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General 5G performance

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zymphad

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2013
919
527
OnePlus 9
Google Pixel 6 Pro
1st gen vs 2nd gen modem from Qualcomm is about twice the difference from certain reviewers.

Qualcomm modem better than Samsung which is why Exynos this year uses Qualcomm modem. But Google chose the Samsung modem from last year instead. Just because it is not Qualcomm probably.

So makes a huge difference.

To you may not matter. To me if I am paying 900$ for a year old tech that is singificantly inferior, and considering this is a phone and the modem is terrible compared to competition, matters to me. Just another way Google continues to give the finger to Pixel users every year they find a way to do that. If this is the case.

I just like knowing when Google will start to treat Pixel users same level of respect as Samsung with their fans.
 
1st gen vs 2nd gen modem from Qualcomm is about twice the difference from certain reviewers.

Qualcomm modem better than Samsung which is why Exynos this year uses Qualcomm modem. But Google chose the Samsung modem from last year instead. Just because it is not Qualcomm probably.

So makes a huge difference.

To you may not matter. To me if I am paying 900$ for a year old tech that is singificantly inferior, and considering this is a phone and the modem is terrible compared to competition, matters to me. Just another way Google continues to give the finger to Pixel users every year they find a way to do that. If this is the case.

I just like knowing when Google will start to treat Pixel users same level of respect as Samsung with their fans.
dont forget it also doesnt have the samsung price
 
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zymphad

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2013
919
527
OnePlus 9
Google Pixel 6 Pro
dont forget it also doesnt have the samsung price
Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
 

DR4LUC0N

Senior Member
Jun 1, 2014
121
36
Google Pixel 6 Pro
Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
I have never had a pixel device, but I can still say it's an amazing deal. You're someone who expects an exact $1200 Samsung clone for $900. You're either a troll or shallow, no body likes either of those things.
 

ggreenwood334

Senior Member
May 26, 2013
661
158
Google Pixel 6 Pro
Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
Agree for the most part. We can't forget these are cell phones. And I for one expect the best coverage and speeds here for a 2021 flagship. After using a phone for a certain amount of time, they are still just a dang phone.
 
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1st gen vs 2nd gen modem from Qualcomm is about twice the difference from certain reviewers.

Qualcomm modem better than Samsung which is why Exynos this year uses Qualcomm modem. But Google chose the Samsung modem from last year instead. Just because it is not Qualcomm probably.

So makes a huge difference.

To you may not matter. To me if I am paying 900$ for a year old tech that is singificantly inferior, and considering this is a phone and the modem is terrible compared to competition, matters to me. Just another way Google continues to give the finger to Pixel users every year they find a way to do that. If this is the case.

I just like knowing when Google will start to treat Pixel users same level of respect as Samsung with their fans.
Ok, but that still doesn't explain what would make a newer modem better...? Given how fast 4g is, what tangible benefit (other than saying "I have the newest therefore best") would the newer modem potentially offer?
 
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Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
In order to get the new technology it would cost more then 900. Sounds like you are trying to compare apples with oranges. If you want the newest tech, then you pay for it. If you think samsung is the greatest, why consider pixel?
 
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goddammit

Member
Nov 22, 2009
48
30
I've never fully understood the benefits of 5g for cell phones. If I can get 200 Mbps down and 50 Mbps up on 4g, what are the benefits of 5g? And, regarding a year-old vs current-year modem, why would that matter?

Density. That's your answer. I used to work in one of those financial districts packed with skyscrapers. During working hours, people density in that area is about 200,000 per square kilometer if not more. 4G has full bars and download speed is miserable 2-3 Mbps. That's outside. Literally 200 meters away from that area I'm getting 150 Mbps.

Think about it, that area has all the money in the world and they can't get a decent mobile broadband speed. So they have invented 5G for areas like that, stadiums, etc. Not some rural farms.
 
