What the crap is current? Need info on root, bootloader and ROMs for 5.0?

Search This thread

bftb0

Senior Member
Feb 5, 2010
2,594
1,041
As far as it being new information, leave it up to the noob to stumble across it haha.

Well, I went and looked at the exploit code. I am frankly mystified about why your unlock condition was preserved during the "partial firmware" flash.

Based on the way that code operates, what you experienced can not be trusted to occur in a general case and I am not sure if it can even occur in special situations (e.g. flashing the same version of the aboot.mbn bootloader component that was already installed and then unlocked)

Actually, I'm wondering if Odin refused to flash and you didn't notice an error message. But that wouldn't explain the missing twrp recovery, unless Odin only refused to flash the "aboot" partition. That seems hard to believe too.

Oh well - your phone is working and you are happy with it.


good luck

.
 

RaaidR

Senior Member
Jul 22, 2016
60
8
Haha, there was absolutely no error messages, that's the weird part now that you are telling me all of this lol.
 

RaaidR

Senior Member
Jul 22, 2016
60
8
unlocked bootloader == developer edition.

What is known for sure is that the Samsung bootloader (which is actually a whole slew of partitions) enforces an Anti-Rollback policy on the bootloader firmware.

It is actually not known if it would be possible to run a 4.3.x or 4.4.x stock ROM on later versions of bootloader firmware. For instance, if your bootloader firmware was OB6 or OF1 ("5.x") but you flashed stock versions of NC4/NK1 ROM software (4.4.x "boot.img" and "system.img")

Why is it not known? Because AFAIK, no-one has tried it. (Well, actually @ryanbg tried all sorts of dangerous flashing combinations in the old days, but I'm not sure if he published the details). I suspect it would be safe to try these experiments (clean flash of only boot.img and system.img from prior releases) - if and only if you have an unlocked bootloader. (If they don't work, flash something that does; hard to imagine they will cause a hard-bricking on what is a DevEd phone).

So it is probably most accurate to say "we can't flash OB6 or OF1 bootloader firmware back to NC4", but "it's not known if OB6/OF1 bootloader would successfully boot 4.4.x (or even 4.3.x) ROMs" (boot.img + system.img)

I hope that's not too confusing. It's a little subtle, but makes far more sense to anyone who realizes that there are a ton of partitions in these Samsung phones, and that "4.3", "4.4", "5.0" are more closely associated with boot.img and system.img than they are with the (many) bootloader partitions.

So if I chose to use CM13 that runs off of Android 6.0 and the bugs are too much for me, I would not be able to go back to Jasmine 6.1 since it runs off of Android 5.0, right? Or does it just stop you from going from 5.0 back to 4.4?
 

bftb0

Senior Member
Feb 5, 2010
2,594
1,041
So if I chose to use CM13 that runs off of Android 6.0 and the bugs are too much for me, I would not be able to go back to Jasmine 6.1 since it runs off of Android 5.0, right? Or does it just stop you from going from 5.0 back to 4.4?

Neither of those alternatives.

The "AR" (Anti-Rollback) behaviors that are enforced by whatever bootloader version is on your phone (MI9/MJ7/ MJE/NC2/NC4/NK1/OB6/OF1) mostly affects whether you can flash prior versions of bootloader firmware, not "ROM" partitions.**

By ROM I mean:

boot,system,userdata, and cache partitions.

So look, Samsung would obviously prefer that both their bootloader & ROM software stayed in tight lockstep. And that would be the case if there were no rooters/hackers.

But you don't use Odin to install custom ROMs; mostly a customized recovery boot is used, so Odin doesn't get to interfere with that. So the technical issue boils down to these three points:

A) Will the bootloader on the phone successfully be able to successfully load & execute a boot.img (kernel+ramdisk) from a given version of ROM?

B) Will the mysterious TZ (TrustZone) processes associated with the bootloader firmware interoperate correctly with the kernel being booted, when the kernel & TZ might have origins in different releases?

C) Did Samsung plant any logic bombs in their kernels that try to enforce lock-stepping of bootloader release version with kernel release version?

The answers to these questions are not precisely known; empirically it appears that the answer to (C) is "No", and a partial answer to (A) is that the M* series firmware releases are not able to boot N* and O* kernels due to technical reasons, but there isn't (yet) much investigation into whether newer bootloader firmware (N* and O*) can boot older ROMs (backward compatibility). I asked this question the other day, but I guess nobody is interested.

