Nokia World 2011

z33dev33l

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Oct 17, 2008
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Z33, I don't understand how in the same post you talk about Nokia's use of old outdated hardware, and then say they have some of the best hardware out. Your statements contradict themselves.

WP7 will never get past #3 in the market share. People who want simple and secure will use IOS. People that want customization and availability will use Android. WP7 will never be more than a novelty. You cannot honestly say that you think it will overtake Android as #1.
honestly, android could be sued into oblivion at any given point should Microsoft and apple choose to do so. The only issue is that Microsoft is using the same OEM's and until wp7 becomes a revenue generator worthy of the OEMs suing would screw over the OEMs more than anyone, google would lose a division. Oem's would lose a huge source of revenue. Nokia's point in the matter is to show that WP7 can be an outstanding revenue generator. Nokia does have outstanding hardware, their build quality is bar none, their battery management is flawless, and their cameras are amazing. The fact that the SoC is outdated is unimportant given the OS.
 

lowandbehold

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Feb 26, 2011
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Looks like you need to do some research z33. Google can't be sued for Android. Google does not produce phones. Android is open source and is not a physical being, so it does not violate any so called patent until an OEM puts it on a device. Pretty clever huh?
 

z33dev33l

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Looks like you need to do some research z33. Google can't be sued for Android. Google does not produce phones. Android is open source and is not a physical being, so it does not violate any so called patent until an OEM puts it on a device. Pretty clever huh?
I think it's clear what I meant. If they halted the OEMs from producing android, which apple and Microsoft together could very well do, what would be the point in an android division within google? They just dont want to leave a scar on the OEMs when they still need them. If they could go to Nokia exclusively then it would be nice but that's not a way to win over the general consensus.
 

lowandbehold

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And if that happened, and it was just Nokia and Apple, Apple would have a monopoly. Face it, no matter what they do it is still Nokia. No one wants to use that sh*t. We are a materialistic society, and if my buddy has an Iphone, I WILL NOT have a Nokia.
 

z33dev33l

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And if that happened, and it was just Nokia and Apple, Apple would have a monopoly. Face it, no matter what they do it is still Nokia. No one wants to use that sh*t. We are a materialistic society, and if my buddy has an Iphone, I WILL NOT have a Nokia.
yes, no one wants Nokia, that's why up until their recent OS-confusion they were the highest selling smartphone company in the world. They owned the Asian and European market and were not unheard of in the states. Some people would still want some hardware choice.
 

lowandbehold

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yes, no one wants Nokia, that's why up until their recent OS-confusion they were the highest selling smartphone company in the world. They owned the Asian and European market and were not unheard of in the states. Some people would still want some hardware choice.
It will never catch on in the states. It died 10 years ago in the states. We don't like ugly phones pieced together with second hand hardware.
 

upichie

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Nov 15, 2010
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So you have an issue with a vibrant looking like an Iphone but no issue with a nokia looking like an Ipod...interesting.
THIS! THIS! OH MY GOD, THIS! Haha. :D

The Nokia chassis is not a direct copy of the n9, there are new buttons and the camera flash has moved. I'm hoping my lumia 800s will come in the mail soon.
You think that the Vibrant is such an obvious copy of the iPhone that they should be sued, yet you think adding buttons and moving the flash is a completely different phone?

I know English isn't your first language, but is this actually what you're trying to say? That is utterly laughable. :p
 

xaccers

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Jul 21, 2009
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Milling around Milton Keynes
Micrsoft would lose too much money if Android was no more.
See, this is where their business sense is somewhat better than Apple, Microsoft know that if they have a tenuous claim on a patent that could be defeated after an expensive court case, it is better to ask for a reasonable royalty that saves both companies and opens the door for cross licensing patents. It doesn't mean their patents are valid, it just means that the parties involved realise that they'll save money working together than fighting in courts where only lawyers win.
It'd be like you having to use a gate to take produce to market, and me claiming the gate is mine when it isn't and putting a lock on it. I'll let you unlock and use the gate for $1 of the $10 you'll make at market, or you can take me to court to prove I have no ownership of the gate and it will cost you $10,000. While it is morally wrong as I have no legal right to charge you, it makes financial sense for you to pay me so you can make some money at the market.