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MrBelter

Senior Member
Apr 10, 2011
1,349
342
I've never fully understood the benefits of 5g for cell phones. If I can get 200 Mbps down and 50 Mbps up on 4g, what are the benefits of 5g? And, regarding a year-old vs current-year modem, why would that matter?
Capacity, 5G has so much more capacity per cell site. Ever been in a crowded placed with monstrous 4G signal but absolutely nothing is happening when you want to do something, well 5G all but eliminates that.
 
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gmfeld

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2008
186
16
Boston
I am not at all technical when it comes to 5G, chips, modems, etc. I recently read a piece in some tech journal that spoke about 5G connectivity and speed differences in the Pixel Pro as between carrier versions (ATT and Verizon) and unlocked. I think it was referring to the modem differences as well. I couldn't make heads or tails of it and couldn't figure out what conclusions the writer was coming to. Are there substantive modem, connectivity etc. issues between the different versions of the Pixel 6 Pro?
 
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roirraW "edor" ehT

Recognized Contributor
I am not at all technical when it comes to 5G, chips, modems, etc. I recently read a piece in some tech journal that spoke about 5G connectivity and speed differences in the Pixel Pro as between carrier versions (ATT and Verizon) and unlocked. I think it was referring to the modem differences as well. I couldn't make heads or tails of it and couldn't figure out what conclusions the writer was coming to. Are there substantive modem, connectivity etc. issues between the different versions of the Pixel 6 Pro?
Keeping it simple, there are two kinds of 5G. Let's call them regular and mm-wave. mm-wave is only good for folks who happen to be in the right place, within a very short distance to a mm-wave cell tower. Since there are so few places in the United States that have mm-wave, chances are that you won't miss anything no matter what.

All the Pixel 6 and 6 Pro have regular 5G. There are some advantages of regular 5G over 4G, however, you likely won't experience as much difference as there was between 4G and 3G. I haven't been concerned with 5G at all yet.
 

gmfeld

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2008
186
16
Boston
Keeping it simple, there are two kinds of 5G. Let's call them regular and mm-wave. mm-wave is only good for folks who happen to be in the right place, within a very short distance to a mm-wave cell tower. Since there are so few places in the United States that have mm-wave, chances are that you won't miss anything no matter what.

All the Pixel 6 and 6 Pro have regular 5G. There are some advantages of regular 5G over 4G, however, you likely won't experience as much difference as there was between 4G and 3G. I haven't been concerned with 5G at all yet.
Thanks for your explanation. That article I read made the point that some versions of the Pixel have mm-wave and some don't. I couldn't tell which did, and if it was important to have it. From your comment I'm not going to be concerned about getting a version that has it.
 
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krips2003

Senior Member
Sep 27, 2009
692
189
Louisville
Thanks for your explanation. That article I read made the point that some versions of the Pixel have mm-wave and some don't. I couldn't tell which did, and if it was important to have it. From your comment I'm not going to be concerned about getting a version that has it.
Here's the link that list the carrier compatibility with 5G.
FYI.. Pixel 6 Pro have both sub-6 and mmWave. Pixel 6 lacks mmWave. But it's available on Verizon model of Pixel 6. But you end up paying extra $100.


Another thing that I found out from the table is that, most of the countries on that list uses only Sub-6 standard of 5G except for USA and Australia.
 
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I'm currently using my P6P on Google Fi (which is essentially T-Mobile) and my P6 on Verizon

It's interesting that on P6P (Google Fi 5G) my current speeds are 490/9ish and my P6 on Verizon is only pulling 31ish/2.5ish. I'm truly interested now if it's in regards to the phone model or my service providers. I'm going to run a few test and play around with this!

If anyone wants to see the speed results I can upload those as well! But overall data speeds and consistency has been amazing on the P6P/P6
 
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MrBelter

Senior Member
Apr 10, 2011
1,349
342
They could have left mmWave off and dropped the price another £50 as far as i am concerned. I see over 500Mbit regularly on my Sub-6 only Pixel 5.
 
