[WORKING] Ubuntu on Vibrant UPDATE:11/05/10

lqaddict · Aug 17, 2010

angryPirate12 said:
Look at it from this standpoint, every major phone release has hardware that can rival netbooks and ultra-portables, when the dual-core snapdragons hit later on, they may even be on par with low end notebooks. They contain cellular modems as well as wifi so you're constantly connected on a device that can fit in your pocket.

On the software side every major mobile operating system out there is constantly evolving and adding more and more features of that you can find on any PC/Linux/OSX box in the world. Albeit they're slimmed down versions, designed to be lightweight and functional on a smaller sized screen.

Add in google voice, a service that you can have your cell phone calls funneled into a single number or have your google voice number funneled into any other phone number you tell it to, plus you have skype. Installing Debian on a mobile device doesnt change the fact its still a cell phone the only it changes is how much this cell phone can do without restrictions.

Its the people who push software and hardware to there limits and into places they were never designed to be, that push the technology world and push the companies to do new things. There the pioneers who are trying to marry the inevitable before anyone else is ready. Those are the people who make companies like Google, Nokia, Intel, etc etc realize that there is potential in a risk, when there is a community ready to back them up. If it wasn't for the indie developers out there trying to minimalize linux to be used on cell phones we wouldn't have our beloved Android today.

You ask why, I'll answer because its inevitable. You can join the front lines or you can wait.

I totally agree about the evolution of OSS and linux, ten/twelve years ago linux was frowned upon, and look at it now - the most versatile OS on the market.
That was my driving point why go a step back instead of developing the Android and Maemo (btw, whoever is looking for the fully functional Debian on a mobile phone should check Nokia's Maemo initiative and N900).
A bit on my "step back" comment - you have to realize that the utilization of available resources is at the premium for the mobile devices - whereas hardware became more and more robust, compact and affordable, the battery life still remains to be desired - right, what's there for mobility if you have to be bound to a power outlet whenever you go, well in this case you are not going anywhere); so the point is, the full OS will drain our beloved phones like a vampire drains its victim of blood. That's where Android and other ported OS's come into place, they are especially designed to keep those precious battery charges as much as possible.
I am pretty sure in the coming years we will see more and more devices running the ported linux OS, whether it will be Android, Maemo or something else. I doubt it there will be a mobile device running full linux shebang with Gnome/KDE etc - unless it is just for the fun factor of it.

scrizz · Aug 17, 2010

angryPirate12 said:
Look at it from this standpoint, every major phone release has hardware that can rival netbooks and ultra-portables, when the dual-core snapdragons hit later on, they may even be on par with low end notebooks. They contain cellular modems as well as wifi so you're constantly connected on a device that can fit in your pocket.

On the software side every major mobile operating system out there is constantly evolving and adding more and more features of that you can find on any PC/Linux/OSX box in the world. Albeit they're slimmed down versions, designed to be lightweight and functional on a smaller sized screen.

Add in google voice, a service that you can have your cell phone calls funneled into a single number or have your google voice number funneled into any other phone number you tell it to, plus you have skype. Installing Debian on a mobile device doesnt change the fact its still a cell phone the only it changes is how much this cell phone can do without restrictions.

Its the people who push software and hardware to there limits and into places they were never designed to be, that push the technology world and push the companies to do new things. There the pioneers who are trying to marry the inevitable before anyone else is ready. Those are the people who make companies like Google, Nokia, Intel, etc etc realize that there is potential in a risk, when there is a community ready to back them up. If it wasn't for the indie developers out there trying to minimalize linux to be used on cell phones we wouldn't have our beloved Android today.

You ask why, I'll answer because its inevitable. You can join the front lines or you can wait.

very well put

jeremiah_mn · Aug 17, 2010

I guess when I need a computer, I have a laptop or desktop for that. I don't see how something like this would be very valuable. More of a gimmick imo... what would be some practicle uses of it?

scrizz · Aug 17, 2010

lqaddict said:
I totally agree about the evolution of OSS and linux, ten/twelve years ago linux was frowned upon, and look at it now - the most versatile OS on the market.
That was my driving point why go a step back instead of developing the Android and Maemo (btw, whoever is looking for the fully functional Debian on a mobile phone should check Nokia's Maemo initiative and N900).
A bit on my "step back" comment - you have to realize that the utilization of available resources is at the premium for the mobile devices - whereas hardware became more and more robust, compact and affordable, the battery life still remains to be desired - right, what's there for mobility if you have to be bound to a power outlet whenever you go, well in this case you are not going anywhere); so the point is, the full OS will drain our beloved phones like a vampire drains its victim of blood. That's where Android and other ported OS's come into place, they are especially designed to keep those precious battery charges as much as possible.
I am pretty sure in the coming years we will see more and more devices running the ported linux OS, whether it will be Android, Maemo or something else. I doubt it there will be a mobile device running full linux shebang with Gnome/KDE etc - unless it is just for the fun factor of it.

