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[Soldering?] Move internal memory chip

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By oles, Junior Member on 18th February 2013, 08:58 PM
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20th January 2014, 10:43 AM |#11  
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solder with care
Solder with care mate, else it will be totally gone
 
 
20th January 2014, 10:49 AM |#12  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psytr0nic

0,1% of chance .. playing with Samsung EMMC chip = bye bye phone . look around forum or elsewhere 100% of bricked is due to it .
Question : what make you confident to say that your internal memory is good ?
to remind : it is also your phone flash chip which manage boot sequence and all . don't forget it .


every time I tried with hot air , I removed chip with missing pads cause of glue under chip which make hard to remove .
why not to give a try ? have good luck

The glue in samsung is very easy to remove you just need to heat the board up to 250C and gently scratch the glued area with a needle. Do not worry on the removed pads as 1/3 of the pads under the EMMC are not connected and therefore not needed. Always clean the chip from the glue and use leaded solder for best shiny connections.
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27th February 2014, 01:22 PM |#13  
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If you need any help you can always message me and I'll try my best to answer your questions.

Regards,
Ryan[/QUOTE]

Can you please explain more about JTAG.., types and the connections, how to get files for the different phones, where can we get the software etc. Thank you.
27th February 2014, 01:25 PM |#14  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richie16171

If you need any help you can always message me and I'll try my best to answer your questions.

Regards,
Ryan

Can you please please explain more about JTAG.., types and the connections, how to get the files from different phones, where can we get the softare etc. Thank you.[/QUOTE]

You will need special programmer boxes like riffbox to be able to rewrite the bootloader. JTAG is a dedicated space on the board where the riffbox will communicate with the phone.
27th February 2014, 03:11 PM |#15  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnArChYm

Can you please please explain more about JTAG.., types and the connections, how to get the files from different phones, where can we get the softare etc. Thank you.

You will need special programmer boxes like riffbox to be able to rewrite the bootloader. JTAG is a dedicated space on the board where the riffbox will communicate with the phone.[/QUOTE]

Thank you., what about the riffbox connections? Which pin to connect what and is it common to all devices?
27th February 2014, 05:05 PM |#16  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richie16171

You will need special programmer boxes like riffbox to be able to rewrite the bootloader. JTAG is a dedicated space on the board where the riffbox will communicate with the phone.

Thank you., what about the riffbox connections? Which pin to connect what and is it common to all devices?[/QUOTE]

Edit: I already got the site. And everything is explained in forum there. If anyone wants.. you can find here http://faq.riffbox.org/showcat.html
13th March 2014, 08:30 AM |#17  
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Would like the learn how to reball
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnArChYm

Hey guys,

I know this thread is a little bit old but I'll try to give in my 2 cents maybe someone here may find it helpful

So I come from background where I do around 20 bga reballs per week, so I do know a thing or two I guess about this although my knowledge on Samsung platform is relatively low compared to an iphone logic.

So to begin with replacing the emmc chip alone is not enough as you'll need a programmer box which connects to a jtag interface which is able to rewrite the initial files like bootrom to the emmc. You can find these boxes at any prominent gsm repair shops; boxes named such as RiffBox or Z3X Samsung box are the best I found recently.

Having said that before any repair is attempted by mainly removing the flash chip it is imperative to try to resurrect the phone using these said boxes, to try to find whether or not the NAND chip is actually detected. As one may have simply installed a ROM which is not compatible with the phone and all that is required is to rewrite the bootrom files. If the NAND (basically the same name as a flash chip) fails to be detected then obviously something went wrong and it either could be the NAND is burnt inside, or the NAND has some cracks under its critical ball pins or even may be a problem that the main power management chip inside the phone is failing from supplying usually around 3V to power up the NAND.

The emmc chip at least found in a samsung is a 14 by 14 pins which only about 1/3 of it's pins are critical, the rest are dummy and do not worry if they eventually get removed, while removing the chip or cleaning the board after desoldering prior installing the new chip.

