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Anyone noticed what kind of damage you are doing to the Prime?

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Diamondback

Retired Dev Committee Lead / Retired Senior Mod
Jan 17, 2010
4,493
6,629
virtuous-ten-studio.com
Hey guys,
I really need to rant a little bit now.

This thread is for everyone creating all those "kill ASUS on facebook/twitter/blog sites" threads.

I really understand your angryness about the initial issues with the Prime, but has anyone of you guys ever thought about that you are doing huge damage to both ASUS and yourself with those hate campaigns?

Best example: "Lets spread information about minor software problems all over the web and its major blog sites"

This is ridicioulus guys... Seriously, ASUS really can't fix for example the serialnumber issue within 3 days...
They need to find out what's wrong first. After that they need to fix the problem. After fixing the testing follows.
All this needs time. And spreading rather unprofessional information all around the web won't speed this up at all.

But now to the main part of my rant: the damage being done to us, the owners of the Prime.

Do you guys really think you are doing anything good with those social attacks?
In fact you are driving many people away from the Prime for reasons which are seriously non-issues.

Lets re-think about the issues and ASUS reactions:
  • GPS issue: ASUS confirmed, that this might be a hardware problem,
    it seems they are starting a bonus program for the ones not happy with the GPS (either 6 more months of warranty or a full refund)
    This is actually really embarassing for them, but I couldn't think of any better method to solve this issue
    (we are talking about realistic methods here, giving you a free TF700 is not realistic)

  • The Wifi issue: Well actually we do not know much about this.
    ASUS told us it's not a hardware issue, rather an issue of specific batches with wrong firmware. We will see in the future what they can do here

  • The Wifi/BT issue: As several members found out this is a real non-issue. Speed drops appear across all devices and platforms when using BT and Wifi together. Nothing really to complain about here

  • Random lockups and reboots and unknown serial number issue: ASUS is aware of these problems, already got fixes and is testing these fixes right now.
    Nobody else tests fixes with real customers in a public forum. Thats' great!

Now lets talk about that damage I am always talking about:
Here the facts:
  • Reporting minor software issue (GPS and Wifi aside here) definitely leads to a smaller customer base for the Prime

  • Major news sites falsely reported the serial number problem as a hardware problem, leading to confused users which do not want to buy this tablet

  • Smaller userbases always lead to less support, both from the company and also from our own developers.

  • Less company support means that we will get less often and lower quality updates for our Prime. The device will be abandonned much faster than devices with large customer bases

  • Less dev support means less innovating new features from our side, less custom ROMs, less custom kernels, in fact the smaller the userbase the faster the Prime development will go dead

  • Think of the HTC HD2: the ultimate development phone. Its rather big userbase lead to incredible development. They have everything on that phone: Win 6.x, WP 7, Android 2.x and 4.x, real Linux... Smaller userbases ultimately lead to worse device development

I guess it's already too late, the damage being done by you and the major blog sites is irreparable.
Non tech-focused customers who read Engadget won't get a Prime now.
But these non-tech focused guys are the imporatn part of a customer base.
We tech guys here are always a very minor part of a device's customer base.

Ah and by the way: If you buy a product directly after launch, you have to expect those kind of problems.
I haven't seen any product launch in the last years which had not initial problems and issues. No matter if tablet or phones, HTC or Samsung...

ASUS is always one of the first (the first?) major companies, providing support on xda-developers. That is nothing usual for big companies like ASUS.
Give them credit for this move.

I hope someone actually read that text...
 

JoeyLe

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
506
107
I completely agree, thanks for this post. However the problem is it are mostly people who haven't even bought the Prime are bitching the most.
 

HiddenSanctum

Senior Member
Jun 12, 2011
400
61
Seattle
I couldn't agree more, bitching about the problem isn't gonna get anything solved. If you have problems try to help, that way things can get fixed more quickly and then everyone (or at least most) can be happy.
 

pintness

Senior Member
May 27, 2009
55
23
Srsly? Do you have like Stockholm-Syndrome?

Asus threw an unfinishied product on the market.
They can't fix the SN issue in 3 days? Well, I didn't have such issues with my 4 other android devices. Maybe the should have been testing it.

Of course it is embarassing for Asus, but this is clearly not our fault. We fulfilled our part with odering and paying for a tablet. Rest is up to them.
While I agree that a free TF700 or such things would be impossible, the GPS problem is clearly a sign there has be no/not enough testing.

All the problems you are stating would have been showing due to Asus product testing, again. This is completely THEIR fault and they have to deal with it now.

You think we need to stop reporting errors to make the prime look better and they can sell more?
Dude, seriously. Do you buy a brand new car and when you have issues, you just shut up so the store can sell some more?

I'd really love to love my Prime, but with all those obvious mistakes Asus made, I can't.

The problem with what you are doing is: If you support Asus now, other companies will see it's ok to sell faulty products, and the next generation of tablets could have big issues as well.
You need to say what's wrong for anybody to hear. Or would you like to buy a product and then find out later that it's full of bugs? But nobody tould you because it wouldn't be nice for the company?