Unlike with the 3G technology that Apple have stolen (despite Marty's incorrect ramblings) from Samsung.
Where Apple are unwilling to purchase a FRAND license, ie getting an advantage over competitors by using technology without paying for it, while it apparently is the norm for Apple, it is frowned upon by courts.
There is a framework in place for Apple to pay a fair and reasonable price to use the technology, they are just refusing to do so.
In the Microsoft/Android case, Microsoft are able to get away with charging less if the manufacturer also makes WP7 devices because it's not a FRAND license.
Basically once again MS shows itself to be reasonable (although naughty) and Apple shows itself as having a "screw you all" attitude.
I'm sure its also why Apple handicap certain features of the iphone, such as video calling only being possible on wifi, so they don't have to pay to use patents.
 
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z33dev33l

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THIS! THIS! OH MY GOD, THIS! Haha. :D



You think that the Vibrant is such an obvious copy of the iPhone that they should be sued, yet you think adding buttons and moving the flash is a completely different phone?

I know English isn't your first language, but is this actually what you're trying to say? That is utterly laughable. :p
didn't say it was suit-worthy. I just said that there are obvious design elements taken from it.
 

upichie

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didn't say it was suit-worthy. I just said that there are obvious design elements taken from it.
And that, quite obviously, is 100% legal. So you're now agreeing that there was nothing wrong done here? Nothing requiring legal intervention? Nothing requiring fanboys making a deal out of it? Nothing requiring anything worth mentioning at all?

I'm sure I could dig up some old posts of yours that would contradict this, but 1) it's not worth my time, and 2) you contradict yourself in every third post.
 

neuTrue

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Oct 31, 2011
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WP7 certainly will mature and get better, but it already surpasses all other OSes for quality. If you can't see that, you aren't looking at the OS, you're looking at its appearance. Whatever the appearance is to someone, and it can be simple or elegant depending on the person, that's a matter of personal taste. Quality can be experienced throughout the system, though. Fast and clean is one example of the quality of WP7. It is one of, if not the actual, fastest booting smartphone OSes ever created. And is one of the fastest responding ever created.
Quality you are talking about, seems more of restricting the OS and limiting options to the end user. For the remaining part of your argument you can find the answers down (Speed/fast/lag) in Z33 respond.



important? What is so integral and important about changing font size? No considerable OS has this built in.
So, what is so integral and important about: Changing ringtone,background themes or even the language? I can go on and on.
Seriously font size is an important feature, being able to decrease the font or increase it helps not only saving you from wearing glasses(35+) ,but also to put more text in small place. Like saving you the affords from scrolling up and down (I may add here, right or left). I'll not even start talking about "No considerable OS has this built in." its feels so wrong and need to be revised!


...for that customization you sacrifice quality. You get lag, you get force closes, you get a poorly pieced together OS that you're expected to piece together.
Poor coding and I will also add, poor methodology leads to sacrifice in quality. Implementing features and enhancing them with stability in mind leads to quality not the otherwise!


so, android is allowed to lag relentlessly on a dual core but WP7 isn't allowed to set a requirement of two year old easy to obtain hardware to make their phones the smoothest on the market? There's no software issues. I suppose if you dont utilize either of 2 of the 4 most visited sites online then you are missing out on a small aspect of a still outstanding operating system
Android , WP7 and the other OS's shouldn't be allowed to lag at all, especially with powerful hardware as their base.
Honestly, the "2 year hardware" argument doesn't make your argument any stronger. iPhone 1 was using an under-clocked cpu with only 412 MHz and wasn't lagging at all (more than 5 years old hardware). Iphone 4, is using 800mhz (underclocked cpu) with greater resolution (960 × 640). For WP7 min requirement for cpu is snapdragon (Mostly are 1Ghz+ and lowest available are in 800's mhz) with advanced structure going inside its core. For your information, supporting a certain type of SOC's is easier than supporting everything on the Market.
So, I am telling you drop the argument around the hardware, it is meaningless in this case.