Some tips on reworking:

  • Always cover critical glued components like CPU + POP (package on package) RAM, baseband processor usually XGOLD found in Samsung.
  • Clean surrounding chip glue before attempting to remove by giving around 250C of heat and with a needle scratching the glue around
  • Do not exceed more than 350C to remove the actual chip to prevent more damage to the built in tracks inside the motherboard.

Last and not least a schematic for your phone would always be a lot of help to help you detect what voltages are missing on bootup to make sure that the boot up sequence is starting fine and also the relative points of each pin under a chip while knowing which pins are critical and which are dummies, or NC (not connected)

If you need any help you can always message me and I'll try my best to answer your questions.

Regards,
Ryan

Hi Ryan,

My son's galaxy s3 i9300 was inadvertently given a spin in the washing machine. When I realised what had happened I took it apart into its various components and put it in rice for a week. When I switched it on everything worked except the cell phone signal. From what I can gather the eMMC chip has been damaged and no software can fix it. I don't have it with me now but I think IMEI and baseband is unknown. The EFS folder is empty or corrupt.

Stumbling across your post I was interested in the fact that you seem to be an expert in re-balling. My son has since got a new phone and since I am a basic amateur in phone repair (for family and friends) I have been toying with the idea of replacing the eMMC chip on the s3 after watching this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s38vQxXv0GE

I don't mind if I buy the chip and it doesn't work I am more intent on gaining the experience and going through the stages. Do you think this is a good idea and do you have any tips or things I can research on the topic?

Yiannos

---------- Post added at 07:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:14 AM ----------

Sorry I meant this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds04B...ature=youtu.be
13th March 2014, 12:48 PM |#18  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yiannos50

Hi Ryan,

My son's galaxy s3 i9300 was inadvertently given a spin in the washing machine...

Hi,

If the imei is available (null), it could be the case that it needs repairing rather than actually chaging the eMMC chip , however you'll need a special tool to do this, which honestly do not know which exactly is as I'm more into hardware repairs rather than software.

Another possible issue could be that the phone can also have corrosion around critical components, ie around the main baseband supply, which is stopping from the baseband switch on, thus no signal or any radio communication from starting up. It would be best to have a microscope and inspect each part of the board for bad components, rather than rushing to the eMMC replacement.

It's very important to read this post very carefully and understand it as it is not easy to be done, but it is very much possible. And find a lot of youtube videos before even trying so you'll be more familiar with the process and different techniques.

Anyways for the most interesting part

Basically the eMMC chip is a 14 by 14 bga, ball grid array chip which is fairly easy to reball comapred to other complex ones, like baseband processor or the main application processor, You'll also be needing a reballing stencil to put the balls on top of the solder pins, and solder paste to paste the solder onto the holes and a hot air gun to melt that solder into balls. (Basically the solder paste will melt between those holes inside the stencil and will form nice silverish balls.

The chip also has got a lot of not connected pads (aka dummy pads) so do not worry when removing the chip as you'll be more then likely to lift pads from the board especially if this your first reball job.

First of all, you'll need to clean the surrounding glue around the chip by using around 200C and with a needle scrape off the glue, be very gentle not to scrape any tracks or board layers.

Then to remove the chip from the board use around 350C (always ramping up the temp), very important to use kapton tape around the surroundings to reduce heat stress. Personally I use the following temperatures: (do not use any nozzle with the heat gun as the chip is large and you need the heat to dispersed all over the chip)

1st min 180C full air
2nd min 280C full air
4th min 350C full air until the surrounding components turn silverish and are easy to lift, at that time get a very sharp needle and gently (very gently) start to pry up with ease the chip from one side, until it is fully lifted.

Then you'll need to clean the board, basically put flux and with a fine tip soldering iron clean the pads gently until all underfilled glue is no more remaining and the pads are nice and shiny and set the board aside.

If you'll buy a new eMMC chip most probably you'll have it reballed from the supplier. If not pre reballed, you ll need to reball it using a reballing stencil and solder paste.

Finally align back the eMMC chip over the board in the correct way, always note where is pin A1 and solder it back by ramping up heat again, same process as removing the chip.