So why did u buy a phone that has a 4" screen?
If battery life is your concern, that's the last thing you should purchase.

Why would you buy a 3g phone?
If battery life is your concern, you should put the phone on edge, it extends your battery life.

Why would you buy a phone with a GPS?
If battery life is your concern, Having a phone with a GPS radio enabled uses your battery faster than one without GPS.

Why would you buy a phone with a 1GHz processor?
If battery life is your concern, you should go with a much lower clocked phone.

You sound like the perfect candidate for a regular phone(aka not Smartphone).
A regular phone features longer battery life, plus it doesn't bog you down with unnecessary things like 3g/wifi/big screen/GPS/fast processor.....

This thread was not meant for people who say, why.
It is meant for people who say, why not!

scrizz · Aug 17, 2010

jeremiah_mn said:
I guess when I need a computer, I have a laptop or desktop for that. I don't see how something like this would be very valuable. More of a gimmick imo... what would be some practicle uses of it?

why would you buy a phone with GPS and internet?
it's just a gimmick obviously

they have standalone GPS units for that, and you can use the internet when u get home....

Why would you run Windows on a Mac?
They have windows based PCs for that

angryPirate12 · Aug 17, 2010

The world is only a matter of your perception. That isn't a dis or a dig at you, it just simply means that how you view the world is of your own opinion as is ours. Where you don't see anything but a waste of time in this concept, others see the potential. Whats oblivious to everyone is the implications such a feat can yield. It could very well be a giant waste of time, and at the same time it could be the starting point to the next generation of mobile computing.

But just because those of you who can't perceive the practicality in this doesn't mean it shouldn't be done, it just means its of no importance to you at this moment. So don't come here asking people why bother, or tell them its dumb to do it, just simply read whats being discussed until it stops being of interest to you and move on to something else that matters more to you than this.

With all that being said, we have pulled this topic way off track, and we should all stop talking the semantics beyond the motivation and let those who care about it get back to talking about how it can be done.

jforme · Aug 17, 2010

well said

angryPirate12 said:
Look at it from this standpoint, every major phone release has hardware that can rival netbooks and ultra-portables, when the dual-core snapdragons hit later on, they may even be on par with low end notebooks. They contain cellular modems as well as wifi so you're constantly connected on a device that can fit in your pocket.

On the software side every major mobile operating system out there is constantly evolving and adding more and more features of that you can find on any PC/Linux/OSX box in the world. Albeit they're slimmed down versions, designed to be lightweight and functional on a smaller sized screen.

Add in google voice, a service that you can have your cell phone calls funneled into a single number or have your google voice number funneled into any other phone number you tell it to, plus you have skype. Installing Debian on a mobile device doesnt change the fact its still a cell phone the only it changes is how much this cell phone can do without restrictions.

Its the people who push software and hardware to there limits and into places they were never designed to be, that push the technology world and push the companies to do new things. There the pioneers who are trying to marry the inevitable before anyone else is ready. Those are the people who make companies like Google, Nokia, Intel, etc etc realize that there is potential in a risk, when there is a community ready to back them up. If it wasn't for the indie developers out there trying to minimalize linux to be used on cell phones we wouldn't have our beloved Android today.

You ask why, I'll answer because its inevitable. You can join the front lines or you can wait.

2 words my friend, "well said".

jeremiah_mn · Aug 17, 2010

scrizz said:
why would you buy a phone with GPS and internet?
it's just a gimmick obviously

they have standalone GPS units for that, and you can use the internet when u get home....

Why would you run Windows on a Mac?
They have windows based PCs for that

Well, i can do gps on a phone, plenty big enough of a screen, and everything needs internet these days as far as apps go. Enlighten me, what can you do on debian on a phone, that is a) practicle and b) something I can't just do in android?