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  • 4
    I've done a comprehensive deep-dive into the modem's capabilities. That's not saying much with the available diag tools and data to look at are practically non-existent. The logs I can pull are useless since I don't have those tools. We've only been able to pull out the carrier aggregation combos and bands that are actively offered by a tower. There's nothing allowing us to make a full device report yet. Cellmapper is usable for SA but anchor bands don't always show up for NSA. One thing it does right is band indicators for NSA.

    It's not as fast as a Snapdragon X60 or Release 16 like Mediatek. 5G aggregation, TDD-FDD aggregation, and VoNR should all be possible based on its S20/21 siblings' spec sheets, modem dumps, and slideshows but are mostly unproven. What makes the Exynos 5123b better than an Exynos 5123a? We have no clue.

    What does this mean for the Pixel 7? The Exynos 2200 modem is still an unknown but Google should adopt the Snapdragon X65 instead.

    This is literally all we know without getting into the weeds.

    I'm still trying to figure out diag modes for this phone. I can get the modem and serial devices to show up. Per my conversations with cstark:

    resetprop ro.bootmode usbradio
    resetprop ro.build.type userdebug
    setprop sys.usb.config acm,dm,adb
    setprop persist.vendor.usb.usbradio.config dm

    Revert:
    setprop vendor.modem.logging.shannon_logging false
    setprop persist.vendor.modem.logging.shannon_app false

    Everything seems to be controlled by /vendor/bin/modem_logging_control and /vendor/bin/dmd.

    modem_logging_control START
    modem_logging_control STOP

    Regular invoke can yield usable logs and we can also get the apps started in SHANNON_DM or SHANNON_APP mode after START, but no idea what to do with them.

    The Shannon DM version floating around is too old and I haven't gotten a decent scat setup. Airscreen might work but Network Signal Guru doesn't. No tools for this phone are good at the moment.
    2
    I am in San Francisco on T-Mobile and live in one of the few locations where there is a hole in 5G service. On the cusp, I teeter between 5G, 4G and 3G when at home. Yes, I am on Wi-Fi when in my flat so this is less an issue.

    However, I've turned off 5G altogether because the modem or software refuses to switch from an unusably weak 5G signal before picking up 4G.

    This was making my phone unusable when walking around in the city playing Ingress. I was constantly toggling airplane mode to reconnect and by the time I do, the portal I was attempting to destroy have been recharged by the enemy. Google has crossed the line when they start messing with my gaming. ;)

    On a positive note, my phone hasn't been snatched out of my hand by thieves so I should be thankful for that. 😂
    1
    This is much to do about nothing. While 5G is being built out, it's still only available in a small percentage of places. 4G is still going to be around for several years. In real world usage you will never see a difference in modems. This is just like people arguing over benchmark tests. While it's easy to see that one device has higher scores on a bar graph, that doesn't translate to real world use.
    1
    The radios in this phone, along with some quirks with the radio they are using, are the reasons I had to return mine. At my work, I have a very poor 5G signal, but excellent LTE. However, the LTE signal has pretty poor performance, at around 1mbps. Enough for a phone call, but not much else. On my OP8, I was able to utilize NSA 5G consistently, which helped a ton. It allowed me to get a 5G signal when I could, and have a seamless handoff to LTE when I can't. I can even go so far as to force NSA 5G over SA 5G. With the Pixel 6, they are clearly prioritizing SA 5G over NSA 5G or LTE. This is causing my network to drop very frequently, or in most cases, showing a signal but having no internet connectivity. Given they are using Tensor, there is no way to lock bands or force NSA 5G. This makes the phone unusable for me for a solid 8 hours of the day, since T-Mobile's WiFi Calling is still garbage. Pivoted back to my OP8 and will use it until either the tools are available to do this myself or Google addresses the issue. Disappointing, because I love the phone.
  • 4
    I've done a comprehensive deep-dive into the modem's capabilities. That's not saying much with the available diag tools and data to look at are practically non-existent. The logs I can pull are useless since I don't have those tools. We've only been able to pull out the carrier aggregation combos and bands that are actively offered by a tower. There's nothing allowing us to make a full device report yet. Cellmapper is usable for SA but anchor bands don't always show up for NSA. One thing it does right is band indicators for NSA.

