Question Messy USB Type C protocols?

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newwaylw

New member
Oct 29, 2015
2
1
Hi all, I am not sure if this forum is the best place to ask, my question is not device specific I think. But since I've got a OP 9Pro, and I believe people here may have a higher chance of knowing the root problem, so I am trying my luck here.

So I recently purchased the new Macbook air, and I am setting up adb for my OP9 phone. I discovered something .... very confusing to say the least regarding USB type C cables (or ports?). I already know USB Type C standard is quite messy but this is out of my comprehension. And I really hope someone can shed some light on me.

I have a few USB Type C cables and when I connect them to my phone and the Macbook USBC port, Most won't support data transfer and some won't even charge! So I got curious and tested with 3 different USBC cables, and 2 USBC devices ( My OP9 Phone and a Wacom drawing pad), I also connect a USB-C Hub to my Mac and then repeat the experiment with all those cables again. (The USB-C Hub has a USB-C port marked 'PD + Data', see picture attached)

You can find the result table below. A few explanations:
  1. Red cable is the original OnePlus cable; Black cable is a office supplied data cable (looks good quality); and the white cable I'd say is a cheap USBC cable.
  2. Connect via MacBook USBC means the cable in question is connected to the Macbook USBC port directly
  3. Connect vis Hub USBC means the USBC Hub is connected to the Macbook USBC port, and all other devices are then connected via the USB-C port provided by the HUB
  4. For OnePlus 9 Pro, Data means I can see my devices using `adb devices`
  5. For Wacom, Data means I can move/click the mouse cursor with the pad.


Screenshot 2022-08-11 at 21.35.37.png


I understand that not all USB Type-C cables are created equal, but at the very least I'd expect they can all charge a phone? It is not the case here. The questions most confused me are:
  • The Black cable is marked as a data cable, and it can connect to my wacom when I plug it directly to my Mac. My Wacom works as normal, but how come when I connect it to my phone, it's not even charging my phone?
  • When the Black cable is connected directly to my Mac from my Phone, I accidentally disconnected my MacBook Air's MagSafe power, and guess what happened? My phone is reverse charging the Macbook. WTF? Is there some sort of one-way charging protocol with this black cable?
  • Why adding the USB-C Hub causes different behaviour? It is clear that the HUB does support data transfer, although only with the Wacom device.
  • All 3 cables in question can charge my phone if I plug the other end to the apple white USB-C charger that comes with my Mac
  • Only using the OP red cable can the MacBook detect my phone, why? shouldn't all USB Type C 'data cables' can do that?

Really appreciate any insights!
 

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newwaylw

New member
Oct 29, 2015
2
1
One of the questions would be what's so special about the op cable? Is there some proprietary protocol/chip in the cable that only allows it to communicate, or even charge my phone?
 

Renate

Recognized Contributor / Inactive Recognized Dev
Feb 3, 2012
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Moto E5
Well, things do get very confusing with power delivery and USB 2/3.
For instance, a USB 3.0 is required to have the USB 2.0 part functional.
But, you can chop that out and some devices in some circumstances will work just fine.

Also, many Type C cables are only USB 2.0, they are missing the four pairs for USB 3.0.

I would think that anything would charge somewhat but there are two major protocols for power negotiation.
One is pulsing on the CC, the other is a carrier on Vbus.

The best thing to do would be to take scissors to all your cables so that we may understand the problem! :p
 
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TheGhost1951

Senior Member
Feb 11, 2009
613
110
Garfield
OnePlus 9 Pro
Although the stock red cable supports both WARP charge and data transfer, it's only a USB 2.0 protocol, crippling the transfer speed. FYI.
But my charge rates are 30% to 100% is less than 1 hour...my data rates between phone and PC are insignificant as to whether to takes 5 mins or 7 mins to transfer 7gb of data...as long as I can charge my phone in a reasonable amount of time and I can transfer data between my phone and PC reasonable, then what if any problem do I have?
 