I'm not saying it's a dumb idea, just wondering what the realistic applications would be? so far I haven't really seen any posted here. Mostly just seeing post of people saying that this would be cool, just for the sake of it being cool?

lqaddict · Aug 17, 2010

scrizz said:
So why did u buy a phone that has a 4" screen?
If battery life is your concern, that's the last thing you should purchase.

Why would you buy a 3g phone?
If battery life is your concern, you should put the phone on edge, it extends your battery life.

Why would you buy a phone with a GPS?
If battery life is your concern, Having a phone with a GPS radio enabled uses your battery faster than one without GPS.

Why would you buy a phone with a 1GHz processor?
If battery life is your concern, you should go with a much lower clocked phone.

You sound like the perfect candidate for a regular phone(aka not Smartphone).
A regular phone features longer battery life, plus it doesn't bog you down with unnecessary things like 3g/wifi/big screen/GPS/fast processor.....

This thread was not meant for people who say, why.
It is meant for people who say, why not!

Why my buying decisions concern you I do not understand, moreover what it has to do with the subject on hand?
Just for you information, I bought the smartphone so I can stay close to my friends and family on the go with social networks, I use google maps on it to find the places nearby to take the ladies out, and if I need to see what others are saying about the place I am about to go I can easily access it, I use my cell phone as an mp3 player while on the bus, I read some news too and updates are faster via 3g then EDGE, so instead of carrying 6+ devices around me I chose one that is compact enough to fit in my pocket and you should admit that 4" SAMOLED display is gorgeous.
So if you got your smartphone to run full linux OS on - more power to you, I think you would be better off with a netbook.

jeremiah_mn · Aug 17, 2010

For all you people saying that others are just being negative when we ask why you would want this on your phone. I can't speak for others, but my comment was in response to the op's second post of this thread as seen below. So a) I think my comment was very much relavent, and b) I've still yet to see anyone talk about what they would do on their phone with this full fletched os other than say look what I can do.

jzero88 said:
I'm surprised that not one person is interested in this...

I'm not surprised there is a lack of interest based on the fact you haven't shown anyone what the practicle use of something like this would be. I'm not suggesting there isn't one, just that nobody in this thread has mentioned one yet.

the3dman · Aug 17, 2010

One practical use would be to be able to make edits on roms/apps directly from your phone and be able to sign them and all. In a dual boot situation this would be great.

igm503 · Aug 17, 2010

theres close to a flame war going on here

while i agree it would be awesome to be able to have full fledged linux

i think before any devs do this, more recourses are going to be focused on lag fixes and vanilla android roms etc. but the idea of this makes me antsy

lqaddict · Aug 17, 2010

the3dman13 said:
One practical use would be to be able to make edits on roms/apps directly from your phone and be able to sign them and all. In a dual boot situation this would be great.

Thank you! At least I see one reasonable idea. I take it there is no mobile Android SDK available to do it right within the Android OS on the phone.
Still will be strange to see a developer in a coffee shop hacking his phone up, but sure it is feasible.
One of the reasons I was bashed when I told a N900 user that I have an Android and it has linux underneath was that if I can X11 forward on my phone then I can call it running linux, but yeah X11 forwarding is what we are all doing nowadays on our phones

jeremiah_mn · Aug 17, 2010

the3dman13 said:
One practical use would be to be able to make edits on roms/apps directly from your phone and be able to sign them and all. In a dual boot situation this would be great.

That sounds usefull, especially the dual boot part. Thanks for info. Not trying at all to start a flame war either.

Would be extra sweet if you could dual boot a device like this into a full fletched os, use the usb/hdmi cable out to a monitor and then use wireless keyboard and mouse for input, would be like a whole (not extremely powerfull) computer to use with a regular size monitor.

jzero88 · Aug 17, 2010

angryPirate12 and scrizz,
thank you for your insight, I could not have explained it better myself!!

As for Lqaddict,

Thank you for this post,

Why my buying decisions concern you I do not understand, moreover what it has to do with the subject on hand?
Just for you information, I bought the smartphone so I can stay close to my friends and family on the go with social networks, I use google maps on it to find the places nearby to take the ladies out, and if I need to see what others are saying about the place I am about to go I can easily access it, I use my cell phone as an mp3 player while on the bus, I read some news too and updates are faster via 3g then EDGE, so instead of carrying 6+ devices around me I chose one that is compact enough to fit in my pocket and you should admit that 4" SAMOLED display is gorgeous.
So if you got your smartphone to run full linux OS on - more power to you, I think you would be better off with a netbook.