To answer your question more directly though - if you were to flash a 6.0 ROM it will either boot or not depending on the version of the bootloader firmware you are using; and the same thing is true if it were a 5.0 ROM. But the ROMs don't alter the bootloader firmware, so as long as they are both bootable you should be able to go back and forth between them with the appropriate sequences of backup/wipe/restore ***

** The bootloader AR prevention is not strict as in version-by-version. e.g. I believe you can roll backwards and forwards between any of MI9/MJ7/MJE/NC2 (?? & possibly NC4 ??). It might be possible to go back and forth between OB6 & OF1 but I am not sure. There are specific points in the release sequence where AR fuses are blown, preventing rollbacks prior to those specific points... but not at every release.

*** there is no theoretical reason why this is true. There's crap on these stupid Samsung phones which is not reinstalled during ROM flashing or firmware flashing (e.g. efs, pers, persdata partitions and others) containing data that could conceivably go through an irreversible upgrade in format during a ROM upgrade - or get written in a "new" format by later versions of Stock ROMS while they are running, rendering them non-working in prior ROMs. Since Samsung tries to enforce Anti-Rollback, there's no reason these kinds of behaviors could not occur - Samsung isn't engineering things with an expectation of permanent backwards compatibility. So the evidence that this doesn't happen is largely anecdotal - nobody has uncovered buggy behavior that could be tied to such a mechanism.
 
  • Like
Reactions: alexmohr1990

RaaidR

Senior Member
Jul 22, 2016
60
8
In my lust for Marshmellow I went with Temasek's CM13 ( http://xdaforums.com/verizon-galaxy-note-3/development/rom-temaseks-unofficial-build-t3364382 ) And it's working near flawlessly. A little more battery drain than I'm use to, but so far so good. :D Thanks for all the help guys.

I went with CM13 yesterday also, but I went with an older Sprint version that was modded to work in Verizon. It didn't have the GPS issues but I didn't have to download an old Skype apk to get Skype to work, other than that it is also working flawlessly.
 
  • Like
Reactions: alexmohr1990

alexmohr1990

Member
Jun 16, 2013
10
0
unlocked bootloader == developer edition.

So. I've usually seen not equal as =/=, so you're saying in theory DevEd mods (Which don't have a Architecture / Chipset requirement) could potentially work on our now Dev mode N900V's? Not that I looked much into it, or what that may even entail as a year ago a lot of the hacking seemed to gear towards the DevEd. Just curious.

And as I clearly missed the previous discussion on re-flashing I had some troubles with my device being able to transfer files to the SD using TWRP, so I personally had to re-flash stock, boot it, then transfer files (As I didn't have a reader handy), as I had wiped the ROM in hopes to fully clean flash CM13. But I had forgot to add GApps to my SD.

That being said, ODIN'ing back to stock I did lose both root and DevEd, unlike @RaaidR though perhaps Jasmine loads a customized "stock"? Dunno. Honestly didn't even try Jasmine before going balls deep into CM13, as I loved the look of it on a friends device. So far still no woes to report. Except my poor device's internal GPS I think is dead all together. Won't register on stock or any custom. I don't think service is needed for GPS to be enabled? My phone's currently Wifi only.
 

bftb0

Senior Member
Feb 5, 2010
2,594
1,041
So. I've usually seen not equal as =/=, so you're saying in theory DevEd mods (Which don't have a Architecture / Chipset requirement) could potentially work on our now Dev mode N900V's? Not that I looked much into it, or what that may even entail as a year ago a lot of the hacking seemed to gear towards the DevEd. Just curious.

in the C language - the thing the Android kernel and most of the native libraries are written in:
Code:
 a = b;   /* assignment.  set the value of a to be the contents of b */
if (a == b) dothis();  /* test for equality */
if (a != b) dothat();  /* test for inequality */

But what I was saying is that bootloader unlocked phones are functionally identical to Developer Edition phones.

And as I clearly missed the previous discussion on re-flashing I had some troubles with my device being able to transfer files to the SD using TWRP, so I personally had to re-flash stock, boot it, then transfer files (As I didn't have a reader handy), as I had wiped the ROM in hopes to fully clean flash CM13. But I had forgot to add GApps to my SD.