Do you think Asus will decrease support if less people are bying it?
Again, this wouldn't be nice, but it's completely in the hands of Asus.
It's a big company and they shouldn't have trouble emplyoing a few guys for support. If not, the save money on the wrong thing. Don't make (Non-)Buyers responsible for this.


No matter what other companies do, bringing an untested product to the market is not acceptable and that is the feedback Asus is getting now.

And no, you don't have to expect those "kind of problems".
When I buy a 600€-Tablet, I expect a full working one, and not in 3 months but NOW. I didn't have problems with my Optimus 2x or Iconia A500.

It's a big difference wether the company is fixing issues or improves the quality with updates.


And another point on Asus working with the community: It's nice they are on XDA, but... I remember there was...is... a locked and encrypted bootloader?
Yeah, right. Asus completely locked the Prime and only promised to make an unlock tool after giant social network ****storms.
Is this "working" with the community? Why didn't they look at HTC and provided an unlock tool from the beginning? Asus is only giving in because they are afraid of more bad attention. And that seems to be the only way for the community to be heard.

Just my 2c.
pintness
 
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bobbyball

Senior Member
Nov 11, 2009
152
3
Cambridge
I think peoples persistence on forums have forced ASUS to look harder at the problem but never the less they are doing something and its a real credit to them that Gary Key is active on our forums now. I think in this modern age ASUS have took a brave step and one that they should be praised for.

We are all upset about the problems but we need to give ASUS fair time to address them. We have all had a rant but now its time to work with ASUS and give them as much information as possible, this is the only way we all get what we want, loyal happy customers and a fantastic product with new and exciting products on the horizon.

Cut them a bit of slack.
 

kristovaher

Senior Member
Jul 29, 2010
949
218
Tallinn
www.waher.net
Dear Diamondback,

Damage to ASUS with those hate campaigns? I am sorry, but I am not going to speak well of a company that releases devices with as many problems that I have paid for. If I end up buying a broken device, I will be disappointed. They did not let these devices through proper quality control and we are suffering from it.

Serial number issue should have never happened. WiFi issue should have never happened. GPS should have never happened. These problems can be caught in quality control, but they didn't because they rushed the device to the market before holidays and did not test it long enough beforehand.

Yes, a lot of new devices have tech problems. Difference being that while I have been part of many tech launches as an early adopter in the past, I have never seen a launch that has this many critical problems and this amount of returned devices. Even I had to return a device because the keyboard just did not work and I've never had to do it before in my life.

As for damage to 'us', your points are irrelevant. Social media attacks are important, because they make ASUS more aware of these situations and react quicker. Let's be honest here, ASUS PR has been horrible throughout the Transformer Prime launch. It is only thanks to their customer support and engineers in this forum that we get some information out of ASUS.

I will not 'lie' and say that TF201 is a great device. It is really really good, but if you want to be sure and want a better all-round device then I will suggest people to get an iPad 2 and I will not tell my friends that this device does not have flaws just because this will increase ASUS sales and public image.

These social media attacks are important because ASUS will hopefully try to do better in the future, because a company cannot survive many of these clusterfraks in a row.

If ASUS will 'abandon the device' quicker because people are critical about it, then so be it. It will only make it clear to me not to buy ASUS products in the future, since it is exactly when there are problems, where support is needed. Not providing this will lose them even more customers in the future.

And trust me when I say this, Transformer Prime will never be a popular device in a way iPad, Galaxy Tab or Kindle Fire are popular. It will sell more than the original Transformer, but it will be very little known outside tech circles. Most of my friends don't even know that there is such a thing as TF101, let alone TF201.

How can ASUS change that? Not disappointing early adopters. It is the most crucial thing about products release, since early adopters are the most passionate customers. At the moment though many of us are with flawed screens, weak WiFi, non-existent GPS, devices without serial numbers and countless of other issues that will really hold us back from speaking well about the product we have paid a lot of money for.

ASUS can really change all that by letting devices actually go through quality control and testing. Many of the problems with Prime were detected in just the first days of use by us or the reviewers. ASUS can spare to delay the release by a week to provide additional testing for a fixed amount of devices.

Will they do it in the future? Who knows, unlikely. This device was rushed to the market to get as much sales as possible, ASUS did not care about us, the customers, they cared about their sales.

And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.
 
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Diamondback

Retired Dev Committee Lead / Retired Senior Mod
Jan 17, 2010
4,493
6,629
virtuous-ten-studio.com
Srsly? Do you have like Stockholm-Syndrome?
[...]
Just my 2c.
pintness

Dead Diamondback,
[...]
And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.

You both are not getting my point. Instead of going to the media you should report your errors to ASUS.
No matter how incompetent their customer support is on the phone, the errors will reach the developers anyway.

Nobody told you to praise the Prime. I just said that overpainting the issue won't help anyone. Not even you.

