threads where people are trying to use phones from one carrier onto another, people trying to use phones from the USA overseas, some people who use overseas phones within the USA, some who want to flash U1 firmware onto a U model, some who are using Exynos models outside of the region they are in, some who want to get certain features working outside of a region... And yes some signal issues with a few different reasons (using a phone outside of a certain region, etc).

    But what does that have to do with anything related to signal crippling by Samsung... More importantly do even know what the CSC file is or does?

    In case you don't (or in case someone else doesn't) the CSC is a “Consumer Software Customization” or “Country Specific Code“. It is a binary file that contains "customized settings, system configurations, localizations and geo-specific things such as the system language, APN settings, and carrier-branding."

    If a certain CSC works better then another (or allows certain features that were not allowed previously) then it means the specifications required by the region and/or carrier(s) in question is at fault.

    Now don't get me wrong, if Samsung is at fault it would be regardless of what CSC is flashed because it wouldn't work period. But before you could even pin the blame on Samsung you would have to rule out carrier limitations in service/coverage, signal interference whether natural or human-made and it would require that multiple phones of the same model and CSC that have similar or identical issues within that location (and others using the same criteria previously mentioned. It would then rule out bad batch of phones sold, issues isolated to one region, etc).

    This would provide more concrete proof of a problem existing but only in the aspect of signal related issues that could be caused by Samsung. This does not include any other matter caused by 3rd party apps, customer expectations, customer wants, sales person misinformation to the customer, word of mouth influences, etc.
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    aj_vogtman
    aj_vogtman
    To the OP let me guess, you have a case with metal sides?
    To be clear on Cricket using Pandora highest settings, NEVER stutters . That is hour long interstate drives in the middle of nowhere. Note 10+. Same was true for my Note 8.
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    S
    scottusa2008
    -BoneZ- said:
    TLDR:
    --------
    Samsung is crippling the radios and audio in the name of "safety" and "protecting the end user". Sending mine back to Samsung.

    I've seen many posts on here about signal issues, both WiFi and Cell. This post will delve into some specifics. And sorry in advance that this is a long read.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    Much appreciated you went into specifics on your reasoning.. Makes it better to get an understanding and discussion going over what someone is saying. That being said, I wanted to reply to some of what your posting with my own observations/understandings as well (in addition to my previous reply). Took me a bit longer to make this reply, had to do some research on a few things first (wanted to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding a few details) and work has been a bit chaotic due to recent events.


    -BoneZ- said:
    So after using my Note 8 for a year and a half, I decided to try something different than Samsung because I was tired of the poor cell signal and WiFi signal. I decided to get a OnePlus 7 Pro since that company and phone has been so hyped. Well, the hype is definitely real. The phone is super-fast with little to no lag.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    I have used other phones by other manufacturers with varying degrees of responsiveness. So far my note 10+ hasn't let me down with the settings at the max they can go. I do not get any lag and I have ran some rather intensive applications on the phone (as well as multiple apps that use constant data connections). Lately I've been running a total launcher theme that while impressive has multiple active parts.. Zero lag but I will admit a little bit of a hit to battery performance. Given the sci-fi nature of the theme I am totally ok with that, the phone still lasts all day on a single charge.

    Now if we had a higher refresh rate on our screens... Oh that would be totally fantastic.


    The EQ thing you mentioned, I haven't ran into yet but I can try it later and see if it happens. Mostly I leave my settings on whatever defaults are and dolby atmos turned on. Generally I have to turn down the volume because what movies and music I play sound pretty dang good that the bass tends to get a bit to much.



    -BoneZ- said:
    I noticed immediately while driving around with the Note 10+, my music was constantly buffering. I thought it had to do with some kind of battery optimization for the app as to why music would stop playing and keep buffering. But I had already taken care of that in the settings.

    Then when I took my Note to work is when it was really noticeable. I work on the second floor offices at my job. My OnePlus has excellent cell signal. Almost always 2-3 bars (and when I'm outside, 4 full bars as the tower is nearby apparently) and easily able to stream music without issue. My Note? Nothing! For at least half the day every day, I had zero signal sitting at my desk in the same spot as I do with my OnePlus 7 Pro. The Note would just say (Emergency Calls Only - No Signal). That was infuriating. Especially with a tower nearby, and my other phone has no signal issues.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    Three things I'm finding with your analysis that are troubling...