. You could put the SDcard in a PC that has a media reader slot. -OR-
. An IOGear USB 3.0 SDcard adapter key/stick is pretty cheap. (USB 2.0 even cheaper.) -OR-
. TWRP (not the SafeStrap version) fully supports OTG devices and can flash/backup from/to an OTG USB storage device. A OTG cable is even cheaper than the USB SDcard adapter stick. The most expensive item is going to be a big uSD card, say 32 GB. You are going to want that; TWRP backups and Note 3 ROMs are big - 3-8 GB.

reflashing back to stock seems like the long road to doing things.

That being said, ODIN'ing back to stock I did lose both root and DevEd, unlike @RaaidR

What happened to RaaidR (as reported) seems to be logically impossible. The DevEd signature modification occurs in the middle of the aboot partition (not at the end!). The only explanation for his result is either a miracle from the Pope, or more likely the flash never happened.

The DevEd owners had no "unlocking" mechanism available to them. If they overflashed their bootloaders, they instantly and semi-permanently converted their devices to retail. So if you don't want to lose your unlocked bootloader don't flash bootloader firmware!


though perhaps Jasmine loads a customized "stock"?

That's exactly what it does. For Retail/Locked phones it never touches the stock boot partition. (kernel+devicetree+ramdisk). DevEd devices can use a modified boot partition though, and I suppose that's what is done in the multiboot versions of Jasmine, maybe even in the DevEd version.


Dunno. Honestly didn't even try Jasmine before going balls deep into CM13, as I loved the look of it on a friends device. So far still no woes to report. Except my poor device's internal GPS I think is dead all together. Won't register on stock or any custom. I don't think service is needed for GPS to be enabled? My phone's currently Wifi only.

I would read up a little on GPS. By itself, it typically works very poorly indoors, if at all. If aGPS (Assisted GPS) services are not available, a perfectly functioning GPS receiver can take up to 15 minutes to get it's first fix. That's because it takes that long to download the almanac and ephemeris data from the satellites, and it cant do that until it has "found" the satellites by searching through frequency offset space and coding space. Indoors, that problem is even worse because the signals are quite weak, so the problem of "finding" the satellites gets even worse. (But note: that is exactly how stand-alone GPS was designed to work).

I just put my (rooted-stock) Note 3 in Airplane Mode, and then turned WiFi back on (simulate your situation). It seems to be able to download aGPS data over WiFi only. Hopefully your will as well.


Using the "GPS Status & Toolbox" app (MobiWIA - EclipSim) while connected to your WiFi, do this:

Enable
(touch screen) -> Menu -> Settings -> Display & Tools -> Show time to GPS fix
Enable
(touch screen) -> Menu -> Settings -> Background behavior -> Use GPS when screen is off
Then
(touch screen) -> Menu -> Manage A-GPS state -> RESET

you should see two Toast messages appear on your screen, one after the other:

Internal GPS state cleared
GPS Assistance data downloaded

Next ... Take your phone outside where you are standing under an unobstructed sky

and wait. Keep touching the screen to keep it awake. And wait.

Do you see any satellites appear, even if there is no fix yet? If you loiter out there for 10-15 minutes do you get a GPS fix?


Since you are using the device without cell service, if you took the device someplace that is also without WiFi (for instance a car), it could literally take 10-15 minutes to get a first GPS fix. (Usually it will be faster if you download aGPS data - almanac & ephemeris before you leave your WiFi connected goodness. The ephemeris data will stay valid for an hour or so.).

After that first fix a GPS track-recording app meant for off-network usage (hiking or geocacheing apps) will have no problems maintaining a GPS fix, so long as they continue to request GPS updates. You could give the "GPS Essentials" app a try for this - in track recording mode it is constantly asking for GPS position. It can give you a "live map" view using offline maps but I don't believe turn-by-turn navigation.

===>> Don't use Google Maps for GPS testing either on-network or off. (even if you have downloaded an offline map cache). It is known to act in a bizarre fashion on some CM13 builds. This is probably because it switches back and forth between different LocationServices() data sources, and in the time intervals that GPS requests are not being made, the GPS subsystem loses lock.


Hope that helps.
 
Last edited:

ce_lloyd

Member
Oct 6, 2011
34
2
Cedar Rapids
OnePlus 6T
Not intentionally hi-jacking this thread...wait, yes I am! :) You seem pretty knowledgeable so I wanted to ask you if you know if it's possible to update the software on a Verizon Note 3 that is rooted but with a locked bootloader. I am unable to unlock or safestrap the bootloader and am fine with stock and disabling apps but the damn phone keeps asking to update software and then failing presumably because it sees root? Thanks in advance for your advice and any help you can offer.