ASUS will fix the software problems. And the GPS issue got kinda resolved too. If you are not happy with it, return it.
I am pretty sure there will be other countries than UK and Taiwan with this move.

And yes you can't fix software errors in that scale in 3 days. Just deal with it. That's how software development works.

Oh and I hope that "Dead Diamondback" was a typo.... Otherwise, get off here troll :)
 
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kaiserpc

Member
Sep 3, 2011
42
0
You haven't mentioned the dock issues lots of us are getting. My dock keyboard only works about 20% of the time I connect it. There is at least 30 or 40 users on here with the same issue, and about double that on the transformerforums site. This may not be a lot but I'm sure a lot of US owners don't own the dock where as is Europe you have to buy it as standard. ASUS support haven't been overly helpful - wait for the ICS upgrade and try a wipe - done that and it still doesn't work - no further update from ASUS. I'm having to send my tablet and dock back and hope the next one works fine - any issues with the new one and I'll be getting a refund.
 

Tairen

Senior Member
Jul 21, 2010
99
21
Dead Diamondback,

Damage to ASUS with those hate campaigns? I am sorry, but I am not going to speak well of a company that releases devices with as many problems that I have paid for. If I end up buying a broken device, I will be disappointed. They did not let these devices through proper quality control and we are suffering from it.

Serial number issue should have never happened. WiFi issue should have never happened. GPS should have never happened. These problems can be caught in quality control, but they didn't because they rushed the device to the market before holidays and did not test it long enough beforehand.

Yes, a lot of new devices have tech problems. Difference being that while I have been part of many tech launches as an early adopter in the past, I have never seen a launch that has this many critical problems and this amount of returned devices. Even I had to return a device because the keyboard just did not work and I've never had to do it before in my life.

As for damage to 'us', your points are irrelevant. Social media attacks are important, because they make ASUS more aware of these situations and react quicker. Let's be honest here, ASUS PR has been horrible throughout the Transformer Prime launch. It is only thanks to their customer support and engineers in this forum that we get some information out of ASUS.

I will not 'lie' and say that TF201 is a great device. It is really really good, but if you want to be sure and want a better all-round device then I will suggest people to get an iPad 2 and I will not tell my friends that this device does not have flaws just because this will increase ASUS sales and public image.

These social media attacks are important because ASUS will hopefully try to do better in the future, because a company cannot survive many of these clusterfraks in a row.

If ASUS will 'abandon the device' quicker because people are critical about it, then so be it. It will only make it clear to me not to buy ASUS products in the future, since it is exactly when there are problems, where support is needed. Not providing this will lose them even more customers in the future.

And trust me when I say this, Transformer Prime will never be a popular device in a way iPad, Galaxy Tab or Kindle Fire are popular. It will sell more than the original Transformer, but it will be very little known outside tech circles. Most of my friends don't even know that there is such a thing as TF101, let alone TF201.

How can ASUS change that? Not disappointing early adopters. It is the most crucial thing about products release, since early adopters are the most passionate customers. At the moment though many of us are with flawed screens, weak WiFi, non-existent GPS, devices without serial numbers and countless of other issues that will really hold us back from speaking well about the product we have paid a lot of money for.

ASUS can really change all that by letting devices actually go through quality control and testing. Many of the problems with Prime were detected in just the first days of use by us or the reviewers. ASUS can spare to delay the release by a week to provide additional testing for a fixed amount of devices.

Will they do it in the future? Who knows, unlikely. This device was rushed to the market to get as much sales as possible, ASUS did not care about us, the customers, they cared about their sales.

And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.

GDI read the ****ing OP's first post. He did not ask you to kiss Asus' feet. He did not ask you to say false POSITIVE things about the Prime. He did not tell you to disregard Asus' mistakes. He simply asked you to vent your frustration and give your CONSTRUCTIVE feedback to the appropriate recipient: ASUS.


BTW you have my thanks OP.
 
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Diamondback

Retired Dev Committee Lead / Retired Senior Mod
Jan 17, 2010
4,493
6,629
virtuous-ten-studio.com
You haven't mentioned the dock issues lots of us are getting. My dock keyboard only works about 20% of the time I connect it. There is at least 30 or 40 users on here with the same issue, and about double that on the transformerforums site. This may not be a lot but I'm sure a lot of US owners don't own the dock where as is Europe you have to buy it as standard. ASUS support haven't been overly helpful - wait for the ICS upgrade and try a wipe - done that and it still doesn't work - no further update from ASUS. I'm having to send my tablet and dock back and hope the next one works fine - any issues with the new one and I'll be getting a refund.

Hm, seems I missed that. My german dock works perfectly. What's the issue exactly?

But still, ASUS is a big company, they can't just find, fix, test, and make an announcement in 3 days...
 

Doktaphex

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2010
1,804
729
Earth
It reminds me of the launch of the HTC Desire HD, Back then it seemed as though the first couple of batches that made it into customers hands had not been properly tested and manufacturing QC was absolutely terrible.