TheGhost1951

Senior Member
Feb 11, 2009
613
110
Garfield
OnePlus 9 Pro
Oh, the One Plus 9 also uses its own proprietary protocol for power negotiation.
So, really what is your complaint, I was for a long time using Samsung devices, and even though I paid for them, I could not unlock the bootloader. It is my phone, I paid for it, but I can't have a custom bootanimation or do what ever with my phone since I paid for it. It was my phone, but we will limit you as to what you can do is what Samsung was saying. Charging and data rate transfer were the least of my problems. My phone my customizations were more important to me..
 

TheGhost1951

Senior Member
Feb 11, 2009
613
110
Garfield
OnePlus 9 Pro
The gambit of chargers and cables is all over the spectrum. Some cables will charge but not do data transfer. It is sometimes a hit and miss proposition that for the most part is a gamble. Not exactly a monumentous problem. Good luck in your endeavor...
 

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  • 2
    Why are you only interested in USB?
    What are you talking about? She stated a fact, that's it.
    1
    Hi all, I am not sure if this forum is the best place to ask, my question is not device specific I think. But since I've got a OP 9Pro, and I believe people here may have a higher chance of knowing the root problem, so I am trying my luck here.

    So I recently purchased the new Macbook air, and I am setting up adb for my OP9 phone. I discovered something .... very confusing to say the least regarding USB type C cables (or ports?). I already know USB Type C standard is quite messy but this is out of my comprehension. And I really hope someone can shed some light on me.

    I have a few USB Type C cables and when I connect them to my phone and the Macbook USBC port, Most won't support data transfer and some won't even charge! So I got curious and tested with 3 different USBC cables, and 2 USBC devices ( My OP9 Phone and a Wacom drawing pad), I also connect a USB-C Hub to my Mac and then repeat the experiment with all those cables again. (The USB-C Hub has a USB-C port marked 'PD + Data', see picture attached)

    You can find the result table below. A few explanations:
    1. Red cable is the original OnePlus cable; Black cable is a office supplied data cable (looks good quality); and the white cable I'd say is a cheap USBC cable.
    2. Connect via MacBook USBC means the cable in question is connected to the Macbook USBC port directly
    3. Connect vis Hub USBC means the USBC Hub is connected to the Macbook USBC port, and all other devices are then connected via the USB-C port provided by the HUB
    4. For OnePlus 9 Pro, Data means I can see my devices using `adb devices`
    5. For Wacom, Data means I can move/click the mouse cursor with the pad.


    Screenshot 2022-08-11 at 21.35.37.png


    I understand that not all USB Type-C cables are created equal, but at the very least I'd expect they can all charge a phone? It is not the case here. The questions most confused me are:
    • The Black cable is marked as a data cable, and it can connect to my wacom when I plug it directly to my Mac. My Wacom works as normal, but how come when I connect it to my phone, it's not even charging my phone?
    • When the Black cable is connected directly to my Mac from my Phone, I accidentally disconnected my MacBook Air's MagSafe power, and guess what happened? My phone is reverse charging the Macbook. WTF? Is there some sort of one-way charging protocol with this black cable?
    • Why adding the USB-C Hub causes different behaviour? It is clear that the HUB does support data transfer, although only with the Wacom device.
    • All 3 cables in question can charge my phone if I plug the other end to the apple white USB-C charger that comes with my Mac
    • Only using the OP red cable can the MacBook detect my phone, why? shouldn't all USB Type C 'data cables' can do that?

    Really appreciate any insights!
    1
    Well, things do get very confusing with power delivery and USB 2/3.
    For instance, a USB 3.0 is required to have the USB 2.0 part functional.
    But, you can chop that out and some devices in some circumstances will work just fine.

    Also, many Type C cables are only USB 2.0, they are missing the four pairs for USB 3.0.

    I would think that anything would charge somewhat but there are two major protocols for power negotiation.
    One is pulsing on the CC, the other is a carrier on Vbus.

    The best thing to do would be to take scissors to all your cables so that we may understand the problem! :p
    1
    One of the questions would be what's so special about the op cable? Is there some proprietary protocol/chip in the cable that only allows it to communicate, or even charge my phone?
    The cable and charger that came with the phone is "matched" to the device. To deviate from that is a choice and a gamble that yields mixed results.