---------- Post added at 08:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:32 PM ----------

@RaaidR

FWIW, you can also perform a similar "freezing" function by going in to the /system/app folder and doing a

chmod 0000 filename.apk

On the .apk and .odex files you want to freeze. (For all I know that might be the technique that TiBu uses)

Note that since /system is typically mounted read-only, you have to temporarily mount it read-write when doing this. For example, in a terminal emulator:

Code:
su
mount -o remount,rw /system
cd /system/app
chmod 0000 Knox*.apk Knox*.odex
...
cd /
sync
mount -o remount,ro /system
exit
exit

Unless you need to make room inside of /system/app to install other apps (which will then survive a recovery-boot "factory reset"*), there's almost nothing to be gained by actually removing them rather than freezing them. They don't consume any runtime resources and probably don't even affect boot time following a cache/dalvik-cache wipe once they are "frozen".

Here is a list of things I froze in an older stock ROM; mostly to prevent OTA nagging, Knox BS, and some VZW spyware:

ContainerAgent.apk
ContainerAgent.odex
ContainerEventsRelayManager.apk
ContainerEventsRelayManager.odex
FWUpgrade.apk
FWUpgrade.odex
KLMSAgent.apk
KLMSAgent.odex
KNOXAgent.apk
KNOXAgent.odex
KNOXStore.apk
KNOXStore.odex
KnoxAttestationAgent.apk
KnoxAttestationAgent.odex
LocalFOTA.apk
SDM.apk
SDM.odex
VMS.apk

This post (from 4.3) has a more extensive list of debloating; I haven't used it so I can't vouch for it.

*some market apps don't seem to behave correctly when you drop their .apk into /system/app, so ymmv on this style of hack.

@alexmohr1990

Sorry for the small tangent/thread-jack.

If you like solid, bugfree performance, stick with rooted stock (but kill off stuff you dont want to be running via freezing and Android's built in app "Disable" feature in Settings==>Application manager)

Frankly, the only things you need to "freeze" are apps that do not appear in the Application manager - e.g. stuff like Verizon spyware (VMS.apk) and Knox crapola. For anything that shows up in the App manager, you can use the "Disable" feature. (TiBu "freezing" pre-dates
the appearance of the app Disable feature in Stock Android, so a lot of long time users of TiBu don't seem to be aware of Android's now built in app disable feature)

Can't help with the carrier stuff; I've only been on Verizon.

good luck

Not intentionally hi-jacking this thread...wait, yes I am! You seem pretty knowledgeable so I wanted to ask you if you know if it's possible to update the software on a Verizon Note 3 that is rooted but with a locked bootloader. I am unable to unlock or safestrap the bootloader and am fine with stock and disabling apps but the damn phone keeps asking to update software and then failing presumably because it sees root? Thanks in advance for your advice and any help you can offer.
 

Top Liked Posts

  • There are no posts matching your filters.
  • 1
    I've been going through posts around here. I'm currently on OF1, but I see a ton of concerns on the OneClick method, reports of success being across the board. I'm confused on how we're not consistent on one method. But! That's my question - Which has most success / is most reliable? Opinions? I'd love direct links to the ones you prefer.

    What bootstrap is current? I see TWRP is still on 4.3/4.4, and Safestrap apparently lost development? What are people using? I'm currently on 5.0 OF1 without root or bootstrap.

    ..And I saw something about unlocking the bootloader? The phone is recognized as a dev version afterword? Does this allow us to freely install whatever bootstrap we desire? I'd prefer to get TWRP if I can. I've got no fear of ODIN'ing the crap out of this thing.

    I've seen comments all over the board on what ROMs work. Like, I can't seem to find much commonality from post to post. I'm a go-for-stable type of person. I adore stock, and don't need fluff. But the thing I do need ( If anyone can advise ) is to crack open this N900V to work on Straighttalk. This phone currently isn't active, and I've already got a Straight-talk SIM. Without any of this modding the SIM is "Unrecognized" per the phone, and I'm unable to change APN settings.

    So if there are common setups to flash, I'd love a link to a Modem / GApps typically flashed if needed. Another love would be to get a CM13 (Or Any CM really, I saw CM11 for unlocked bootloader?) variant running, but again, opinions seem to be varied.