GPS issues were rife, cases didn't fit together properly, screens were loose with dust underneath them. Then of course there was the screen bleed, stuck pixels and countless other problems.

I remember it well as I was one of the first people on this forum to receive my DHD and I spent countless hours sitting watching IRC channels for root to be achieved.

Now then after that short history lesson, here is the point of my story. There was a lot of complaining about these issues here on the forum, but what most people did was either accept the fact that this was an early batch and realised that as an early adopter these things are to be expected, or they sent them back. End of story.

There was no smeer campaign, nothing. Just people being adult about the situation and that's that.

Thanks for listening.
 

Diamondback

Retired Dev Committee Lead / Retired Senior Mod
Jan 17, 2010
4,493
6,629
virtuous-ten-studio.com
It reminds me of the launch of the HTC Desire HD, Back then it seemed as though the first couple of batches that made it into customers hands had not been properly tested and manufacturing QC was absolutely terrible.
[...]
Thanks for listening.

Same here, I think I got one of the first good batches :)
Nobody started a big ****storm back then and everything is fine today. The Desire HD is still a very good device and it was one of the top sold devices from HTC.

HTC sorted out all problems.
 

geinome

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2011
77
4
Ipswich
Agree

I actually agree with everything you said diamondback.
I personally love my prime, but i have a couple of issues here and there. Nothing that wont get fixed in the long run. I have a moan here and there, But i still show my support to a brilliant device.

And another thing i have never seen is a compnay actually showing their dedication to fixing the problems like asus. For god sake people they actually have a rep on here talking to people and providing inside information that actually could help. And again in garys posts people are attacking them there.

I really those people who are attacking asus shoulld either:
1. Suck it up and shut up and wait for a fix
2. Sell there device or take it back for a refund and shut up about it.

I know its not the best path, but you have to give a company some time for actually fix these issues. It doesnt happen over night, they ar'nt robots!

Rant over

---------- Post added at 11:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 AM ----------

Same here, I think I got one of the first good batches :)
Nobody started a big ****storm back then and everything is fine today. The Desire HD is still a very good device and it was one of the top sold devices from HTC.

HTC sorted out all problems.

its funny because i have a DHD, i got one of the bad batches and still using it this day. Although HTC's repair team didnt do anything when i sent it back in. 3 days before my warrenty ran out. But that was a GPS issue for me. And im not really that bothered about it to be fair.
I personally love my phone, ive modded it so many times now ive lost count.
 

kristovaher

Senior Member
Jul 29, 2010
949
218
Tallinn
www.waher.net
But aren't we pushing for double-standards here?

Because it would be a ****storm all around if Apple releases a product that has even a single critical flaw. Such as iPhone 4 antennagate. People pay a lot for Apple for quality, they don't expect such problems and Apple has very, very few issues like that with their product launches.

On the other hand we have ASUS who releases a product that has GPS that cannot be used, has weak WiFi range (+ broken WiFi on early US units), weak quality control on screen, keyboard and software issues with crashes and inability to update. Transformer Prime has more early adoption issues than iPhone's and iPad's have had in total.

Apple has set the standard, so when we end up paying a lot of money and face this many problems, being publicly critical about it makes sense. Sure you could say that ASUS is small compared to Apple, but if they want to compete with Apple they simply have to do better. If they release a device that is as flawed, it is not just bad for customers, but Android in general. I remember giving excuses to people who used my HTC Desire back in the day that had a multitouch screen that was not multitouch and it was obvious that it is a lesser device. I will feel just as bad when someone tries to use GPS on my Prime and is confused that it doesn't work and so on, because they -expect- the device to function.

Pat on the back and 'better next time' just doesn't cut it, since many of us will be using the device for more than a year. This is not a startup world, ASUS has been in the business for years, they are ambitious with their claims of having created the best tablet, if they cannot live up to it, they deserve the criticism.

They are a big boy and will hopefully do better next time. Market demands it. Otherwise someone else will simply create better devices and wins over the customers that ASUS has. ASUS is unique in that it offers an innovative keyboard dock with Prime, if it becomes popular then competition will increase and I'll gladly jump ship to manufacturer that has a better history with product launches.
 

demandarin

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2010
7,021
2,038
Alexandria, Va
I completely agree with OP post. People that are unsatisfied can easily return device and move on. But no, instead they love to hang around a nag like women with each other. I can tell most polls made here in thisbsection was made to make the Prime look bad. But guess what, it backfired. Most, if not all polls here show in favor of the Prime in a positive light. Don't believe me, just take a look. Of all the people that voted in them, its always 77-85% or more people that are happy with devices, or defect free or etc...

Although the smear campaigns might hurt a little, the ball is already rolling. Even the negative people not going to be able to stop developement. We already have a good number of developers doing alot of great things without bootloader unlocked yet. We have other major developers just waiting to hit the ground running once unlocking tool is available. Its almost surreal sometimes reading the issues some people have. As from 12/22 my device has worked great everyday and have really been enjoying it. Its really sad how some people try to nitpick every single little thing.