    First - Signal bars. They are not actual measurements of signal power but graphical representations via algorithm for us (being the end user) of what the phone signal quality is like from the cell tower to our phone. Because of the various chipsets and components no absolute definitive measurement exists, so it's not all universally the same across each phone manufacturer. This means what is shown as one bar on a phone made by one company will be presented differently (maybe 2 or 3) on another made by another.

    Of course if you want to get into the nitty gritty details signal strength information like RSRP (Reference Signal Received Power) and the quality of signal (RSRQ) and Signal to Noise Ratio (SNR)... These measurements are what the cell tower is transmitting to the phone, and what are shown (via an algorithm) as the signal bars. We can access this by dialing *#0011# into the phone dialer.

    Second - If Samsung were "crippling" the phone's radio power then they could only do it on what the phone transmits... They can't control the power of the signal the phone is receiving from the cell tower.

    Third - If your having buffering issues that is because something is interfering with the cell signal from the tower to your phone. This can be any number of things and it is true that some phone's seem to handle it a bit better... But none of that has to do with the phone's transmitting power.


    -BoneZ- said:
    The second place I notice signal issues is with WiFi. I keep my WiFi strength turned down to keep the RF exposure low, and to keep from broadcasting my WiFi across the whole neighborhood. With my OnePlus 7 Pro, I get 2-3 bars of WiFi in my garage and the WiFi takes about 10-seconds to connect. With the Note 10+, it literally takes minutes to connect to my WiFi in the garage, barely getting 1-bar, once in a while jumping up to 2 bars then back to 1. And I realize that "number of bars don't matter", but they actually do. It's just a cop-out, and proven that they do have some significance.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    I have some serious concerns with the pattern of logic your using. You keep saying that the phone's are crippled but your premise on WiFi and Cell signal examples are based on what the phone is receiving and not transmitting.

    Still lets say that the signal bar for your WiFi connections include the phone's transmitting power... You have already indicated you limit the power output of your router, but have you tried turning it up a little to see if the signal stabilizes? You can have the TX power at it's max without issue so long as your WiFi connection is secured with a password.

    Have you changed channels on the router to less populated one? How about re-orientate the antennas (if applicable, some don't have external antennas)... I did this with my WiFi 6 router after I bought it and have some pretty rock solid connections. I didn't at first, so it maybe worth trying for you?

    You can also try turning off any power saving settings on the phone. You can also try toggling off the setting in developer options that prefers stable wifi over performance. If for some reason it is already turned off then try turning it on.

    I did notice the time it takes to connect to an access point and what maybe is a longer wifi scanning interval. I've gone through the phone and have not found a setting that can change this yet. Still if it takes a few seconds longer to connect then I guess it takes a few seconds longer, so long as it connects to the wifi router.


    -BoneZ- said:
    Now I want to make something clear for those who don't know. Both the OnePlus 7 Pro and the Note 10+ use the same exact Snapdragon 855 SoC. As you'll see in the image HERE, the Snapdragon SoC has (among other things) the Cell radio and the BT/WiFi radios all built into the chip. And if one would look at the spec sheets for the 855 and earlier Qualcomm chips, you'd see that the radios get more powerful year after year.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse


    Understood, but more then chipsets are involved in matters like this



    -BoneZ- said:
    That brings me to Samsung deliberately crippling these devices. The FCC has specific regulations regarding exposure to RF radiation from phones. So Samsung is turning down the power of the Cell and WiFi radios so much to keep well below the guidelines and the RF radiation lower. But this is also crippling the device. It's keeping the device from doing it's number one job: being a phone!
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse

    Again some problems with the way this is all sounding...

    The FCC regulations are about the transmitting power of the radios in our phones. The FCC also has regulations for transmitting power for cell towers.

    So if Samsung follows the regulations they can only do so for what the phone transmits... Which again has no impact, bearing or relation to what the cell tower is transmitting to the phone.
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    scottusa2008 said:
    Much appreciated you went into specifics on your reasoning.. Makes it better to get an understanding and discussion going over what someone is saying. That being said, I wanted to reply to some of what your posting with my own observations/understandings as well (in addition to my previous reply). Took me a bit longer to make this reply, had to do some research on a few things first (wanted to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding a few details) and work has been a bit chaotic due to recent events.