You not only answered your own question you had asked in your very first post, but also might have enlightened yourself, read it again... You just explained to us all the reason's why you have a smart phone isntead of a basic phone, which is the same reasons many of us also purchase smart phones. The thing that amazes me is that it seems there should be limitations as to what to do this these powerful, pocket sized devices after all of your concerns have been met. Why shouldn't I be able to run Debian on my cellphone? Because it will kill my battery more quickly than using the slimmed down version of Linux (Android)? That seems like a personal problem I might have once we do get Debian up and running and not of your concern. I do thank you though for your concern but would much rather be having a conversation that contributes to what this thread was created for than going back and forth with "WHY" or "WHY NOT".

Honestly, it is only a matter of time till we have hand held computers like this. As you said before you are able to put 6+ devices into one? Why not add a full functioning computer? You wouldn't want to be able to only see you .mp3 files on your phone and not play them would you? So why would you want to limit yourself when you could have a full running computer as well?

Most importantly, cell phones are not necessities, they are wants, and I want what I want too

lqaddict · Aug 17, 2010

jzero88 said:
angryPirate12 and scrizz,
thank you for your insight, I could not have explained it better myself!!

As for Lqaddict,

Thank you for this post,

You not only answered your own question you had asked in your very first post, but also might have enlightened yourself, read it again... You just explained to us all the reason's why you have a smart phone isntead of a basic phone, which is the same reasons many of us also purchase smart phones. The thing that amazes me is that it seems there should be limitations as to what to do this these powerful, pocket sized devices after all of your concerns have been met. Why shouldn't I be able to run Debian on my cellphone? Because it will kill my battery more quickly than using the slimmed down version of Linux (Android)? That seems like a personal problem I might have once we do get Debian up and running and not of your concern. I do thank you though for your concern but would much rather be having a conversation that contributes to what this thread was created for than going back and forth with "WHY" or "WHY NOT".

Honestly, it is only a matter of time till we have hand held computers like this. As you said before you are able to put 6+ devices into one? Why not add a full functioning computer? You wouldn't want to be able to only see you .mp3 files on your phone and not play them would you? So why would you want to limit yourself when you could have a full running computer as well?

Most importantly, cell phones are not necessities, they are wants, and I want what I want too

I am not saying you should or should not run Debian on the mobile phones. What I am pitching toward is why re-invent the wheel instead of improving the car?
I could definitely see Android evolve into a well rounded OS designed for the mobile applications, there are tools that I wish were available for it right now, like the mobile SDK with a compiler and the way to write, modify and run custom apps without the need to be connected to a PC. Don't get me wrong, I am not here to commandeer where the development should go.
As you can see by this thread the Debian interest hasn't spark a lot of attention, don't blame me for stealing the subject, etc. I posed a question and it got into "why or why not" discussion, and just a few people voiced their opinion why running full linux OS might benefit. IMHO, it helps overall development process, yes there will be selected few hackers who would port Ubuntu or any other Linux flavors for our phones for the fun factor.
IMHO, Android is what the embedded OS for the mobile devices should be, if you look at Maemo it's only found its way to Nokia devices, Apple is pushing their iOS (I am pretty sure some fan boys would love to run MacOS on their iPhones).
The best advantage Android has over their competitors is the availability on a variety of hardware.
Well, I should stop here since I took the discussion into the wrong turn. Sorry for the hijack, please continue...

jzero88 · Aug 17, 2010

lol, I still think you are missing a big part of the picture but yea, this has gotten way off of topic and I agree, this tangent is officially closed.

jon6206 · Aug 17, 2010

i'd like to be able to run real torrent clients on my phone not just on my laptop. p2p sharing

jzero88 · Aug 17, 2010

Well actually aBTC works beautifully on the Vibrant. Could never get it to work on the good ol' G1 though. Try that app out.

[[ Cold ]] · Aug 17, 2010

this might be the first non off-topic post...

UBUNTU RUNNING IN A GALAXY S

http://blog.coralic.nl/2010/08/17/ubuntu-on-samsung-galaxy-s-android/

youtube vid...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWLOqVdtbkw

[*WORKING*] **Ubuntu on Vibrant** UPDATE:11/05/10

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[WORKING] Ubuntu on Vibrant UPDATE:11/05/10