If you are unsatisfied with device, do like moderator Jerdog said. Which was get rid of device then, whine somewhere else, AND GO AWAY! Developers not going to want to hear your sob stories. Just imagine once custom roms start being made. Are those same people going to whine all the time after an early build is built n has some issues to be fixed?

Another thing also, some people are plain stupid. They smear n attack Asus for the Prime yet they talk of getting the new A-700. Dumb move. This new device hasn't even been proven tl be better then the Prime and won't be out for 4-5 months at the earliest. People just assume its better because it has a plastic strip across the back. Nothing can be assumed. This hasn't been thouroughly tested or reviewed by major tech sites to say its better. Which a mini test of sorts showed it wasn't, as far as wireless goes. To me. Asus is a great company because I received a great product. If people are to stupid to just return device instead of crying up here online, then that's on them. As they clearly have seen the people that love their devices way outnumber those who don't. sand ususally its the same people always complaining. That's why I've stopped trying to combat them in the threads really. I just report the post or thread, if its unreasonable. This has been working as several complaining threads already have been shut down. Even moderator tired of all the whining.

Just carry your a$$ somewhere else if you don't like your device. Plain n simple!
 
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Tairen

Senior Member
Jul 21, 2010
99
21
On the other hand we have ASUS who releases a product that has GPS that cannot be used, has weak WiFi range (+ broken WiFi on early US units), weak quality control on screen, keyboard and software issues with crashes and inability to update. Transformer Prime has more early adoption issues than iPhone's and iPad's have had in total.

I've had NONE of the issues you mentioned. The only thing I can't confirm that works 100% is the GPS since I did not buy this tablet to use as a primary GPS unit! I have a phone that does that and is more PORTABLE since it fits in my pants pocket. Last I tried using the GPS, it locked on my exact location in less than a minute. But really, I didn't really care, I only tested it because of all the damn bitching on this forum.

So yes, I am a proud owner of a Prime with a "functioning" GPS, STANDARD wifi range, a VIVID screen, operational keyboard dock, no software issues, and updated with ICS.
 

BarryH_GEG

Senior Member
Jan 16, 2009
10,198
5,143
Spokane, Washington
First, OP, this isn’t just about Asus. What you’re saying in your post is that to protect the image and viability of a product (any product), people should suck up what they’re handed and deal with problems quietly in a way that benefits the manufacturer. That way, the product’s image will be protected. That’s great for current owners looking to reinforce their purchase and to grow the user base, but what about people that haven’t yet purchased the product? Hide defects and issues from them so they can figure it out themselves? If Acer hoses the A700 launch, would you give the same advice to their board? This goes against the principles of XDA.

Back to the Prime. Many of the issues discussed here caused people to say the Prime wasn’t right for them and either returned them or passed. Would you deprive them of that knowledge beforehand to further your personal agenda? Did you sign the “unlock the bootloader” petition? If so, then you’re being somewhat hypocritical.

Manufacturers need to be held accountable for their decisions. In Asus’ case, the choice of a metal back cover, claiming “GPS” when there wasn’t, racing the Prime to market with inadequate testing, and the random QC issues were all self-inflicted. Following your guidance, if this was kept quiet and didn’t impact sales, what incentive would they have going forward to sweat the details and deliver high quality products starting with unit number one?

Any “damage done to the Prime” was done in meeting rooms in Taiwan long before anyone here had a Prime in their hands. And h/w and s/w aside, hopefully Asus learned from this that customers aren’t sheep and willing to accept what they’re given and in the future will provide more frequent, accurate, and consistent communication before and after they launch a product. It’s terrific that after the damage was done Gary Key’s been proactive in cleaning up the mess and Asus offered a six-month warranty extension. Let’s give them an “A” for that. They get an “F” for how they managed the launch, communication, some of their design choices, and initial QC. So, at best, they’ve earned a “C.” If they’re a learning organization, let’s see what they do with the TF700. If it’s a repeat of the Prime, then God help them. And if the TF700 is everything the Prime should have been, that’s what’s going to cause the problems you outlined to happen, not the bitching.

My friends that bought (and returned) Prime’s are pissed. Anyone trying to get one before the holidays went through flaming hoops and invested a lot of time and energy that they won’t get back via a “refund.” They’ll never purchase an Asus product again and are telling everyone they know about their experience. So even if everyone on XDA follows your advice, the damage will continue long after the postings stop. And it should because that’s what keeps manufacturers in check.
 

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    Hey guys,
    I really need to rant a little bit now.

    This thread is for everyone creating all those "kill ASUS on facebook/twitter/blog sites" threads.

    I really understand your angryness about the initial issues with the Prime, but has anyone of you guys ever thought about that you are doing huge damage to both ASUS and yourself with those hate campaigns?

    Best example: "Lets spread information about minor software problems all over the web and its major blog sites"

    This is ridicioulus guys... Seriously, ASUS really can't fix for example the serialnumber issue within 3 days...
    They need to find out what's wrong first. After that they need to fix the problem. After fixing the testing follows.
    All this needs time. And spreading rather unprofessional information all around the web won't speed this up at all.