    Any suggestions, opinions, directions, or guides welcome!

    Thanks in advance.

    I will say in advance that this phone was my first time going thru any of this, so take what I have to say with a grain of salt if you would like. I have been rooted for about a week, unlocked bootloader and flashed Jasmine 6.1 rom yesterday.



    I tried using this method of root for a few days with no results (http://xdaforums.com/verizon-galaxy-note-3/general/ob6-of1-n900v-note-3-verizon-oneclick-t3333569). I tried on multiple computers running Windows 7 x64 with no luck. It would start the process, but would never reboot my phone into download mode.

    After failing at that, I ended up trying this method with both computers running Win 7 x64 (http://xdaforums.com/verizon-galaxy-note-3/general/root-n900v-5-0-of1-one-click-t3330098) since there were multiple posts saying that it worked for them using Win 7 and running as admin. It would reboot my phone and then the computer program would freeze before the phone would start to download. I ended up taking the free Win 10 update on the wife's laptop and tried again. Phone was rooted in about 90 seconds. All I did was download KEIS and install the drivers it had, then try the program again. Worked flawlessly.

    I followed this (http://xdaforums.com/verizon-galaxy-note-3/general/how-to-unlock-verizon-galaxy-note-3-t3360309) to unlock my bootloader. The one exception, is that I followed a YouTube video on how to do it by using a Terminal Emulator on the phone rather than via PC. In the video the guy adds "samsung" to a couple places in the code, but I did not. I followed the code exactly as is in the post I linked and it worked.

    To install TWRP via FlashFire, you have to unlock bootloader. Once you unlock the bootloader, FlashFire will give you an option to download and flash TWRP.
    1
    @RaaidR

    FWIW, you can also perform a similar "freezing" function by going in to the /system/app folder and doing a

    chmod 0000 filename.apk

    On the .apk and .odex files you want to freeze. (For all I know that might be the technique that TiBu uses)

    Note that since /system is typically mounted read-only, you have to temporarily mount it read-write when doing this. For example, in a terminal emulator:

    Code:
    su
    mount -o remount,rw /system
    cd /system/app
    chmod 0000 Knox*.apk Knox*.odex
    ...
    cd /
    sync
    mount -o remount,ro /system
    exit
    exit

    Unless you need to make room inside of /system/app to install other apps (which will then survive a recovery-boot "factory reset"*), there's almost nothing to be gained by actually removing them rather than freezing them. They don't consume any runtime resources and probably don't even affect boot time following a cache/dalvik-cache wipe once they are "frozen".

    Here is a list of things I froze in an older stock ROM; mostly to prevent OTA nagging, Knox BS, and some VZW spyware:

    ContainerAgent.apk
    ContainerAgent.odex
    ContainerEventsRelayManager.apk
    ContainerEventsRelayManager.odex
    FWUpgrade.apk
    FWUpgrade.odex
    KLMSAgent.apk
    KLMSAgent.odex
    KNOXAgent.apk
    KNOXAgent.odex
    KNOXStore.apk
    KNOXStore.odex
    KnoxAttestationAgent.apk
    KnoxAttestationAgent.odex
    LocalFOTA.apk
    SDM.apk
    SDM.odex
    VMS.apk

    This post (from 4.3) has a more extensive list of debloating; I haven't used it so I can't vouch for it.

    *some market apps don't seem to behave correctly when you drop their .apk into /system/app, so ymmv on this style of hack.

    @alexmohr1990

    Sorry for the small tangent/thread-jack.

    If you like solid, bugfree performance, stick with rooted stock (but kill off stuff you dont want to be running via freezing and Android's built in app "Disable" feature in Settings==>Application manager)

    Frankly, the only things you need to "freeze" are apps that do not appear in the Application manager - e.g. stuff like Verizon spyware (VMS.apk) and Knox crapola.

    Can't help with the carrier stuff; I've only been on Verizon.

    good luck

    I went with Jasmine 6.1 so that I could use the Xposed software since it requires a deodexed rom.........stock rom isn't deodexed from what I read.

