Your battery gauge is lying to you (and it's not such a bad thing)

Toysrme257th

Member
Nov 12, 2009
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For example on my old HTC Imagio:
Currently reporting 36% battery capacity.
DMM on the battery shows 3.760v.

This is perfectly accurate! Let me explain why!
As with most mobile OS's, Windows Mobile 6.5.X warns 10% charge is left in the phone when the battery has 20% SOC left. They cut off at 0% when there is 10% left in the battery. THIS IS GOOD. This keeps your phone from typically being used inside the remaining 20% battery life that quickly kills most chemistry lithium cells.

Whatever the State of Charge (From now own SOC) reported by the os, add 10% to that figure. That's what the battery actually has.

Great read, well thought out and explained.

The only thing I'll add is that while there isn't a "memory affect" on our batteries, it is still recommended to do a full charge/discharge (don't let it get to <5% though) about once every 3 months.
Absolutely NOT TRUE for lion or lipo batteries. The largest four factors in the lifespan & performance of lithium batteries are:

1) Discharging BELOW 20%. This RAPIDLY deteriorates capacity of typical lithium cells. (Stop at 3.2v for lipo)
2) Overcharging, beyond 4.1v (liion) or 4.2v (lipo)
3) Charge state VS age of cell.
Lithium chemistries give the longest lifespan when used & stored at 50% state of charge. The lifespan of the cell is greatly reduced when stored at high, or low capacity. For lipo this would be 3.85v.

There's a reason why hobby people that use lipo's will charge them to 4.2v, while military application lipo's are only 3.92v (and for that mattery NASA's lipo's are only used in a 5-15% window around 50% state of charge!) It greatly extends the effective battery life over the long term!
4) Abusing the C rating of the cell. Either charging OR discharging faster than the battery is designed for.

Keep in mind many smartphones can draw 1amp from batteries that are NOT rated for current draws that high.





To the OP. While the cheap electronics used can & do have some accuracy problems. Everything is done on purpose for battery life issues. High drain electronic devices commonly use batteries that are not up to the C ratings of the devices they're used in. They also tend to be stored incorrectly over long periods of time before the devices are even sold! Plus, in-use the devices tend to be "road hard & put up wet" in nearly all cases.

Devices shy away from using full capacity both low & high for the sake of the long term.
 
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bobby janow

Senior Member
Jun 15, 2010
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I agree with everyone here, great post and great work. I have a question regarding bump charging on the phone. What happens when you charge the battery on an external charger? There really is no "bump" charge per se, it simply charges until full. If I take a fully charged, non bumped battery out of the phone and plug it in to the external, it actually charges for another 15 minutes or so. Would your stats show the same results for a battery charged on the external?

As for the theory of why the phone doesn't fully charge while on, I have my own. Lawyers. With the increased heat and demands on the battery what if they catch your pants on fire as happened some years ago with laptop batteries or an iphone/pod? Bad news and lawsuit supreme. So companies said, while the phone is on (assumption that it's being used) it will not fully charge but will report full so no further charging will be allowed by the hardware. Due dilligence or whatever they call it now in court? Just a theory, I'm not an engineer.
 

bmabry

New member
Nov 14, 2010
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Well if youre looking for a batt fix that fixes this issue, you have to take a look in the Nexus and Desire forums. The Desire has it working for sure and I'm not sure about the Nexus. Unfortunately, their fix cannot be applied to our phones because we use a different battery driver...>.< sucks.

And bump charging works sometimes, idk why people turn off their phone to bump charge, thats actually worse than bump charging it when the phone is on. Bump charging when the phone is on is the best thing, the reason why is because percentage means actually nothing with these phones. THe percentage is read from the batterystats.bin file (I think..), which can easily be manipulated. Bump charging works because it rewrites that file once it hits 100% and at the same time, charges back to the highest voltage possible.

I've been working on a fix for our phones (i personally dont own an Incredible, I own an Evo and they use the same driver) and I'm pretty much close. Been on it 24/7 for the past few weeks and all I have to deal with now is the charger timer that seems to reset at a certain time that I cant seem to find yet. This fix should also calibrate the battery on each charge so that you will no longer need to wipe stats or bump charge or do any of that stuff.
ms79723,

Did you get any further on the fix you mentioned here or did you run into issues?
 

byrong

Senior Member
Jul 9, 2010
695
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East Coast
What happens when you charge the battery on an external charger? There really is no "bump" charge per se, it simply charges until full. If I take a fully charged, non bumped battery out of the phone and plug it in to the external, it actually charges for another 15 minutes or so. Would your stats show the same results for a battery charged on the external?
I don't have an external charger, so I can't comment with any data. My guess is that it probably gives a similar charge to a bump charge, but that's really just a guess.

The great thing about this kind of data collection is that anyone here in the community can try their hand at it: I didn't use any exotic tools. I would encourage you to get a battery monitoring app (like CurrentWidget, but there are plenty of others) and try to gather your own findings. Through a number of trials, you should be able to gather data to compare external charging to other means of charging (just make sure to control for confounding variables as best as possible).
 

spatton

Senior Member
Nov 15, 2010
76
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Marietta, GA
www.scottpatton.com
I picked up a 5000ma New Trent backup unit. If I am going to be abusing my phone - I throw that in my pocket. I also use Ultimate Juice. Now that it has been re-designed, optimized and tuned up -it is GREAT!

Ultimate Juice wont help you one bit if you are using your phone a lot, but if you are driving around, if you are watching TV, if you are just chilllin - it will save you MAD battery.

Scott
 

POQbum

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
1,166
304
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Cheers to the research OP and also helpful post by Toysrme257th on page3.

Gives me more peace of mind that things are working as they should. I got the HTC extended battery so I've always lasted through the day even with heavy use- but always curious why the big drop in the morning.

I think over time the software learns that it is actually starting out with 90% so the drop is less dramatic. Today the big drop was to 94% (yesterday was to 89%), though possible this was because of less use.

This would also mean that really, we are only using 80% of the battery when the phones 'protectors' are on. 10% too high, and 10% too low. Good stuff to know, especially about the anytime charge and not to drain all the way down.
 
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MedleHed

Senior Member
Aug 28, 2010
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Kent, WA
Very helpful! Pretty much solidifies what I already thought about the process. I've been unsuccessfully trying to convince people lithium ion batteries don't have "memory" problems for the past few years.

"With great knowledge comes great power. With great power comes great responsibility."

Now we must go on with our newfound knowledge and teach the world around us!
 

ICEMANN42

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2011
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colchester,ct
People should just get a spare battery charger and charg with that i got one a couple of weeks ago and my battery is much much better stays at 100 with no use for hours its great...... hope this helps.....but its nice to see people doing reserch here......