The last process is all based on software, basically you'll have to copy the bootloader from a good working S3 phone to this one, as the new eMMC chip is empty of data, and obviously without the bootloader so the phone wouldn't be able to switch on.There is a process somewhere on the net how this is exactly done.

Ryan
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13th March 2014, 02:04 PM |#19  
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Ryan,

Thanks a million for setting me on the right path. I'll let you know what happens.

Yiannos
17th April 2014, 01:06 AM |#20  
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Question Data recovery - Siemens A31
Hello everyone,

this thread seems to be what I've been looking for. My Siemens A31 got some water from a torrential rain while it was on. When I got to removing the battery, the phone was already off. I dried all accessible parts but I did not have the necessary torx screwdriver, so some water stayed inside. It was Friday evening and I got the screwdriver no earlier than on Monday. There was some corrosion in the phone, of course. It could not be turned on and subsequent cleaning with alcohol and even ultrasound improved only the look of the main board, but not its behavior. The only sign of life was that it seemingly recharged the battery while connected to the charger.

I have asked several repair services and people and I am quite confused whether it is possible to recover the data by soldering the memory chip into another A31, a functioning one of course. Last time, I asked a laptop service and I was told it is impossible, not just because of the difficulty of soldering a BGA chip. They told me it would not work because the phone would get blocked due to IMEI mismatch! This was surprising for me. If it is true, it implies that the IMEI is stored in both the flash memory and some other chip. I was unable to find any evidence for such a claim on the Internet.

Can anyone tell me if the target phone with replaced flash memory will actually work, assuming the memory is functioning? The video referred to by yiannos50 suggests it may really work. Anyone else has tried it? Two people in this discussion were about to do so.
17th April 2014, 09:03 AM |#21  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepaLogik

Hello everyone,

this thread seems to be what I've been looking for. My Siemens A31 got some water from a torrential rain while it was on. When I got to removing the battery, the phone was already off. I dried all accessible parts but I did not have the necessary torx screwdriver, so some water stayed inside. It was Friday evening and I got the screwdriver no earlier than on Monday. There was some corrosion in the phone, of course. It could not be turned on and subsequent cleaning with alcohol and even ultrasound improved only the look of the main board, but not its behavior. The only sign of life was that it seemingly recharged the battery while connected to the charger.

I have asked several repair services and people and I am quite confused whether it is possible to recover the data by soldering the memory chip into another A31, a functioning one of course. Last time, I asked a laptop service and I was told it is impossible, not just because of the difficulty of soldering a BGA chip. They told me it would not work because the phone would get blocked due to IMEI mismatch! This was surprising for me. If it is true, it implies that the IMEI is stored in both the flash memory and some other chip. I was unable to find any evidence for such a claim on the Internet.

Can anyone tell me if the target phone with replaced flash memory will actually work, assuming the memory is functioning? The video referred to by yiannos50 suggests it may really work. Anyone else has tried it? Two people in this discussion were about to do so.

Each phone brand is somewhat different but I'll comment on what I know. iPhone uses 2 chips to match an IMEI namely the baseband CPU and a serial flash IC, if the IMEI do not match than the phone would not be able to activate or do any radio related activity such as calling, sms, gps, wifi. Samsung on the other hand uses both the baseband CPU and eMMC ic again if a mismatch exist the radio activity will fail to work.

This is done in order to secure the phone, as you may know the IMEI is the unique ID that a phone can have.

With regards to your query, yes there may be a need to match between the NAND of your device and the main applciation/baseband cpu (since in older phones, these cpu's where combined as one due to less complexity in electronics). However being that the IMEI does not match one can still take the data from the phone's NAND chip as these are completely different sectors and electronic lines. In fact to restore the boot sector of a Samsung either due to bricking the device or maybe chip failure, writing directly to the eMMC chip one does not need to have the radio firmware online.

If you are willing to repair the phone I may be able to investigate it for you and look for the possibilty to repair the phone for you. If you're interested pm me.
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