    Also, I read a few list's like that, but wasn't sure on how much I could screw up in 5.0 since the list's were from previous versions of Android.
    1
    @RaaidR : This is the type of post I'm looking for. I've been ROMing since a Droid 2, but never hadid as much trouble as this silly vzw version note. Thanks!
    @bftb0 Well. Typically I would stay stock. But even stock has anyone crafted an unofficial stock higher than 5.0? I saw something about s7 firmware. I did recently install CM13 for a friend on a S4. Made me super jelly and wanted to try it. My biggest concern is getting this thing unlocked to the point I can use preferably LTE on straighttalk. So I definitely need to be able to modify apn settings, but unlocking is a point I've never dived into, much less on such a difficult model.

    You are welcome. If you run across any issues, I might be able to help, but my knowledge is limited. Good luck going forward, let me know how it works out for you.
    1
    Jasmine 6.1 comes with Xposed infused and is very close to stock rom from what I have experienced so far and from what others have said about it. As far as Developer Roms go, that I can't tell you much about that. I went straight to Jasmine because from everything I have read it seems to be the most stable of what is out there. Hopefully somebody on here can give you some different options. If you decide to go with Jasmine, make sure to remember to flash the partial firmware thru Odin after flashing the rom.
    1
    Edit: For Jasmine... It makes note of a retail version and developer version... Are we technically on the dev version after the unlock? I didn't see a mention to tell the difference.

    unlocked bootloader == developer edition.

    Having a "DevEd" device means that the bootloader will no long prevent you from booting unsigned "bootable" partitions (boot and recovery). And, also that Odin no longer requires things flashed in the AP slot such as boot.img, recovery.img, and system.img to be Samsung signed.

    The implications is that the "Retail" version of Jasmine is required to use the pure stock boot image, and no custom recovery, whereas the DevEd version can do one or both. Small mods of the boot.img blob are the most likely.


    Noting that the "boot.img" binary blob is actually three separate pieces:

    boot.img = kernel + ramdisk + devicetree

    I can't tell you if the DevEd version of Jasmine modifies the stock kernel, the ramdisk, or the device treee (or any combination thereof). Intuition tells me that mods of the devicetree are highly unlikely and small mods of the ramdisk are the most likely. Is the kernel modded? I don't know, you'll have to dig into that thread to find out.

    Practically speaking, having only a single boot which is rooted is a bit of a hazard, but it is far more of a hazard if the bootloader is still locked. If that one boot/ROM started boot-looping after a broken modification by the owner, the only recourse is to go back to pure stock using Odin and start re-rooting. With an unlocked bootloader, in principle you could install a custom recovery (flashing it with Odin) at any time, so a 2nd independent, rooted custom boot/recovery is available to perform system maintenance.

    So you can use either the DevEd version or the Retail version on an unlocked phone. Probably you should dig in to the Jasmine thread to find out if the differences between the two are compelling to you based on whatever it is you want your phone to do.

    good luck

    PS. See this very nearly identical inquiry & reply in the Q&A Forum, especially the remarks about "partial firmware flashing". You do not want to over-flash your unlocked bootloader.




    ---------- Post added at 11:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:08 PM ----------

    I believe you are not able to downgrade from 5.0 once you go to it, or at least that was my understand pre-root. If that has changed post-root, I cannot say but I didn't attempt it.

    What is known for sure is that the Samsung bootloader (which is actually a whole slew of partitions) enforces an Anti-Rollback policy on the bootloader firmware.

    It is actually not known if it would be possible to run a 4.3.x or 4.4.x stock ROM on later versions of bootloader firmware. For instance, if your bootloader firmware was OB6 or OF1 ("5.x") but you flashed stock versions of NC4/NK1 ROM software (4.4.x "boot.img" and "system.img")

    Why is it not known? Because AFAIK, no-one has tried it. (Well, actually @ryanbg tried all sorts of dangerous flashing combinations in the old days, but I'm not sure if he published the details). I suspect it would be safe to try these experiments (clean flash of only boot.img and system.img from prior releases) - if and only if you have an unlocked bootloader. (If they don't work, flash something that does; hard to imagine they will cause a hard-bricking on what is a DevEd phone).

    So it is probably most accurate to say "we can't flash OB6 or OF1 bootloader firmware back to NC4", but "it's not known if OB6/OF1 bootloader would successfully boot 4.4.x (or even 4.3.x) ROMs" (boot.img + system.img)

    I hope that's not too confusing. It's a little subtle, but makes far more sense to anyone who realizes that there are a ton of partitions in these Samsung phones, and that "4.3", "4.4", "5.0" are more closely associated with boot.img and system.img than they are with the (many) bootloader partitions.