    I have used other phones by other manufacturers with varying degrees of responsiveness. So far my note 10+ hasn't let me down with the settings at the max they can go. I do not get any lag and I have ran some rather intensive applications on the phone (as well as multiple apps that use constant data connections). Lately I've been running a total launcher theme that while impressive has multiple active parts.. Zero lag but I will admit a little bit of a hit to battery performance. Given the sci-fi nature of the theme I am totally ok with that, the phone still lasts all day on a single charge.

    Now if we had a higher refresh rate on our screens... Oh that would be totally fantastic.


    The EQ thing you mentioned, I haven't ran into yet but I can try it later and see if it happens. Mostly I leave my settings on whatever defaults are and dolby atmos turned on. Generally I have to turn down the volume because what movies and music I play sound pretty dang good that the bass tends to get a bit to much.





    Three things I'm finding with your analysis that are troubling...

    First - Signal bars. They are not actual measurements of signal power but graphical representations via algorithm for us (being the end user) of what the phone signal quality is like from the cell tower to our phone. Because of the various chipsets and components no absolute definitive measurement exists, so it's not all universally the same across each phone manufacturer. This means what is shown as one bar on a phone made by one company will be presented differently (maybe 2 or 3) on another made by another.

    Of course if you want to get into the nitty gritty details signal strength information like RSRP (Reference Signal Received Power) and the quality of signal (RSRQ) and Signal to Noise Ratio (SNR)... These measurements are what the cell tower is transmitting to the phone, and what are shown (via an algorithm) as the signal bars. We can access this by dialing *#0011# into the phone dialer.

    Second - If Samsung were "crippling" the phone's radio power then they could only do it on what the phone transmits... They can't control the power of the signal the phone is receiving from the cell tower.

    Third - If your having buffering issues that is because something is interfering with the cell signal from the tower to your phone. This can be any number of things and it is true that some phone's seem to handle it a bit better... But none of that has to do with the phone's transmitting power.




    I have some serious concerns with the pattern of logic your using. You keep saying that the phone's are crippled but your premise on WiFi and Cell signal examples are based on what the phone is receiving and not transmitting.

    Still lets say that the signal bar for your WiFi connections include the phone's transmitting power... You have already indicated you limit the power output of your router, but have you tried turning it up a little to see if the signal stabilizes? You can have the TX power at it's max without issue so long as your WiFi connection is secured with a password.

    Have you changed channels on the router to less populated one? How about re-orientate the antennas (if applicable, some don't have external antennas)... I did this with my WiFi 6 router after I bought it and have some pretty rock solid connections. I didn't at first, so it maybe worth trying for you?

    You can also try turning off any power saving settings on the phone. You can also try toggling off the setting in developer options that prefers stable wifi over performance. If for some reason it is already turned off then try turning it on.

    I did notice the time it takes to connect to an access point and what maybe is a longer wifi scanning interval. I've gone through the phone and have not found a setting that can change this yet. Still if it takes a few seconds longer to connect then I guess it takes a few seconds longer, so long as it connects to the wifi router.





    Understood, but more then chipsets are involved in matters like this





    Again some problems with the way this is all sounding...

    The FCC regulations are about the transmitting power of the radios in our phones. The FCC also has regulations for transmitting power for cell towers.

    So if Samsung follows the regulations they can only do so for what the phone transmits... Which again has no impact, bearing or relation to what the cell tower is transmitting to the phone.
    Click to expand...
    Click to collapse


    I think everything you say falls flat when other devices perform better right next to a Samsung device with all those scenarios and parameters involved.

    No matter what scenario you throw at it, another device in the same position doesn't have the problem Samsungs do. I have many phones and tablets on the same networks that perform where Samsung lags and hangs.

    That's the point, not that there's rules and regulations that EVERYONE follows, it's that Samsung chooses to not optimize as well as other manufacturers, which to be honest has been the same story since their Android adoption.

    We just all forgot because the hardware almost overcomes the software limitations to be barely good enough.

    Also all hardware is basically the same now, just rearranged differently inside phones but to the same manufacturer specs and connections or else the built in fail-safes won't let them work, so then what does that leave as the real issue?
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