    But now to the main part of my rant: the damage being done to us, the owners of the Prime.

    Do you guys really think you are doing anything good with those social attacks?
    In fact you are driving many people away from the Prime for reasons which are seriously non-issues.

    Lets re-think about the issues and ASUS reactions:
    • GPS issue: ASUS confirmed, that this might be a hardware problem,
      it seems they are starting a bonus program for the ones not happy with the GPS (either 6 more months of warranty or a full refund)
      This is actually really embarassing for them, but I couldn't think of any better method to solve this issue
      (we are talking about realistic methods here, giving you a free TF700 is not realistic)

    • The Wifi issue: Well actually we do not know much about this.
      ASUS told us it's not a hardware issue, rather an issue of specific batches with wrong firmware. We will see in the future what they can do here

    • The Wifi/BT issue: As several members found out this is a real non-issue. Speed drops appear across all devices and platforms when using BT and Wifi together. Nothing really to complain about here

    • Random lockups and reboots and unknown serial number issue: ASUS is aware of these problems, already got fixes and is testing these fixes right now.
      Nobody else tests fixes with real customers in a public forum. Thats' great!

    Now lets talk about that damage I am always talking about:
    Here the facts:
    • Reporting minor software issue (GPS and Wifi aside here) definitely leads to a smaller customer base for the Prime

    • Major news sites falsely reported the serial number problem as a hardware problem, leading to confused users which do not want to buy this tablet

    • Smaller userbases always lead to less support, both from the company and also from our own developers.

    • Less company support means that we will get less often and lower quality updates for our Prime. The device will be abandonned much faster than devices with large customer bases

    • Less dev support means less innovating new features from our side, less custom ROMs, less custom kernels, in fact the smaller the userbase the faster the Prime development will go dead

    • Think of the HTC HD2: the ultimate development phone. Its rather big userbase lead to incredible development. They have everything on that phone: Win 6.x, WP 7, Android 2.x and 4.x, real Linux... Smaller userbases ultimately lead to worse device development

    I guess it's already too late, the damage being done by you and the major blog sites is irreparable.
    Non tech-focused customers who read Engadget won't get a Prime now.
    But these non-tech focused guys are the imporatn part of a customer base.
    We tech guys here are always a very minor part of a device's customer base.

    Ah and by the way: If you buy a product directly after launch, you have to expect those kind of problems.
    I haven't seen any product launch in the last years which had not initial problems and issues. No matter if tablet or phones, HTC or Samsung...

    ASUS is always one of the first (the first?) major companies, providing support on xda-developers. That is nothing usual for big companies like ASUS.
    Give them credit for this move.

    I hope someone actually read that text...
    8
    Srsly? Do you have like Stockholm-Syndrome?

    Asus threw an unfinishied product on the market.
    They can't fix the SN issue in 3 days? Well, I didn't have such issues with my 4 other android devices. Maybe the should have been testing it.

    Of course it is embarassing for Asus, but this is clearly not our fault. We fulfilled our part with odering and paying for a tablet. Rest is up to them.
    While I agree that a free TF700 or such things would be impossible, the GPS problem is clearly a sign there has be no/not enough testing.

    All the problems you are stating would have been showing due to Asus product testing, again. This is completely THEIR fault and they have to deal with it now.

    You think we need to stop reporting errors to make the prime look better and they can sell more?
    Dude, seriously. Do you buy a brand new car and when you have issues, you just shut up so the store can sell some more?

    I'd really love to love my Prime, but with all those obvious mistakes Asus made, I can't.

    The problem with what you are doing is: If you support Asus now, other companies will see it's ok to sell faulty products, and the next generation of tablets could have big issues as well.
    You need to say what's wrong for anybody to hear. Or would you like to buy a product and then find out later that it's full of bugs? But nobody tould you because it wouldn't be nice for the company?

    Do you think Asus will decrease support if less people are bying it?
    Again, this wouldn't be nice, but it's completely in the hands of Asus.
    It's a big company and they shouldn't have trouble emplyoing a few guys for support. If not, the save money on the wrong thing. Don't make (Non-)Buyers responsible for this.


    No matter what other companies do, bringing an untested product to the market is not acceptable and that is the feedback Asus is getting now.

    And no, you don't have to expect those "kind of problems".
    When I buy a 600€-Tablet, I expect a full working one, and not in 3 months but NOW. I didn't have problems with my Optimus 2x or Iconia A500.

    It's a big difference wether the company is fixing issues or improves the quality with updates.


    And another point on Asus working with the community: It's nice they are on XDA, but... I remember there was...is... a locked and encrypted bootloader?
    Yeah, right. Asus completely locked the Prime and only promised to make an unlock tool after giant social network ****storms.
    Is this "working" with the community? Why didn't they look at HTC and provided an unlock tool from the beginning? Asus is only giving in because they are afraid of more bad attention. And that seems to be the only way for the community to be heard.