    It's not as fast as a Snapdragon X60 or Release 16 like Mediatek. 5G aggregation, TDD-FDD aggregation, and VoNR should all be possible based on its S20/21 siblings' spec sheets, modem dumps, and slideshows but are mostly unproven. What makes the Exynos 5123b better than an Exynos 5123a? We have no clue.

    What does this mean for the Pixel 7? The Exynos 2200 modem is still an unknown but Google should adopt the Snapdragon X65 instead.

    This is literally all we know without getting into the weeds.

    I'm still trying to figure out diag modes for this phone. I can get the modem and serial devices to show up. Per my conversations with cstark:

    resetprop ro.bootmode usbradio
    resetprop ro.build.type userdebug
    setprop sys.usb.config acm,dm,adb
    setprop persist.vendor.usb.usbradio.config dm

    Revert:
    setprop vendor.modem.logging.shannon_logging false
    setprop persist.vendor.modem.logging.shannon_app false

    Everything seems to be controlled by /vendor/bin/modem_logging_control and /vendor/bin/dmd.

    modem_logging_control START
    modem_logging_control STOP

    Regular invoke can yield usable logs and we can also get the apps started in SHANNON_DM or SHANNON_APP mode after START, but no idea what to do with them.

    The Shannon DM version floating around is too old and I haven't gotten a decent scat setup. Airscreen might work but Network Signal Guru doesn't. No tools for this phone are good at the moment.
    2
    Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

    Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
    I have never had a pixel device, but I can still say it's an amazing deal. You're someone who expects an exact $1200 Samsung clone for $900. You're either a troll or shallow, no body likes either of those things.
    2
    I am in San Francisco on T-Mobile and live in one of the few locations where there is a hole in 5G service. On the cusp, I teeter between 5G, 4G and 3G when at home. Yes, I am on Wi-Fi when in my flat so this is less an issue.

    However, I've turned off 5G altogether because the modem or software refuses to switch from an unusably weak 5G signal before picking up 4G.

    This was making my phone unusable when walking around in the city playing Ingress. I was constantly toggling airplane mode to reconnect and by the time I do, the portal I was attempting to destroy have been recharged by the enemy. Google has crossed the line when they start messing with my gaming. ;)

    On a positive note, my phone hasn't been snatched out of my hand by thieves so I should be thankful for that. 😂
    1
    1st gen vs 2nd gen modem from Qualcomm is about twice the difference from certain reviewers.

    Qualcomm modem better than Samsung which is why Exynos this year uses Qualcomm modem. But Google chose the Samsung modem from last year instead. Just because it is not Qualcomm probably.

    So makes a huge difference.

    To you may not matter. To me if I am paying 900$ for a year old tech that is singificantly inferior, and considering this is a phone and the modem is terrible compared to competition, matters to me. Just another way Google continues to give the finger to Pixel users every year they find a way to do that. If this is the case.

    I just like knowing when Google will start to treat Pixel users same level of respect as Samsung with their fans.
    dont forget it also doesnt have the samsung price
    1
    Does that matter and why? $900 for tech already outdated by a year... I can understand if budget phone. $900 is not a budget device.

    Sounds like they skipped out on others like inferior panel as well. So it definitely seems Pixel once again is a gimmick phone. And their fans will defend it because of it's gimmicks without acknowledging once again its a phone with pricetags not backed by haddwarw but camera software gimmicks.
    Agree for the most part. We can't forget these are cell phones. And I for one expect the best coverage and speeds here for a 2021 flagship. After using a phone for a certain amount of time, they are still just a dang phone.