nokia is an outstanding software and hardware company. They simply didn't want to be a second rate android when they could be part of something new and amazing.
I think Nokia moved into WP7 because they become an "ego-company" with the "ego-Elop"; There is even someone in Nokia posted in his blog, that he explained to Elop why adapting Meego is easier and faster and even cost efficiency than WP7. Of course by now you should know that Elop with his "Ego-Elop-Lism" just can't admit he is wrong and moved forward with WP7.
 

z33dev33l

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And at the time that the first iPhone came out it lagged after a good 30 minutes of use. However, the performance otherwise was awesome. These specs were pretty high-end for the time. The 1ghz processor required is mid-tier based on current offerings. What was the last popular android/ios/wp7 smartphone to use less than the 1ghz processor? The g2 that clocked higher? The problem with implementing with stability in mind is that you have a stable foundation. Wp7 can later implement these features piece by piece because it's stability and security are unmatched. Right now android is building Fort Knox on peanut brittle because the foundation is absolutely horrid. As for the ego comments, that's just opinion. Like I said, elop doesn't want to be a second rate android, he wants more than that and he hasn't been lynched just yet.
 

upichie

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Nov 15, 2010
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And at the time that the first iPhone came out it lagged after a good 30 minutes of use. However, the performance otherwise was awesome. These specs were pretty high-end for the time. The 1ghz processor required is mid-tier based on current offerings. What was the last popular android/ios/wp7 smartphone to use less than the 1ghz processor? The g2 that clocked higher? The problem with implementing with stability in mind is that you have a stable foundation. Wp7 can later implement these features piece by piece because it's stability and security are unmatched. Right now android is building Fort Knox on peanut brittle because the foundation is absolutely horrid. As for the ego comments, that's just opinion. Like I said, elop doesn't want to be a second rate android, he wants more than that and he hasn't been lynched just yet.
Just now, I tasted my WP7 phone, comparing it to my Android one—and you're wrong. The WP7 one tastes more like peanut brittle. Your comments are now disregarded until you show sources for such claims.

Oh wait, were you stating opinions as facts again?
 

z33dev33l

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Oct 17, 2008
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Just now, I tasted my WP7 phone, comparing it to my Android one—and you're wrong. The WP7 one tastes more like peanut brittle. Your comments are now disregarded until you show sources for such claims.

Oh wait, were you stating opinions as facts again?
where did I state that it was fact? Though I could point to the ill security practices, poor battery management, force closes, etc. Etc. Windows Phone only has room to grow, android has a lot to improve upon before the UX can advance.
 

upichie

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Nov 15, 2010
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where did I state that it was fact? Though I could point to the ill security practices, poor battery management, force closes, etc. Etc. Windows Phone only has room to grow, android has a lot to improve upon before the UX can advance.
Man, seriously, do you speak English? Do you realize this is an English forum? Are you slow?

If you claim something to be fact (for example, "the sky is blue"), even if you don't explicitly say "this is fact" afterwards, it doesn't change what you just said. Logic, man. You need some. Seriously. Please, just go and get some.

On topic: z33dev33l even ruins the Nokia threads, his favorite manufacturer. How sad.
 

z33dev33l

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Oct 17, 2008
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Man, seriously, do you speak English? Do you realize this is an English forum? Are you slow?

If you claim something to be fact (for example, "the sky is blue"), even if you don't explicitly say "this is fact" afterwards, it doesn't change what you just said. Logic, man. You need some. Seriously. Please, just go and get some.

On topic: z33dev33l even ruins the Nokia threads, his favorite manufacturer. How sad.
Please do stop trolling my threads. I have no problem with your posts but even when I attempt to pay a compliment to an android device you troll me without reason. I'd rather you not let personal attacks and sociological opinions interfere with discussions pertaining to smartphones. I won't be discussing the inconsistencies or flaws in android in this thread, this thread is to pertain to Nokia and last week's event. Of you'd like to create a thread pertaining to said topic then do feel free. This is, in fact, a free forum.