    Just my 2c.
    pintness
    6
    First, OP, this isn’t just about Asus. What you’re saying in your post is that to protect the image and viability of a product (any product), people should suck up what they’re handed and deal with problems quietly in a way that benefits the manufacturer. That way, the product’s image will be protected. That’s great for current owners looking to reinforce their purchase and to grow the user base, but what about people that haven’t yet purchased the product? Hide defects and issues from them so they can figure it out themselves? If Acer hoses the A700 launch, would you give the same advice to their board? This goes against the principles of XDA.

    Back to the Prime. Many of the issues discussed here caused people to say the Prime wasn’t right for them and either returned them or passed. Would you deprive them of that knowledge beforehand to further your personal agenda? Did you sign the “unlock the bootloader” petition? If so, then you’re being somewhat hypocritical.

    Manufacturers need to be held accountable for their decisions. In Asus’ case, the choice of a metal back cover, claiming “GPS” when there wasn’t, racing the Prime to market with inadequate testing, and the random QC issues were all self-inflicted. Following your guidance, if this was kept quiet and didn’t impact sales, what incentive would they have going forward to sweat the details and deliver high quality products starting with unit number one?

    Any “damage done to the Prime” was done in meeting rooms in Taiwan long before anyone here had a Prime in their hands. And h/w and s/w aside, hopefully Asus learned from this that customers aren’t sheep and willing to accept what they’re given and in the future will provide more frequent, accurate, and consistent communication before and after they launch a product. It’s terrific that after the damage was done Gary Key’s been proactive in cleaning up the mess and Asus offered a six-month warranty extension. Let’s give them an “A” for that. They get an “F” for how they managed the launch, communication, some of their design choices, and initial QC. So, at best, they’ve earned a “C.” If they’re a learning organization, let’s see what they do with the TF700. If it’s a repeat of the Prime, then God help them. And if the TF700 is everything the Prime should have been, that’s what’s going to cause the problems you outlined to happen, not the bitching.

    My friends that bought (and returned) Prime’s are pissed. Anyone trying to get one before the holidays went through flaming hoops and invested a lot of time and energy that they won’t get back via a “refund.” They’ll never purchase an Asus product again and are telling everyone they know about their experience. So even if everyone on XDA follows your advice, the damage will continue long after the postings stop. And it should because that’s what keeps manufacturers in check.
    4
    Dear Diamondback,

    Damage to ASUS with those hate campaigns? I am sorry, but I am not going to speak well of a company that releases devices with as many problems that I have paid for. If I end up buying a broken device, I will be disappointed. They did not let these devices through proper quality control and we are suffering from it.

    Serial number issue should have never happened. WiFi issue should have never happened. GPS should have never happened. These problems can be caught in quality control, but they didn't because they rushed the device to the market before holidays and did not test it long enough beforehand.

    Yes, a lot of new devices have tech problems. Difference being that while I have been part of many tech launches as an early adopter in the past, I have never seen a launch that has this many critical problems and this amount of returned devices. Even I had to return a device because the keyboard just did not work and I've never had to do it before in my life.

    As for damage to 'us', your points are irrelevant. Social media attacks are important, because they make ASUS more aware of these situations and react quicker. Let's be honest here, ASUS PR has been horrible throughout the Transformer Prime launch. It is only thanks to their customer support and engineers in this forum that we get some information out of ASUS.

    I will not 'lie' and say that TF201 is a great device. It is really really good, but if you want to be sure and want a better all-round device then I will suggest people to get an iPad 2 and I will not tell my friends that this device does not have flaws just because this will increase ASUS sales and public image.

    These social media attacks are important because ASUS will hopefully try to do better in the future, because a company cannot survive many of these clusterfraks in a row.

    If ASUS will 'abandon the device' quicker because people are critical about it, then so be it. It will only make it clear to me not to buy ASUS products in the future, since it is exactly when there are problems, where support is needed. Not providing this will lose them even more customers in the future.

    And trust me when I say this, Transformer Prime will never be a popular device in a way iPad, Galaxy Tab or Kindle Fire are popular. It will sell more than the original Transformer, but it will be very little known outside tech circles. Most of my friends don't even know that there is such a thing as TF101, let alone TF201.

    How can ASUS change that? Not disappointing early adopters. It is the most crucial thing about products release, since early adopters are the most passionate customers. At the moment though many of us are with flawed screens, weak WiFi, non-existent GPS, devices without serial numbers and countless of other issues that will really hold us back from speaking well about the product we have paid a lot of money for.

    ASUS can really change all that by letting devices actually go through quality control and testing. Many of the problems with Prime were detected in just the first days of use by us or the reviewers. ASUS can spare to delay the release by a week to provide additional testing for a fixed amount of devices.

    Will they do it in the future? Who knows, unlikely. This device was rushed to the market to get as much sales as possible, ASUS did not care about us, the customers, they cared about their sales.

    And this is why we have every right to be critical of ASUS. I hope they will do better in the future.
    4
    Whoa...let's back up a little here.

    First, a great deal of us have complained directly to Asus. Some of us have either contacted by email or by phone. The response we got back from Asus were... from what users report here,
    a.) unresponsive or b.) neglect issues and unhelpful. This led a lot of us to become upset, as most of us put down half a grand in US dollars or higher amount overseas or Canadian. That's just for the tablet.

    Second, Asus may be one of the most unlucky companies to grace a tablet after the production of their first tablet faced similar scenarios. Under-produced, delays, B&M and Online retailers out of stock or cancel preorders. And not just cancel preorders immediately but 2 weeks to 3 weeks later. (Thanks for the $10, Amazon)

    Third, every blog/hardware/android/gadget site wrote *wonderful* things about this tablet. The hype was on! Only 2 of those sites reported any slight of a problem while testing - and Anandtech went so far as to blame Asus for giving him the tablet <24 hours prior to release of the NDA. A faulty tablet, at that. But when did this occur?? Most of us had our primes already on pre-order.

    Fourth, after the initial "ooh" and "aah" of the tablet ceased, the problems started *glaringly* popping up. No GPS worth a stick. Wifi range and transmission is extremely weak. BT and Wifi can't coexist together. Resets, Serial Number Unknown, Black lines and hazy screen, Screen not glued on properly, Proprietary cable loose and broken - all these reports started showing up. I'm sure I'm missing some. Notice I didn't mention Unlocked Bootloader because it's not in the hardware specs (although subwoofer is still listed as spec on dock http://www.walmart.com/ip/19590184?wmlspartner=AKGBlS8SPlM&sourceid=41075484931113395125 )

    Today we can interpret from what Asus has stated that the UK and some EU countries that received the Prime don't suffer from the wifi range/BT/GPS issues - which means that they have different hardware in them giving them a better signal, or positioned differently.

    To this day, we still don't have any confirmation (official) that such a statement exists concerning our poor wifi signal. Or BT/wifi. or GPS. and no, taking GPS off your specs does NOT solve the answer.

    To the individuals who you all say are complaining too much and return the prime - trust me, Asus wants us to keep the prime. Most of us would be happy if the wifi range / connection was better, bt/wifi worked, gps worked, serial # was known, etc. It's hard for us to keep believing in a company that said ICS would be out before the holidays, etc. or that our previous TF101 docks would work for future tablets. Yeah, I believed that one too.

    Now, for me, who is typing on an Asus 1005HE netbook, I can tell you that having invested quite a few dollars in Asus over the lifetime of computers (and all the mobos I have), one little mistake wouldn't bother me. But it hasn't been one little mistake. It hasn't even just been MY tablet. IT's been a tremendous amount of users tablets.

    If we follow your suggestion OP, which I may be mistaken but it's to speak with Asus concerning our problems, what, should we also not flash our lights at anyone who is driving at night without lights? By complaining to the other sites, we are at least INFORMING others of the issue, since we are the "beta testers" and letting people know - hold off - let Asus get this right before you go dropping $500+ on something that you may entirely be disappointed in. We are doing Asus a SERVICE, by complaining to them - complaining to sites - the same way people write reviews about items on Amazon. We are giving Asus a chance to correct this - but it's hard to do when they release a 1920x1080 Tegra 3 with backplate completely different OHH and it's compatible with the new Prime Dock.

    For what it's worth - I am holding on to my Prime, as I'm sure others are too - to see how Asus responds to our issues. Will they have us send it in and replace it with different hardware or a backplate? I certainly hope so. Will they give us a trade in for free towards the new 1080p tablet? I certainly hope not. I just want this damn thing fixed, as others do, and in the future I will certainly wait and see concerning future reviews whether it's worthy of my god damn hard earned money.
    And please don't tell me that websites are blaming Asus - no one wants to cross that line so they don't get the future tablets under an NDA and are able to review them first - Engadget even goes so far as to say Asus bent over backwards giving us updates to fix the wifi and gps, and then release ICS and it's still not good for us. Cowards! At least Anandtech did us service by warning us with as little time as he had about possible issues - he even stated he worried that users that received the first batches would receive the same crap wifi that he did - and for the most part, he was right (exceptions to users who received awesome Wifi and BT and GPS capabilities but don't understand how to check your connection to your router and if you drop from 54-19-5-1Mbs in ranges of 3, 12, 18,30 feet with no walls in between)

    We arent hurting Asus, we aren't hurting ourselves. Perhaps next time, when Apple co-cospirator Walt Mossberg states "some say this is your copy of the Macbook Air" and Johnny S. laughs uneasily, we'll take that as "none of our products are quite ready to launch yet, please don't buy" and "most of our promises end up broken and if not we'll remove it from our specs". If we don't speak out, who will? I'd be a whole lot less remisce if this cost $249 instead of $499.

    -Writing from my prime which is 6 feet from my router on channel 6 with wifi and BT on using Apple Bt Keyboard at connection of 5Mbs (should be 54 thanks). (edited just for sheets and goggles)